or sailing in the summer
Eliminator to Olympics over Downhill?
- Thread starter MDJ
- Start date
yeah, but the group of people watching sailing is way bigger then DH biking, and the amount of money in sailing is orders of magnitudes more then DH biking. Hell, their are companies putting their teams on boats that probably cost more then the entire cost of the DH circuit.
Lets face a couple of facts: DH mountain biking will never be an olympic sport due to location - its infrequent that the olympics are held in a city anywhere near a mountain with the capabilities to host an olympic level event. And we would probably be very disappointed with results if it became one. People complain about races like canberra and SA. We would get a whole lot more of those (probably substantially worse for the most part). Not only that, people would see a bunch of dudes dressed up in moto gear and think "huh, why aren't they just riding dirt bikes? They could do much bigger jumps..."
While its cool to get world wide recognition for athletic ability and degree of difficulty for your sport (and not having to explain what it is when you meet somebody who doesn't bike), I recognize that it requires a ton of technical and physical ability, and as long as the competition isn't suffering for lack of attention then I'm a happy camper. With 5-8 WC races every season +champs, typically all held at top notch Dh trails, I don't think competition is suffering too much. With how much variability there is in a trail, line choice, changing conditions, its pretty clear competition is at a high level when the top ten riders are typically separated by 2-5 seconds.
To recap: competition isn't suffering for lack of olympics, there is no money in DH biking, the trails would probably be decently made, but usually be on sh1tty mountains or mountains ill equipped to host an olympic event, and the MTB venue would be nowhere near the actual olympic venue. Also, there is no money in DH biking, and you're average viewer will see it as a more boring but slightly less trashy moto clone.
this. the funding for a sailing team is several orders of magnitude higher than that of a DH team...
http://www.sfexaminer.com/local/2012/04/oracle-racing-help-build-expensive-america-s-cup-boat
[edit] the smaller boats cost a million bucks+ [edit]
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That's a lot of writing for a bunch of assumptions.
If you build it, they will come. How many people Bobsleigh? How many people row? How many people partake in GS skiing? Yet they still come out in droves to watch them.
DH would be the most exciting event to watch on TV in the summer olympics, bar none. Anyone who can't see the viability in the sport attracting crowds if it were put on an olympic scheduale is covering their eyes. It would be the FASTEST summer olympic sport and the most DANGEROUS summer olympic sport, and at the end of the day that's all that crowds want to see. Speed and guys taking risks involving skill. It's a no brainer that it would generate as much layman interest as XC racing, road racing, track (which blows, sorry Specialdevice, track is just boring). These all get views. DH would bring speed and excitement into the summer olympics that it lacks.
There are more reasons than 'interest' for it not being in the olympics. UCI stonewalling DH, location, and cost are actual reasons. Not interest, because it would generate more views than 90% of what they call 'sport' in that sham called the summer olympics.
At the end of the day though, who cares. We already have a great circut and the guys are starting to get paid more and there is increasing interest from outside sponsors.
If you build it, they will come. How many people Bobsleigh? How many people row? How many people partake in GS skiing? Yet they still come out in droves to watch them.
DH would be the most exciting event to watch on TV in the summer olympics, bar none. Anyone who can't see the viability in the sport attracting crowds if it were put on an olympic scheduale is covering their eyes. It would be the FASTEST summer olympic sport and the most DANGEROUS summer olympic sport, and at the end of the day that's all that crowds want to see. Speed and guys taking risks involving skill. It's a no brainer that it would generate as much layman interest as XC racing, road racing, track (which blows, sorry Specialdevice, track is just boring). These all get views. DH would bring speed and excitement into the summer olympics that it lacks.
There are more reasons than 'interest' for it not being in the olympics. UCI stonewalling DH, location, and cost are actual reasons. Not interest, because it would generate more views than 90% of what they call 'sport' in that sham called the summer olympics.
At the end of the day though, who cares. We already have a great circut and the guys are starting to get paid more and there is increasing interest from outside sponsors.
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someone died racing skeleton in vancouver. when was the last time someone died at a dh race?
also, the point isn't to have dangerous events in the olympics. if that were the case, we'd have events like volcano unicycling and grizzly bear fighting.
but only because syncro swimming is in the Olympics. If the roles were reversed, I'm sure there'd be a fair few followers of DH MTB. I think it might have broader appeal too (though it's hard to underestimate the . Also, if DH skiing is in the olympics I can't really see any valid argument being brought against DH MTB being an Olympic sport.
that being said, I'm not sure it would benefit the sport to be an olympic discipline, with all the political nastiness the UCI and IOC bring to the table...
that's just circular logic.
even without the olympics, world cup skiing is order of magnitudes more popular than dh racing. go google up some youtube videos of would cup ski events, spectators are packed in like sardines. there's likely more spectators at a single would cup ski event than all the spectators in an entire season of UCI dh racing.
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The *point* is that it's exciting to watch. More exciting than just about every other summer olympic sport, and that's what summer is lacking what the winter olympics has. If they brought it in, you would see the same crowds along the course. I don't see how anyone can fail to see it's just a 'if you build it' type thing. Crowds go watch ANYTHING at the olympics. why would the fastest, most 'extreme' event not be watched? Sorry, but it's just typical RM banter about how small our sport is, when in reality it's all MTB and it's a HUGE sport when you realize that the fans and spectators now are all just cyclists from various walks of life, not all 'gnar bro' kids that litter forums.
And people have died DH'ing, just not at the WC level.
I guess what I'm trying to convey, is if 'XC Eliminator' was brought in over DH, heads should roll. DH would, without a doubt, draw more interest from both specators and outside groups. DH is still 'cool' believe it or not, while XC hasn't been cool since the 80s. If the playing field was equal (that being, DH and XC in the olympics), I'd make a $20 bet with you that more marketing money would flow into DH because it's more exciting to watch. Just look at half pipe and how that 'silly little sport' that only attracts groms and accounts for what, 1% of snowboarders did. It became the ****ing main event.
And people have died DH'ing, just not at the WC level.
I guess what I'm trying to convey, is if 'XC Eliminator' was brought in over DH, heads should roll. DH would, without a doubt, draw more interest from both specators and outside groups. DH is still 'cool' believe it or not, while XC hasn't been cool since the 80s. If the playing field was equal (that being, DH and XC in the olympics), I'd make a $20 bet with you that more marketing money would flow into DH because it's more exciting to watch. Just look at half pipe and how that 'silly little sport' that only attracts groms and accounts for what, 1% of snowboarders did. It became the ****ing main event.
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Well, A) skeleton is a winter sport and B) it was a ludge slider.
Whitout doubt, DHing would be the most dangerous summer sport.
you're really overestimating the size of the mtb world when compared to road cycling & road racing. Road racing is just massive. Absolutely massive. It's so large that it can support not one, but two off season world cup series - track and cyclocross. And cyclocross has more world cup races as an off-season series than DH does during the regular season.
I agree. But don't think that those same 'fans' wouldn't go watch people hurl themselves down a mountain once their event is over. It's cross over as far as I'm concerned, and I think once the medium is in place for anyone to watch it, interest would spike.
The real problem, imo, is the fallout when more kids get into it...
The real problem, imo, is the fallout when more kids get into it...
why do people think the highest goal for our sport should be being part of a massively corrupt organization that puts huge debt and burden on the cities, and countries the games are held in? the UCI is already a **** show of corruption and now you want to get in with the IOC? Eff that Sh!t. I just don't see why we need to be a part of that.
One actually: dressage
Maybe because we want to see DH'ers on PEDs?
Or, we want to see how full we can get the resorts and how many braking bumps we can get on trails?
In seriousness though, I think the only advantage is for the athletes themselves. I can see more money coming in, and the ability to win an Olympic medal which seems to be high on an athletes list of things to do. Other than that I can't see benefits to it.
Or, we want to see how full we can get the resorts and how many braking bumps we can get on trails?
In seriousness though, I think the only advantage is for the athletes themselves. I can see more money coming in, and the ability to win an Olympic medal which seems to be high on an athletes list of things to do. Other than that I can't see benefits to it.
why do people think that since we enjoy downhill racing that everyone else will find it so exciting as well?
Many many many many of my non biking friends have come over and watched about 30 seconds of the 2011 freecaster DH series video and walked away not amused....and these are guys who own highly modified jeeps, rock buggies, fast boats, motorcycles and have ridden bikes at some point in their lives......
Many many many many of my non biking friends have come over and watched about 30 seconds of the 2011 freecaster DH series video and walked away not amused....and these are guys who own highly modified jeeps, rock buggies, fast boats, motorcycles and have ridden bikes at some point in their lives......
Your friends sound lame.... even my photographer fiance watched them, and she doesn't ride...
and, how many people watched the superbowl that actualy play football?
How many people race Grand Slalom, or ride half pipe?
Strawman...
and, how many people watched the superbowl that actualy play football?
How many people race Grand Slalom, or ride half pipe?
Strawman...
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How about Enduro on the Olympics?
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this.
Ummmm....lame they may be, but I think the point remains that DH is very interesting and exciting to us, but not necessarily the masses.
Crazy talk, defo horse dancing
this. do you know how popular biathlon is in germany? its marketable, like skijumping, yet not many people participate in these sports. you just need to sell it right and people will watch it
I for one oppose any ideas about making DH an Olympic sport. Douchebags in this sport have been reasonably kept at bay and I want it to stay that way.
I think that I would like to keep our sport the way it is. Drugs of choice being weed and beer. KTHX? Bye!
I think that I would like to keep our sport the way it is. Drugs of choice being weed and beer. KTHX? Bye!
Part of me would like to see it in the Olympics due to the exposure for the sport and athletes, and it would be the most exciting sport to watch. The other part doesn't want to see it fall under the umbrella of the corrupt and money hunger IOC.
Not all Olympic events are held in the host city. When the Sydney Olympics were on they held soccer matches in most capital cities due to infrastructure demands. However the majority of events were held in the host city.
All I want to see is DH break away from the UCI and form their own governing body. I can;t see this happening though as the main manufacturers in DH also have their hands in road cycling and wouldn't want to upset Phat McQuaid.
Not all Olympic events are held in the host city. When the Sydney Olympics were on they held soccer matches in most capital cities due to infrastructure demands. However the majority of events were held in the host city.
All I want to see is DH break away from the UCI and form their own governing body. I can;t see this happening though as the main manufacturers in DH also have their hands in road cycling and wouldn't want to upset Phat McQuaid.
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Forget the argument about DH in the Olympics for a minute.
Just the fact the the UCI would consider Eliminator Olympics worthy after a couple of really lame races is the interesting part of the story. How many people have ever raced an Eliminator - 10? How many people actually watched - 11? And now they think it should be an Olympic sport?
Just the fact the the UCI would consider Eliminator Olympics worthy after a couple of really lame races is the interesting part of the story. How many people have ever raced an Eliminator - 10? How many people actually watched - 11? And now they think it should be an Olympic sport?
Thanks for steering me back on topic I hopped on my soapbox. Agreed, it is bizarre the UCI would consider this but according to the rhetoric they didn't want additional athletes. Is the Eliminator discipline where the UCI sees the future, surely not. I just sit back and shake my head at the continued level of poor decisions coming out of the governing body of cycling.
Have the DH MTB in the Olympics the same as the skiing a super G race, giant slalom, and a bad ass mogul field with a huge jump in the middle
I find this interesting as well. It's pretty lame. They went a step in the right directing bringing bmx in but this is going backwards. Bringing another discipline entirely would be the right move, I.e. 4x or DH.
DH might not ever make it as a summer Olympic sport, solely on the location issue alone. They would have to change the host city to forever be close to a viable mountain with a viable venue. 4x would be a logistically more feasible option, but who cares about 4x
really? wow. clearly i am out of the loop. i don't even know where the loop is.
Windsurfing. What's the funding in there? Not to mention most olympic sports that are on location have as little funding as dh, sometimes less
Aaron Gwin has won the majority of the races of the races in the past 2 years, i think 8/12? and been on the podium at every other one save the single one he opted not to race due to injury (and the fact that he'd already wrapped up the overall). He is definitively the best DH racer in the world right now, and he's from California.
I'd watch olympic "enduro" (the euro version run like a rally) ages before I ever watched the olympic xc format. Yawn. Hey guys, it's mountain biking, can we have some rocks and ****?How about Enduro on the Olympics?
So he is the one decent athlete that Transcend was referring to?
i did see a bunch of rocks this past summer, but they were lining the sidewalk next to the course
A note though-
For every person I've read bemoaning the lack of technicality of the London course on the internet I've heard 2 people in real life say that they were blown away by the quality of the coverage and the compelling racing they saw.
Those people ran the gamut from 30 year+ bike shop owners, 18 year old bmx racers and non-cyclists in their 40's.
Let's stop pretending that we need XC racing to resemble standard-issue mountainbiking or the recreational sport and instead pretend that it's a highly-evolved sport that is divorced from the "trail-experience". Just like XC skiing is from DH skiing and all of it is divorced from hunting reindeer in Lapland.
Stuff that is pretty weaksauce, technically, can make for some pretty compelling TV and, ultimately, that's what our Pro XC racers need- viewer numbers so they can get $$.
tangent:
semi-related rock-less UCI dirt-sport that can look pretty sweet if properly presented:
I agree with you. I'd bet most people knocking it didn't actually watch. It was about as interesting as XC racing can be made to be.
As for the course, yes it was highly unnatural but there were several sections I wouldn't want to ride on a twitchmobile with 18" of seat post. There were plenty of crashes and near crashes.
I think I watched every world cup xc replay this year online, it's good racing and there's def some gnar in there, let alone red lined after smashing a steep climb...that being said, I didn't watch any Olympics, cause I just don't care that much and I hate the ahem 'coverage' provided by the networks, it's pretty f'ing crappy. They need an online feed with your countries commentators, so you don't have to hope to see a few seconds every hour.....god I hate olympic broadcasting, such a waste of time.
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Question for those who think having DH in the Olympics will somehow generate legions on new DH racing fans: XC has been in the Olympics since '96, how many of you now regularly follow world cup XC racing, own a totally xc specific bike more than $4000 or got into cycling because you saw in Georgia, Sydney, Greece, China, or London? Anyone recently take up BMX, buy a BMX bike, or take a kid to a BMX race because you saw it in the Olympics?
Lots of sports in the games (skeleton racing, bobsled, curling, doubles luge....) are seen as neat little fringe sports that, while entertaining and intriguing every few years, are not something that most people are suddenly compelled to go try themselves. DH doesn't need to be in the Olympics for people to see that cycling and mtn biking exist, they already know. And in most cases already know that they would rather watch baseball.
There are 100s of Olympic events, how many do you watch and support on the regular? What makes DH so special?
Sure, I'd love to see it as much as the next guy mostly to bring the athletes a bit more money and support but not because I believe it will grown the sport or attract a new dedicated audience. If anything I'd be more concerned about how the clueless likes of NBC Sports try to package and present it. I just can't see that part going well at all.
Lots of sports in the games (skeleton racing, bobsled, curling, doubles luge....) are seen as neat little fringe sports that, while entertaining and intriguing every few years, are not something that most people are suddenly compelled to go try themselves. DH doesn't need to be in the Olympics for people to see that cycling and mtn biking exist, they already know. And in most cases already know that they would rather watch baseball.
There are 100s of Olympic events, how many do you watch and support on the regular? What makes DH so special?
Sure, I'd love to see it as much as the next guy mostly to bring the athletes a bit more money and support but not because I believe it will grown the sport or attract a new dedicated audience. If anything I'd be more concerned about how the clueless likes of NBC Sports try to package and present it. I just can't see that part going well at all.
Don't know about US but in Poland whenever we have a new champion there is a craze for the sport. We had ski jumping (resulted in overall level of the sport going up by miles), then tennis now biathlon or xc skiing (can't remember don't read news). It would have worked here if there were results
It is not about the fans, it is about the funding. UCI and national governing bodies spend their money on the sports/competitions that are olympic. Training camps for junior riders? Funding for travel? Support from other sources than the trade teams? Development programs? Every time it comes to DH the answer is 'sorry, if we have something left over from XC we will give you some money. XC is more important because it is olympic.'
I think the boost comes from the development programs for junior riders that will then have sufficient funding, generating a higher number of competitors at a high level and growing the sport. Also there will be more sponsors coming into the sport. Have you seen how much funding from sponsors some of the 'obscure' sports that are olympic receive?
Go reread the last paragraph of what I wrote.
Also, I would say there is a difference between growing the number/level of competitors and 'growing the sport.' Internal v external. Not the same thing.
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