Eff da po-lice some more
- Thread starter MMike
- Start date
"Sir, I'm terrified," Christian Glass told police officers as they demanded he get out of his car. He was right to be.
https://www.stuff.co.nz/world/129909067/how-a-young-kiwi-making-heart-signs-was-shot-dead-by-us-police?cid=app-iPhone
https://www.stuff.co.nz/world/129909067/how-a-young-kiwi-making-heart-signs-was-shot-dead-by-us-police?cid=app-iPhone
That's localish to me and horrific. Couldn't watch the bodycam when they showed the full reel a few days ago.
They just straight up killed him for nothing. It’s simple murder, again.
Not disagreeing with you, but his behaviour was a little ....unusual? Complying with the police's orders and later taking them to court if they overstepped their rights sadly seems to be the way to survive police interactions in the US.
"Sir, I'm terrified,"
When was the last time you were truly afraid? Going to guess that you are not going to act normal. From a neurological stand point, that is pretty much impossible.
I hate the bullshit that nazis spew about "should have complied" or "should have listened" and all that. When you are scared, when you are in a high stress situation, you go into defense modes. The officer can YELL a command, and you do not hear it, or hear it as something else. The guy in the car thinks the person is shouting "get your license" when they are really shouting "stay still". This is human behavior 101 and the idea that someone is going to react "correctly" and "hear" is ludicrous. I've studied this to a large extent in human learning and ergonomics. Perception is a filter that completely changes sensory inputs.
Here is the issue: in the US people are scared when they see the police. That should not be the case!
Playing devil's advocat here. Following your argument that people do not act rational when in stress situations, would this then not justify the overly cautious and prepared-for-everything approach that the US police has? If people act unpredictably, how should the officers know what is the right thing to do? Even the best training cannot prepare for this.
Other question: would the police officers not be able to use the same line of argumentation here? At one point they were scared of the guy and acted irrational and shot him?
To make it clear, I am not defending the police here. No police interaction should end up with injury or the death of people. Somehow this seems to work in most democratic countries besides the US.
Vermont state trooper: "Do you have your pistol?"
Me: "Yes."
Trooper: "Where?"
Me: "In the holster on my right side."
Trooper: "Don't shoot me, OK?"
Me: "Yes."
Trooper: "Where?"
Me: "In the holster on my right side."
Trooper: "Don't shoot me, OK?"
I've told wifey and Haley that if I have a seizure to 1) never call 911 and 2) tell everyone around to not call 911. It's a guaranteed expensive trip to the hospital, which I don't need to go to, and I'm usually confused and disoriented for a few hours. In that condition, the odds of getting shot are way too high.
100%. I tried to fight my Father after my first grand mal. That could have disastrous consequences if the wrong guy responds to the call. There's not a lot they can do for you at the hospital/in the ambulance anyway.
That's BS, it will always be a high stress/scary situation.
Yes, police need methods that reduce the likelihood of harm to individuals based on the stress. In essence, de-escalating and not putting them into "corners"-in a matter of speaking.
only when non-white. I would be too.
Once a cop unfriendlily woke me up while I was sleeping on the back seat of a friends car in Texas only to ask for my inmigration papers (which I understand is illegal), on top of asking for my ID.
Another time, I was removed from the car and my car was searched for 2 hours with dogs for drugs at the mexico-US border (3 south american guys coming back from a road trip to mexico).
My experience with US police has not been the best.
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I've come around with the husband of Wifey's best friend bear hugging me from behind. I was very confused until he clarified that I had a seizure and he'd been holding me for over 5min - 1min of seizure, 4min of confused babble. That's not a good thing in public.
The staff at K1, where we are a LOT, know this. The core group of parents we kart with know this. Haley and Hannah's friends all know this. Anybody that we even semi regularly interact with know this. Even my clients know this.
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Vermont is not perfect, but it's way different than a lot of the U.S. The state police actually struggle to be squeaky clean.
The conversation was in mid-April of 2009. The officer had spoken to me when I was in my totaled car, asked me to come over to his car when the excitement (medics) died down, I told them that I was concerned about leaving my weapon in the car, they told me to bring it along.
We have bad cops and bad departments, but there are and have been statewide efforts to keep things clean.
The fact that I was a white male putting up no fuss certainly helped my situation.
Not in a civilized country. On a motorcycle you get routinely stopped in the spring in Germany because they do measure sound emissions to find offenders with race pipes. I know, for folks in the US it sounds weird if the police does not have to have a reason to stop you. But, on the other hand, you do not automatically walk away with a ticket if they stop you.
I got stopped multiple times and they never ever found something wrong (MC was stock, car was stock and in OK shape too, it just was popular with burglars). All interactions were fairly low key and pretty stress free.
That guy in the example is white, or?
My experience with US police is not good as well. They were afraid and had the hand on the gun all the time...in fucking Corvallis, OR, a town where nobody got shot in the 4 years I lived there. Come to think of it, the police shot a mental ill person because he acted irrational and attacked the offices with a machete. But that was the only gun violence victim.
It's nice that there was/is a cop in vermont that didn't see you as a threat. But your post implies that either this is somehow applicable to what's being discussed in colorado (it isn't) or that vermont is some holy land of policing (it isn't). I've been pulled over and treated well too. I've also had dipshits with badges flip the fuck out and pull guns on me for doing exactly what they asked me to do.
We all can't move to vermont either.
So without additional commentary that post just seems like fantasy land, even if it is something that did happen to you (albeit 13 years ago before killology was a widespread cop training practice). Hence the poke horse.
Here's the lesson our senile fossil of a president took from the george floyd protests
President Biden's anti-crime bill: Will it make America safer?
President Biden's $37 billion anti-crime plan includes funding to hire 100,000 more police. What's actually in the plan?
www.wbur.org
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No, they just do everything possible to not irritate russian autocratic mass murderers.
Randomly pulling you over for no reason isn't exactly what I'd call 'civilized' either.
It's just very civil service.
I personally would call it civilized until threats of violence are made.
May I decline service?
Vermont State Police encourages public to ‘See Something, Say Something’
WATERBURY, Vermont (Friday, Sept. 23, 2022) — The Vermont State Police is joining with the U.S. Department of Homeland Security to encourage Vermonters to report suspicious activity to local authorities as part of the “If You See Something, Say Something” campaign.
The effort to highlight this longstanding initiative comes ahead of the nationwide #SeeSayDay, which DHS has designated for this Sunday, Sept. 25.
DHS says the campaign “is an initiative that encourages individuals across the nation to be the eyes and ears for safer communities. A safe community requires the joint effort of all community members. The more observant and involved individuals are in their daily lives, the less likely crime will occur undetected. If we watch and report suspicious activity, we reduce the areas where criminals feel comfortable committing crimes, resulting in safer towns and cities across the nation.”
In Vermont, people can report suspicious activity by calling 844-84-VTIPS (844-848-8477) or visiting www.vtips.us. In the event of an emergency, call 911.
According to DHS, suspicious activity is any observed behavior that could indicate terrorism or other criminal activity. Examples include:
Unusual items or situations: A vehicle in an odd location, unattended luggage/package, open door/window that’s normally closed and locked, etc.
Eliciting information: Questioning individuals at a level beyond mere curiosity about particular facets of a facility’s or building’s purpose, operations, security, etc.
Observation/surveillance: Unusual attention to facilities or buildings beyond a casual or professional interest. Extended loitering without explanation, particularly in concealed locations with optimal visibility of potential targets. Unusual, repeated, and/or prolonged observation of buildings (e.g., with a video camera or binoculars), taking notes and/or measurements, sketching floor plans.
A handout from DHS on recognizing the signs of terrorism-related suspicious activity is attached to this release. DHS emphasizes that reports should be based only on behavior and not on factors such as race, ethnicity, national origin, religious affiliation, the exercise of free speech, etc.
People should report suspicious activity to a person in authority, such as a police officer, or by calling a local law enforcement agency or a tipline. “Don’t be afraid to report something, even if you aren’t sure it was serious,” DHS says.
WHAT TO REPORT:
WHAT did you observe? Be specific.
WHO did you see?
WHEN did you see it?
WHERE did you see this occur?
WHY is it suspicious?
Again, the contact information for people in Vermont to report suspicious activity is 844-84-VTIPS (844-848-8477) or online at www.vtips.us.
WATERBURY, Vermont (Friday, Sept. 23, 2022) — The Vermont State Police is joining with the U.S. Department of Homeland Security to encourage Vermonters to report suspicious activity to local authorities as part of the “If You See Something, Say Something” campaign.
The effort to highlight this longstanding initiative comes ahead of the nationwide #SeeSayDay, which DHS has designated for this Sunday, Sept. 25.
DHS says the campaign “is an initiative that encourages individuals across the nation to be the eyes and ears for safer communities. A safe community requires the joint effort of all community members. The more observant and involved individuals are in their daily lives, the less likely crime will occur undetected. If we watch and report suspicious activity, we reduce the areas where criminals feel comfortable committing crimes, resulting in safer towns and cities across the nation.”
In Vermont, people can report suspicious activity by calling 844-84-VTIPS (844-848-8477) or visiting www.vtips.us. In the event of an emergency, call 911.
According to DHS, suspicious activity is any observed behavior that could indicate terrorism or other criminal activity. Examples include:
Unusual items or situations: A vehicle in an odd location, unattended luggage/package, open door/window that’s normally closed and locked, etc.
Eliciting information: Questioning individuals at a level beyond mere curiosity about particular facets of a facility’s or building’s purpose, operations, security, etc.
Observation/surveillance: Unusual attention to facilities or buildings beyond a casual or professional interest. Extended loitering without explanation, particularly in concealed locations with optimal visibility of potential targets. Unusual, repeated, and/or prolonged observation of buildings (e.g., with a video camera or binoculars), taking notes and/or measurements, sketching floor plans.
A handout from DHS on recognizing the signs of terrorism-related suspicious activity is attached to this release. DHS emphasizes that reports should be based only on behavior and not on factors such as race, ethnicity, national origin, religious affiliation, the exercise of free speech, etc.
People should report suspicious activity to a person in authority, such as a police officer, or by calling a local law enforcement agency or a tipline. “Don’t be afraid to report something, even if you aren’t sure it was serious,” DHS says.
WHAT TO REPORT:
WHAT did you observe? Be specific.
WHO did you see?
WHEN did you see it?
WHERE did you see this occur?
WHY is it suspicious?
Again, the contact information for people in Vermont to report suspicious activity is 844-84-VTIPS (844-848-8477) or online at www.vtips.us.
Yes it is. It speaks to how broken we have become subsequent to the attack on the World Trade Center.
"Lawyer for LAPD officer killed during training exercise by other cops says dead cop was investigating a gang rape by four cops at least one of whom was there when he was beaten to death."
The fuck kind of training exercise is happening where someone gets beaten to death?
Edit: Found it further down. "simulated mob attack". Not so simulated I guess.
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When you train cops to look the other way when other cops commit crimes. AKA the selective enforcement class.
even the police aren't safe from the policeThe fuck kind of training exercise is happening where someone gets beaten to death?
Edit: Found it further down. "simulated mob attack". Not so simulated I guess.
Defund the police?
hrug:
Former San Antonio officer who shot teen in McDonald’s parking lot is arrested
James Brennand, who was fired by the San Antonio Police Department last week, was arrested on two counts of aggravated assault. He has been released on bond.
200k bond btw, think he is scared to go inside? lolFormer San Antonio officer who shot teen in McDonald’s parking lot is arrested
James Brennand, who was fired by the San Antonio Police Department last week, was arrested on two counts of aggravated assault. He has been released on bond.www.nbcnews.com
VSP BCI Troop A West – Williston / Simple assault involving member of law enforcement
Silverman, Adam via DPS.VSPMedia <dps.vspmedia@list.vermont.gov>
11:28 AM (1 hour ago)
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STATE OF VERMONT
DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC SAFETY
VERMONT STATE POLICE
CASE#: 22A1005125
RANK/TROOPER FULL NAME: Detective Sgt. Daniel Trottier
STATION: VSP Bureau of Criminal Investigation Troop A-West – Williston
CONTACT#: 802-878-7111
DATE/TIME: Aug. 7, 2022, at about 2:10 p.m.
INCIDENT LOCATION: Franklin County Sheriff’s Department, Lake Street, St. Albans, VT
VIOLATION: Simple assault
ACCUSED: John Grismore
AGE: 49
CITY, STATE OF RESIDENCE: Fairfax, VT
VICTIM: Jeremy Burrows
AGE: 42
CITY, STATE OF RESIDENCE: Winooski, VT
SUMMARY OF INCIDENT:
Following an investigation that began in early August, the Vermont State Police on Friday, Oct. 21, 2022, cited John Grismore, 49, of Fairfax on a charge of simple assault arising from his conduct with a man in custody at the Franklin County Sheriff’s Department, which employed Grismore at the time as a captain.
Investigation by the Vermont State Police determined that two members of the Sheriff’s Department, Deputies Karry Andileigh and Christopher Major, had arrested Jeremy Burrows, 42, of Winooski on the afternoon of Aug. 7 at the home of a relative in Franklin County. Burrows was taken for processing to the Sheriff’s Department, where Grismore was working. While at the facility, Burrows, who was intoxicated, became non-compliant despite being handcuffed and shackled, and had fallen while trying to walk away from a bench where he was secured. While Deputies Andileigh and Major worked to control Burrows, Grismore repeatedly kicked Burrows in the midsection. The deputies subsequently expressed concerns about the use of force and reported the incident to their chain of command. Sheriff Roger Langevin on Aug. 11, 2022, requested the Vermont State Police open an investigation.
As part of the investigation, the Vermont State Police reviewed body-camera footage and conducted interviews with the involved parties. Upon completion, the case was reviewed by Grand Isle County State’s Attorney Douglas DiSabito after the Franklin County State’s Attorney’s Office recused itself from the matter. This week, following review of the case materials submitted by the Vermont State Police, SA DiSabito determined that probable cause existed to charge Grismore with simple assault.
Grismore was cited through his attorney on Friday morning, Oct. 21, 2022. His arraignment is scheduled for 1 p.m. Monday, Oct. 24, in the Criminal Division of Vermont Superior Court in St. Albans.
The Vermont State Police is unable to provide further information at this time. The affidavit of probable cause will be filed with the court and made public following Grismore’s arraignment. Members of the media should call the Court Clerk’s Office to confirm details of the hearing.
COURT ACTION: Yes
COURT DATE/TIME: 1 p.m. Monday, Oct. 24, 2022
Silverman, Adam via DPS.VSPMedia <dps.vspmedia@list.vermont.gov>
11:28 AM (1 hour ago)
to DPS Unsubscribe
STATE OF VERMONT
DEPARTMENT OF PUBLIC SAFETY
VERMONT STATE POLICE
CASE#: 22A1005125
RANK/TROOPER FULL NAME: Detective Sgt. Daniel Trottier
STATION: VSP Bureau of Criminal Investigation Troop A-West – Williston
CONTACT#: 802-878-7111
DATE/TIME: Aug. 7, 2022, at about 2:10 p.m.
INCIDENT LOCATION: Franklin County Sheriff’s Department, Lake Street, St. Albans, VT
VIOLATION: Simple assault
ACCUSED: John Grismore
AGE: 49
CITY, STATE OF RESIDENCE: Fairfax, VT
VICTIM: Jeremy Burrows
AGE: 42
CITY, STATE OF RESIDENCE: Winooski, VT
SUMMARY OF INCIDENT:
Following an investigation that began in early August, the Vermont State Police on Friday, Oct. 21, 2022, cited John Grismore, 49, of Fairfax on a charge of simple assault arising from his conduct with a man in custody at the Franklin County Sheriff’s Department, which employed Grismore at the time as a captain.
Investigation by the Vermont State Police determined that two members of the Sheriff’s Department, Deputies Karry Andileigh and Christopher Major, had arrested Jeremy Burrows, 42, of Winooski on the afternoon of Aug. 7 at the home of a relative in Franklin County. Burrows was taken for processing to the Sheriff’s Department, where Grismore was working. While at the facility, Burrows, who was intoxicated, became non-compliant despite being handcuffed and shackled, and had fallen while trying to walk away from a bench where he was secured. While Deputies Andileigh and Major worked to control Burrows, Grismore repeatedly kicked Burrows in the midsection. The deputies subsequently expressed concerns about the use of force and reported the incident to their chain of command. Sheriff Roger Langevin on Aug. 11, 2022, requested the Vermont State Police open an investigation.
As part of the investigation, the Vermont State Police reviewed body-camera footage and conducted interviews with the involved parties. Upon completion, the case was reviewed by Grand Isle County State’s Attorney Douglas DiSabito after the Franklin County State’s Attorney’s Office recused itself from the matter. This week, following review of the case materials submitted by the Vermont State Police, SA DiSabito determined that probable cause existed to charge Grismore with simple assault.
Grismore was cited through his attorney on Friday morning, Oct. 21, 2022. His arraignment is scheduled for 1 p.m. Monday, Oct. 24, in the Criminal Division of Vermont Superior Court in St. Albans.
The Vermont State Police is unable to provide further information at this time. The affidavit of probable cause will be filed with the court and made public following Grismore’s arraignment. Members of the media should call the Court Clerk’s Office to confirm details of the hearing.
COURT ACTION: Yes
COURT DATE/TIME: 1 p.m. Monday, Oct. 24, 2022