[kaj]

Is there a great difference between the two mentioned rear shocks?
I understand that both are supposed to help a great deal against pedal-bobbing on singlepivot bikes, but are there any differences in reliability, functionality , adjustability, plushness or anything else I should be aware of before buying?

 

[mrbigisbudgood]

Romic - easier to set up, cheaper, reliable, no BS with the Romic

5th - lots of adjutsments, takes air, more $$$, questionable reliability, it's a suspension nerd shock

 

[BlackhillsBob]

the romic is much lighter too!

 

[Echo]

Originally posted by BlackhillsBob
the romic is much lighter too!

It is?

 

[ChrisKring]

Originally posted by mrbigisbudgood
Romic - easier to set up, cheaper, reliable, no BS with the Romic

5th - lots of adjutsments, takes air, more $$$, questionable reliability, it's a suspension nerd shock

Our team had no problems with the reliability of the Fifth all last season. Some people were having problems with the spring collar, however it has been fixed.

As far as adjustments/ease of setup: If you follow the guide to get a starting point, it is easy. Many people are happy with the suggested settings. However, if your like me and like to adjust things to be perfect for the conditions, then you can make some adjstments. It is nice being able to adjust the low speed to high speed compression transition point. This is a big help in balancing pedaling performance with small bump performance.

People are going to tell you that the romic or avalanch are tuned specifically to you. I do not agree that this is possible over the phone. The person tuning it needs to see you ride. Additionally, the terrain makes a difference. There was a big difference between Wisconsin or Big Bear and Mount Snow. I could ride a hardtail at close to the same speed at wisconsin or big bear, try that at mount snow. In conculsion, shocks that are not adjustable are always a compromise. Do you think Bubba runs a non adjustable shock at the MX races? Heck no. Does his mechanic tune the shock over the phone? Heck no.

 

[JJHACK]

I just bought the Romic for my Stinky deelux today. It's a one month wait right now.

I studied them both and read all the reviews. I spoke with about siz guys using them each and figured the Romic was gonna be a huge improvement at about 40% less money then the 5th element.

I'm not competing in high visibility races or worried about the little improvement the 5th might have over the Romic. for me the Romic will do eveything I need for a fair price and not screw up my water bottle holder with the external air chamber which sticks out right in the way of my bottle cage. ( just a joke)

The prices I have seen on the 5th are about 500.00 bucks or a bit less maybe? The Romic can be found for about 300-350 or so. The best guy I spoke with had both on his Bullet each for a short time. He is a competitive DH rider. He chose the Romic over the 5th for the ease of use and durability. That was enough for me. If he can't break it, and it gives him good control for 200 bucks less, I was sold.

 

[BlackhillsBob]

Originally posted by Echo
It is?

It is!

 

[ChrisKring]

Originally posted by BlackhillsBob
It is!

What's the weight on your Romic? What's the eye to eye?

 

[vitox]

Originally posted by Echo
It is?

no


its heavier, its actually only marginally lighter than the avalanche, the 5th is a heavy shock too, actually its twice as heavy as a fox but since it uses much lower rate springs, it gains some terrain.

remember this

a 5th with ti spring weighs around 1oz more than the equivalent (in size and spring rate) fox.

 

[BlackhillsBob]

I was told by Romic (I forgot who) that a Romic shock with a ti spring will weigh about the same as a air shock, while I was there (LBS) one of the employee's said that he didnt realize just how heavy the 5th Element is, it weighs about 1 pound heavyer than a air shock. There is a lot of parts in the 5th, plus theres the piggy back resivor, the shock body is made of cast, and the finsish isnt that good, the Romic is machined, so there is no over casting and can have tighter tolerences.

 

[ChrisKring]

Originally posted by BlackhillsBob
I was told by Romic (I forgot who) that a Romic shock with a ti spring will weigh about the same as a air shock, while I was there (LBS) one of the employee's said that he didnt realize just how heavy the 5th Element is, it weighs about 1 pound heavyer than a air shock. There is a lot of parts in the 5th, plus theres the piggy back resivor, the shock body is made of cast, and the finsish isnt that good, the Romic is machined, so there is no over casting and can have tighter tolerences.

Come on, let's be realistic. A romic coil over weighs a lot more than an air shock. Put it on a scale. By the way, Romic is coming out with a shock with a piggyback resevour. How come?

Also, only the first Fifth Elements were made with cast bodies. Anything you buy now will be forged. A forging is stronger than a casting or machined out of bar stock. Then again, I have never heard of anyone breaking either. The forging does not have porious conditions and has a much better grain structure. Furthermore, critical surfaces are machined on castings or forgings.

I'll take the Progressive over the romic any day.

 

[vitox]

Originally posted by BlackhillsBob
I was told by Romic (I forgot who) that a Romic shock with a ti spring will weigh about the same as a air shock, while I was there (LBS) one of the employee's said that he didnt realize just how heavy the 5th Element is, it weighs about 1 pound heavyer than a air shock. There is a lot of parts in the 5th, plus theres the piggy back resivor, the shock body is made of cast, and the finsish isnt that good, the Romic is machined, so there is no over casting and can have tighter tolerences.

i weighed a romic 9,5 / 3" on my digital gram scale, it had a normal steel 550lbs spring and the weight was over 1200g and actually quite close to 3lbs. a big air shock (none are that big) weighs a quarter of that.

and as for the 5th/romic weight,
a progressive ti spring in 375lbs which is comparable to a normal 500lbs spring (since the 5h uses lighter spring rates) weighs 270g
and the shock body weighs 540, if you put a steel spring which weighs twice as much as the ti, you willl have a progressive 1080g shock in 2,75" stroke,
that would still be at least 100g lighter than a romic and probable more like 150-200g

 

[vitox]

Originally posted by ChrisKring

I'll take the Progressive over the romic any day.

thats a strong statement, ive been inside the romic but not the 5th, ridden the 5th but not the romic so i cant really say too much, but i didnt feel the 5th all that plush. and at least on the v10 i used, when i cranked up the compression adjusters to keep it from bottoming, the stroke was harshened a lot, so, well, im still pondering that one, the romic looks fine from inside and out and the little ive used them i have liked them.

 

[Echo]

Originally posted by ChrisKring
I'll take the Progressive over the romic any day.

For your type of riding perhaps. But they are both excellent shocks, saying one is better for every purpose is kinda silly...

 

[Brian HCM#1]

Originally posted by Echo
For your type of riding perhaps. But they are both excellent shocks, saying one is better for every purpose is kinda silly...

Yep, it also depends on the frame its on, I have a Romic on my single pivot Foes Weasel 2 and it does not feel much different than the original Fox RX.

 

[BlackhillsBob]

Originally posted by ChrisKring
Come on, let's be realistic. A romic coil over weighs a lot more than an air shock. Put it on a scale. By the way, Romic is coming out with a shock with a piggyback resevour. How come?

Also, only the first Fifth Elements were made with cast bodies. Anything you buy now will be forged. A forging is stronger than a casting or machined out of bar stock. Then again, I have never heard of anyone breaking either. The forging does not have porious conditions and has a much better grain structure. Furthermore, critical surfaces are machined on castings or forgings.

I'll take the Progressive over the romic any day.

For starters I never compared a stock Romic to an air shock, I did say a shock with a ti spring, 2nd, this info came from Romic, not my own calc's.
I was just checking out a 03 Heckler that came with a 5th Element shock just a few weeks ago, still has a cast shock, perhaps they are changing over to a machined shock, or maybe the OEM stuff is still cast to save some money.

Myself, I will always take a pure oil shock over an air assisted shock like the 5th, to many verance's for me!

Let me also say, there's no flaming here on my part, I love techno mumbo-jumbo, and if the 5th is a better shock, I might try it one day, I come from the MX school and we just dont really use air that much, I think one reason it exspands when it gets hot, and the extra weight that oil is, is no problem for a 45 hp 250!

 

[mplutodh1]

Originally posted by ChrisKring
People are going to tell you that the romic or avalanch are tuned specifically to you. I do not agree that this is possible over the phone. The person tuning it needs to see you ride. Additionally, the terrain makes a difference. There was a big difference between Wisconsin or Big Bear and Mount Snow. I could ride a hardtail at close to the same speed at wisconsin or big bear, try that at mount snow. In conculsion, shocks that are not adjustable are always a compromise. Do you think Bubba runs a non adjustable shock at the MX races? Heck no. Does his mechanic tune the shock over the phone? Heck no.

Ok, speaking from over 6 years in the dirt bike suspension industry, yes a shock can be setup for a rider over the phone. There are base lines, for someone who races Expert level downhill, weighs 180, rides in the northwest, likes his bike setup super plush and what not, you go from there. Now in your defense, when I say they can be setup over the phone, that doesnt mean the hi/low speed compression or rebound clickers will be perfect, usually they are set mid way. This is where the "cant tune over the phone" comes in. Every shock needs to be dialed in, preload set for proper sag and ride height, rebound and compression change from course to course if you are dialing your suspenion in correctly. Here in Washington a course like Winthrop that is relatively tame (even the new course) might require a few turns stiffer on the compression to allow for better pedaling effeciency, where a course like Schweitzer might require a few clicks the other direction on compression to accomidate for the super rocky small bump hits.

The 5th allows you numerous adjustments, most of which are very useful but I still think there are one or two that are pointless (ie:bottoming point). As far as design goes, I have never seen the internals of a 5th but I have seen the inside of a romic, as far as I am concerned, dont think its the best suspension design, it might work better than the Fox RC or whatever but they would gain from lossing the darn internal resivoir idea, for the most part that idea was dropped in the dirt bike industry years ago, for a good reason, it didnt work as well as resi shocks.

Just my $.02

 

[BlackhillsBob]

Originally posted by mplutodh1
Ok, speaking from over 6 years in the dirt bike suspension industry, yes a shock can be setup for a rider over the phone. There are base lines, for someone who races Expert level downhill, weighs 180, rides in the northwest, likes his bike setup super plush and what not, you go from there. Now in your defense, when I say they can be setup over the phone, that doesnt mean the hi/low speed compression or rebound clickers will be perfect, usually they are set mid way. This is where the "cant tune over the phone" comes in. Every shock needs to be dialed in, preload set for proper sag and ride height, rebound and compression change from course to course if you are dialing your suspenion in correctly. Here in Washington a course like Winthrop that is relatively tame (even the new course) might require a few turns stiffer on the compression to allow for better pedaling effeciency, where a course like Schweitzer might require a few clicks the other direction on compression to accomidate for the super rocky small bump hits.

The 5th allows you numerous adjustments, most of which are very useful but I still think there are one or two that are pointless (ie:bottoming point). As far as design goes, I have never seen the internals of a 5th but I have seen the inside of a romic, as far as I am concerned, dont think its the best suspension design, it might work better than the Fox RC or whatever but they would gain from lossing the darn internal resivoir idea, for the most part that idea was dropped in the dirt bike industry years ago, for a good reason, it didnt work as well as resi shocks.

Just my $.02

Good point, I might add that even in the motocross sceen the shocks are for the most part done over the phone, Im lucky to the point that were I live just about everyone in the shock tuning, and motor tuning bus. is located here, like Pro Curcit and Enzo for example, for most of the worlds motocrosser's they have to ship off the shock and forks by a mail carrier and do the rest by phone, and it really is not rocket sceince, like you mentioned, there are set standards in valving, fisrt they consider the weight of the rider and what type of racing/riding is done. Young King Bubba is in a class by himself in the 125 class, he gets the best tuning that is possible, Kawasaki see's to that, I think that he could finish if not win a race in the 250 class on his 125, as long as RC or Reed wasnt there.

 

[mtnbikej]

The Progressive has all of its adjustments externally. The Romic has its internally. The Progressive you can change on your own. The Romic has to be sent back for major changes. Or so I have been told.

mtnbikej

 

[ChrisRobin]

...plus the Romic have freaky sizes while the 5th comes in stock sizes (maybe someone mentioned this already but when people write large replies, my eyes go fuzzy).