[Changleen]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/6140710.stm

This is pretty funny. Good lad using his 'fame' to speak out. He is due to play a concert here in NZ pretty soon, so it'll be funny to see what the local press makes of this.

Sir Elton: Ban organised religion

Sir Elton John has said he would like to see all organised religion banned and accused it of trying to "turn hatred towards gay people".

Organised religion lacked compassion and turned people into "hateful lemmings", he told the Observer.

But the musician said he loved the idea of the teachings of Jesus Christ and the beautiful stories about it which he had learned at Sunday school.

And he said there were many gays he knew who loved their religion.

'Doesn't work'

His comments were made in a special gay edition of the Observer Music Monthly Magazine, where he was interviewed by Scissor Sisters' Jake Shears.

"I think religion has always tried to turn hatred towards gay people," he said. "Religion promotes the hatred and spite against gays.

"But there are so many people I know who are gay and love their religion."

According to the singer-songwriter, 59, his solution would be to "ban religion completely, even though there are some wonderful things about it".

He added: "I love the idea of the teachings of Jesus Christ and the beautiful stories about it, which I loved in Sunday school and I collected all the little stickers and put them in my book.

"But the reality is that organised religion doesn't seem to work. It turns people into hateful lemmings and it's not really compassionate."

He also said that the problems experienced by many gays in former nations of the Soviet bloc, such as Poland, Latvia and Russia were caused by the church supporting anti-gay movements.

'God's people'

And he called on the leaders of major religions to hold a "conclave" to discuss the fate of the world - which he said was "near escalating to World War Three".

"I said this after 9/11 and people thought I was nuts," he said. "It's all got to be dialogue - that's the only way. Get everybody from each religion together and say 'Listen, this can't go on. Why do we have all this hatred?'

"We are all God's people; we have to get along and the [religious leaders] have to lead the way. If they don't do it, who else is going to do it? They're not going to do it and it's left to musicians or to someone else to deal with it."

He also said he would continue to campaign for gay rights.

"I'm going to fight for them, whether I do it silently behind the scenes or so vocally that I get locked up."

 

[kinghami3]

That's actually a pretty legitimate point of view. However, religion at an unorganized level can be both good (charitable and open minded) and bad (closed minded and cult-like). I think he needs to qualify and refine his statement a little more before I can really comment on it... it's far too generalized at the moment.

 

[LordOpie]

that's gay.

 

[Kihaji]

I guess he has no tolerance for intolerant people.

 

[Westy]

Organized religions hate for homos will unite them and bring peace to the world.

 

[Changleen]

that's gay.

 

[JohnE]

Organized religions hate for homos will unite them and bring peace to the world.

AND decorate tastefully!
:biggrin:

 

[N8 v2.0]

why stop there..??

ban elton john too

 

[$tinkle]

"ban religion completely, even though there are some wonderful things about it".

replace "religion" with "homosexuality".

nope. no hate there.

 

[LordOpie]

dude, his argument is either retarded or inflamatory for no other reason than to promote his agenda and hence, also retarded.


I'm afraid of all extremists, that includes homos who hate religion, jews who want to see Palestine destroyed, and vegans.

 

[I Are Baboon]

Didn't our founding fathers flee England to escape teh ghey?

 

[Old Man G Funk]

approaching the holidays, I find it funny how so many liberals in this country think manger scenes should be banned from churches, and pulblic places. Yet these same people wouldn't think twice about letting Homosexuals, or (insert group that may offend conservitives) protest, parade,etc. etc. in public places.

Um, who is trying to ban manger scenes from churches?

What do you mean by "public place?" Is it a place that the government owns and controls? If yes, then sure, manger scenes should not be there. Does that make me intolerant? Not by a long shot. Allowing a homosexual group to protest (too bad for any conservatives that are offended) is not the same as disallowing a manger scene. One "offends" people's moral sensibilities, the other infringes on our rights as granted to us by the Constitution of the US. There's a world of difference there. It's not about being "offended" by mangers, it's about protecting my rights and the rights of all Americans against government intrusion into our religious freedoms.

Edit: And, BTW, the whole "offending people" argument is simply a rhetorical straw man/equivocation used to obfuscate the actual argument.

 

[Silver]

Seriously, Tolorance really needs to start including eveyone, even intolorant religious people.

Really...so you'd be okay with the idea of having family courts handled by Sharia law because an intolerant Muslim thought it was a good idea?

Or maybe you haven't thought any of your ideas out that far?

 

[BurlyShirley]

You know, Elton John has enough money that he could get whatever hot chick he wanted pretty much. What is wrong with that guy?

 

[JohnE]

Uhhmmm, he is gay. Thats what is "wrong" with him. He doesn't like girls. Have you been paying attention? C'mon Shirl...

 

[Old Man G Funk]

no, you're right, I didn't think out that far. I was actually thinking more about the insignificant day to day crap that people get so bent out of shape about. It's just a big visous cycle of stupidness.

For example?

 

[$tinkle]

You know, Elton John has enough money that he could get whatever hot chick he wanted pretty much. What is wrong with that guy?

true.
for the coin he has, you could be that chick.

 

[MMike]

I bet he has a good piano sponsorship too

 

[Westy]

true.
for the coin he has, you could be that chick.

And according to Burly's rules if he only pitched it wouldn't even be gay. I think we may of found him a new career.

 

[MMike]

And according to Burly's rules if he only pitched it wouldn't even be gay. I think we may of found him a new career.

"Prison straight"?

 

[Westy]

do i really need to explain this?

are did you post this because you feeling like argueing?

Are didn't you come to debaight thread unless debeight you want?

 

[Silver]

"Prison straight"?

Nope. Ted Haggard's "counselor".

 

[Old Man G Funk]

do i really need to explain this?

are did you post this because you feeling like argueing?

Well, I have a feeling it will be such minor things as manger scenes in public places, right? Of course, taking away the rights of citizens should never be seen as a minor thing, but hey, we should all be tolerant of the things that you accept, right?

 

[LordOpie]

Are didn't you come to debaight thread unless debeight you want?

approved ^ e


I too love Yoda on acid.

 

[Changleen]

I'm tolerant of pretty much anything except for dumb religious crap.

 

[LordOpie]

I'm tolerant of pretty much anything except for dumb religious crap.

so you're ok with banning religion?

 

[BurlyShirley]

Uhhmmm, he is gay.

Geez. Cut the guy some slack.

 

[Changleen]

so you're ok with banning religion?

In my perfect little world I wouldn't need to because people wouldn't buy into that crap in the first place.

No, I don't want to ban your expression of irrational belief, but I think a little crowd control would be a positive step for the planet.

 

[LordOpie]

In my perfect little world I wouldn't need to because people wouldn't buy into that crap in the first place.

No, I don't want to ban your expression of irrational belief, but I think a little crowd control would be a positive step for the planet.

wow, you're scary.

So anything you approve of is ok for general consumption.


By the Power of Grayskull, I Invoke thee Godwin!

fackin' nazi.

 

[$tinkle]

No, I don't want to ban your expression of irrational belief, but I think a little crowd control would be a positive step for the planet.

trains do tend to run on time with fewer people.

 

[Changleen]

wow, you're scary.

So anything you approve of is ok for general consumption.

I said you could keep your dumb belief didn't I? Just keep it to yourself please.

 

[Changleen]

trains do tend to run on time with fewer people.

 

[LordOpie]

 

[Changleen]

fackin' nazi.

Anyone else low on soap?

 

[SkaredShtles]

This thread is

 

[3D.]

God, please save us from religion

 

[kinghami3]

I said you could keep your dumb belief didn't I? Just keep it to yourself please.

Good lord man, I agree with Opie... I always thought you were more open than that. Might as well ban any and all self expression then. For me, my self expression is first and foremost Christian, and it would be the same for any true follower of a religion. Personally, I don't find how you think atheism is rational, so I find your thoughts hypocritical, if anything. There is always something to debate about. I don't want to force my religion onto you, but if I don't express it, wouldn't I be doing myself an injustice? I wouldn't even be able to discuss this with you. You don't have to believe what I believe, but I'm willing to argue that society will not advance one way or another without religious expression and debate. Morals and ethics will become merely a matter of neurons and chemical balances, beauty will become objective, and ontology will lose its wonder.

 

[Old Man G Funk]

Good lord man, I agree with Opie... I always thought you were more open than that. Might as well ban any and all self expression then. For me, my self expression is first and foremost Christian, and it would be the same for any true follower of a religion. Personally, I don't find how you think atheism is rational, so I find your thoughts hypocritical, if anything. There is always something to debate about. I don't want to force my religion onto you, but if I don't express it, wouldn't I be doing myself an injustice? I wouldn't even be able to discuss this with you. You don't have to believe what I believe, but I'm willing to argue that society will not advance one way or another without religious expression and debate. Morals and ethics will become merely a matter of neurons and chemical balances, beauty will become objective, and ontology will lose its wonder.

Chang said he doesn't want to ban religion, so what's the big deal? AFAICT, he wants to live his life free from your religion just as much as you want to live your life free from his (non)religion. I don't get the big deal, can you (or anyone) explain it?

 

[kinghami3]

Chang said he doesn't want to ban religion, so what's the big deal? AFAICT, he wants to live his life free from your religion just as much as you want to live your life free from his (non)religion. I don't get the big deal, can you (or anyone) explain it?

He says he's tolerant of just about anything except religion, and that we should keep it to ourselves. This isn't banning religion, but it's the banning of the expression of religion, which is what I'm arguing agianst. I want him to explain himself better.

 

[LordOpie]

Chang said he doesn't want to ban religion...

not actively, but his preference is that it didn't exist. Sure, might be slippery-slope to take the next assumption, but it's there.

Good lord man, I agree with Opie... .

hey! What's that mean?

Personally, I don't find how you think atheism is rational...

It's easier.