[Pslide]

Right, so I've got my spanky new Marzocchi All Mountain 1 with ETA, which lowers the fork in its travel, steepening the head angle, and aiding climbing.

But it's strange, cuz when I use it it feels like it takes more leg muscle to climb. Just last night I popped it on half way up a hill and bam, hurts the legs (but does keep the front end down). Anyone else noticed this?

Maybe it's just because I'm so used to climbing with a 5+" travel fork?

-Aaron

 

[jonKranked]

lowering the front end also lowers the bb, not enough that it should make a difference. that might have something to do with it though. or you could just suck it up princess

 

[binary visions]

Total speculation, but maybe it's because you're having to pedal up and over small rocks and roots that the suspension was previously absorbing?

 

[Cant Climb]

Right, so I've got my spanky new Marzocchi All Mountain 1 with ETA, which lowers the fork in its travel, steepening the head angle, and aiding climbing.

But it's strange, cuz when I use it it feels like it takes more leg muscle to climb. Just last night I popped it on half way up a hill and bam, hurts the legs (but does keep the front end down). Anyone else noticed this?

Maybe it's just because I'm so used to climbing with a 5+" travel fork?

-Aaron

it's not always good to lock it down on fireroads if its a gradual climb........but if your going up a steep headwall then locking it down is essential IMO....

 

[binary visions]

it's not always good to lock it down on fireroads if its a gradual climb........but if your going up a steep headwall then locking it down is essential IMO....

Should he really be taking climbing advice from someone with a username of "Can't Climb"?

 

[Wumpus]

Right, so I've got my spanky new Marzocchi All Mountain 1 with ETA, which lowers the fork in its travel, steepening the head angle, and aiding climbing.

But it's strange, cuz when I use it it feels like it takes more leg muscle to climb. Just last night I popped it on half way up a hill and bam, hurts the legs (but does keep the front end down). Anyone else noticed this?

Maybe it's just because I'm so used to climbing with a 5+" travel fork?

-Aaron

I thought I was imagining things the other day riding the road back from the trails, but I everytime I locked the fork out it seemed my pedaling got slugglish. It was really strange.

There is one steep climb in the park that I lock it out so I can stand and it is really helpful.

 

[Cant Climb]

On steep technical climbs havng the front end down helps you manuever the front end and allows you to get in front off your pedals instead getting that feeling that you're "climbing in a hole".....

 

[bjanga]

Maybe changing the seat angle by 5* has something to do with it?

 

[jacksonpt]

Could it just be psychological? Once you drop the fork, you begin looking for differences in how the bike behaves? Just a thought.

I have a TALAS... while not ETA, still the same principle and I love dropping the fork for climbing - I've never noticed any "side effects."

 

[sanjuro]

Maybe changing the seat angle by 5* has something to do with it?

Good point. It probably has to do with saddle position as well.

I have a 5" Z1 with ETA, and I was thinking about the saddle angles and position. I would imagine I want the nose slightly lower with the ETA engaged, so that the saddle would be level when I am climbing.

ETA would not affect distance from saddle to BB, but you could be sliding forward when the seat angle changed.

But I have both ETA and Talas, and I like them both. I prefer ETA, although Fox forks are lighter...

 

[cadmus]

I have the Z1 light w/ ETA and I think it helps on the climb - anyone else feel like the amount of lockout "slips" as you climb and has to be reloaded? Sometimes it feels locked way down and other times not so much. I've only used it about a dozen or so times, so I don't have a lot of time on the fork.

 

[Wumpus]

Maybe changing the seat angle by 5* has something to do with it?

Not sure how you figure that. Mine only lock out the first inch of travel so that might be a degree, but I imagine it is less than that.

 

[sanjuro]

Not sure how you figure that. Mine only lock out the first inch of travel so that might be a degree, but I imagine it is less than that.

5 degrees is a lot, but supposedly dropping the fork 25mm lessens the head tube angle by 1 degree. So if you had a 150mm fork drop to 30mm, then possibly a SA drop of 4-5 degrees...

 

[bjanga]

its probably almost 4* when you have a 150mm fork dropped to 30mm because of sag, if 1" = 1*

I really have no idea what I am talking about.

 

[OGRipper]

Ya'll seem to be forgetting that when you are climbing a hill you are no longer level, so lowering your front end keeps your angles roughly the same.

As for why it feels sluggish, the only thing I can think of is that because your front end is suddenly somewhat locked out/heavily preloaded, your rear end will feel more squishy.

It's like incest...it's all relative.

 

[Wumpus]

5 degrees is a lot, but supposedly dropping the fork 25mm lessens the head tube angle by 1 degree. So if you had a 150mm fork drop to 30mm, then possibly a SA drop of 4-5 degrees...

The forks lock out in the first inch of travel not at the last inch. One degree change in the head angle is all you get which is less than a degree of seat angle.

 

[bjanga]

Guess I should look up what ETA actually is, first.

 

[Changleen]

Guys, you get the ° sign by pressing Alt+2,4,8. Look:

I changed the head angle by 5°.

OK?

 

[PatBranch]

Guess I should look up what ETA actually is, first.

External Travel Adjustment

 

[binary visions]

External Travel Adjustment

Actually, it's Extension Travel Adjustment

The forks lock out in the first inch of travel not at the last inch. One degree change in the head angle is all you get which is less than a degree of seat angle.

This is what Marzocchi's website says, which doesn't quite correlate to what you are saying:

As you climb, simply flick a switch and the suspension will compress to the ideal height (depending on the riders weight). However, unlike a lock out mechanism, you’ll still have 30mm of travel to soak up some of the rough stuff. Truly having your cake and eating it too!

I always thought it locked down much lower than in the first inch of travel.

edit: Further inspection shows that this is what the manual says:

When turning the knob clockwise, you activiate the ETA cartridge function. In this position, the fork's legs will stay compressed after an impact, and additional impacts will further lower the fork.

So it really should lock down to the last inch of travel after a couple hits, according to the manual anyway.

 

[vitox]

it will lock the rebound circuit so your front end will get lower and lower until theres one inch of travel left, as someone pointed out, this would mean that on a 6" fork, the ETA will mean a max of 4" lower front end, which is quite the difference, i have used but i only care to engage it in situations where the front end gets unweighted unless i shorten the fork, and in that scenario its all benefits. i could however see how if you dropped the fork all the way down on a mild grade, you would have to do some position adjustment, say for instance sit further back on the saddle, in order to maintain neutral weight balance.

 

[bjanga]

it will lock the rebound circuit so your front end will get lower and lower until theres one inch of travel left, as someone pointed out, this would mean that on a 6" fork, the ETA will mean a max of 4" lower front end

That is what I thought ETA did. I no longer trust Wumpus

 

[Wumpus]

That is what I thought ETA did. I no longer trust Wumpus

Fine. It locks out more than an inch, but it would be pretty silly to be using it when hitting the size of bumps that are needed to compress it that far.

 

[jdcamb]

Interesting thread.

 

[PatBranch]

Then, dwaugh was wrong...

 

[bjanga]

I would think that you would just need to roll over lots of little bumps. Or stand and weight the bars a few times.

 

[Wumpus]

I would think that you would just need to roll over lots of little bumps. Or stand and weight the bars a few times.

It took me quite a bit of effort a minute ago to get my marathon(125) to compress halfway. I've never had it go that far on the trail -- even when I forgot to turn it off.

 

[bjanga]

Hmm. Is your fork still rebounding when ETA is on?

 

[Pslide]

Yeah, ETA does what it says on the tin...doesn't allow the fork to rebound all the way out. If you accidently leave it on through a gnarly downhill, you'll come out on the bottom with zero travel! I found out the hard way...

I find ETA rather silly though, cuz as you guys have figured out, you actually have to put in a lot of effort by standing up, weighting the front end, and shoving down to reduce the travel by a couple of inches. So you're in an endurance race, trying to save every bit of energy you can by having a fork that improves climbing, but you've got to expend energy to make it work...ummmmm, yeah. Good thing I don't do endurance races...

Anyway, I don't really like ETA now that I've used it. In fact, I usually don't use it, especially since it, for whatever reason, seems to make it harder to pedal (IMHO). It may be the change in seat angle, who knows. On a steep out of saddle climb I can see where it would be useful, and it definitely keeps the front end from floating, but it doesn't really seem like an energy saver to me.

What it boils down to is that I thought I'd be getting a superior fork when I bought the All Mountain 1, with all kinds of awesome adjustments that I could set up just to my liking. But in the end, after getting everything dialed it works about the same as my old 130mm Z1 - and actually, not quite as good for small bump sensitivity. So if I wanted to upgrade, I should have just bought the relatively simpler 150mm Z1.

2005 All Mountain 1 for sale!!!

-Aaron