[ebrider510]

my question is just regarding the Geo of the DOC. i want a new frame that fits me a bit better then my current one, so i am looking at the options. i want a pure street/DJ oriented frame...nothing more. i've heard that the DOC is kind of too tall/long for a true Street/DJ frame. i don't mind getting used to something new..but just want to hear some more info on this question. i really would rather get a NemPro or a Fall Guy, but i dont think i can really shell out that much doh, although i very well mite end up doing so. any info on this is very much appreciated!

 

[Bicyclist]

Too tall, too long, too slack for techy DJs or street or park. For more 4x/big mountain style stuff it's aweseome.

With a 3" travel fork they ride pretty nice but IMO you find yourself fighting the bike on spins, etc. If you don't mind a "mountain bike" feeling bike go for it, but if you want a big BMX it's too bulky.

.02

 

[ebrider510]

Too tall, too long, too slack for techy DJs or street or park. For more 4x/big mountain style stuff it's aweseome.

With a 3" travel fork they ride pretty nice but IMO you find yourself fighting the bike on spins, etc. If you don't mind a "mountain bike" feeling bike go for it, but if you want a big BMX it's too bulky.

.02

thanks, thats pretty much exactly what i figured and was kind of afraid of. seems awesome for the huge lines but i do a lot more techy stuff then that. guess i mite be saving up for the other options

 

[fiddy_ryder]

wanna buy a used ToP?

 

[ebrider510]

wanna buy a used ToP?

i would...but dont think it will work with 24's?

 

[fiddy_ryder]

i would...but dont think it will work with 24's?

actually, the geo looks like it will ride fine,, the bb will be a bit low, but compared to other 24 bikes, its about the same. the only thing would be grinding the dropouts to shorten the chainstays... i may keep my ToP and throw 24's on it, id like to try em out. or i may just get a 24 specific frame..

 

[ebrider510]

actually, the geo looks like it will ride fine,, the bb will be a bit low, but compared to other 24 bikes, its about the same. the only thing would be grinding the dropouts to shorten the chainstays... i may keep my ToP and throw 24's on it, id like to try em out. or i may just get a 24 specific frame..

that's a tough call, i would be interested to see what the BB height would be with 24's. that could actually end up being sick. never seen it done before.

 

[fiddy_ryder]

that's a tough call, i would be interested to see what the BB height would be with 24's. that could actually end up being sick. never seen it done before.

my bb now, with 65mm travel pike is right about 12.5" .. I figure drop 1 inch for the decrease in wheel diameter, 11.5" .. the nemesis 24 is 11.8".. tonic bb is 12.75.. with the chainstays around 15". I figure i could get the ToP CS around 15.5 maybe 15.25 after grinding and running a skinnier tire. im kinda thinking 11.5 for the bb is gonna be too low.. maybe one of the more knowledgeable guys will chime in..

 

[Bicyclist]

11.5 is getting too low IMO, it won't have too much "pop." It'll work, but it won't be ideal.

If you're gonna run 24s get a 24" bike. Otherwise you don't get the real benefits like more compact geo, tighter angles, shorter CSs, etc.

 

[fiddy_ryder]

11.5 is getting too low IMO, it won't have too much "pop." It'll work, but it won't be ideal.

i totally get it,, those low rider bikes are a pain in the ass to bunnyhop and manual..

 

[Bicyclist]

But at the same time something too tall will be unstable and sketchy. It's hard to find a balance.

 

[fiddy_ryder]

But at the same time something too tall will be unstable and sketchy. It's hard to find a balance.

looks like the average between the 3 more popular 24's, nem, tonic, usb is 11.8-12.3..
nem being the lowest.. would the .5" make that much diff?

 

[Bicyclist]

The truth is not really, but I prefer a bit on the higher side.

 

[kidwoo]

The DOC has a 13" bb with 26" wheels. It's about half an inch higher than a lot of other frames because it's MADE TO RIDE WITH 24s AS WELL AS 26s.

So that puts the bb at 12" with 24s. The wheelbase on mine is 40.5 inches, the same size as a medium ToP, shorter than the specialized bikes and about the same as the longer MOB frames. It's in the same range as every other dj frame in terms of length, shorter than some, slightly, longer than very few others.

bicyclist......you're arguing over half inch increments on bikes I doubt you've even ridden. Seriously man.......come back to earth. Aaron chase is a little guy and his bikes have an 11.7" high BB. I understand the theory as well as you do but he seems to be able to bunny hop and manual just fine and a half inch isn't going to make or break anyone. Chris donahue, Nigel quarless, heiki hall as well as many others all ride docs and kill it on both 24s and 26s.

fiddy ryder: how tall are you?

 

[fiddy_ryder]

5'11.

 

[ebrider510]

The DOC has a 13" bb with 26" wheels. It's about half an inch higher than a lot of other frames because it's MADE TO RIDE WITH 24s AS WELL AS 26s.

So that puts the bb at 12" with 24s. The wheelbase on mine is 40.5 inches, the same size as a medium ToP, shorter than the specialized bikes and about the same as the longer MOB frames. It's in the same range as every other dj frame in terms of length, shorter than some, slightly, longer than very few others.

bicyclist......you're arguing over half inch increments on bikes I doubt you've even ridden. Seriously man.......come back to earth. Aaron chase is a little guy and his bikes have an 11.7" high BB. I understand the theory as well as you do but he seems to be able to bunny hop and manual just fine and a half inch isn't going to make or break anyone. Chris donahue, Nigel quarless, heiki hall as well as many others all ride docs and kill it on both 24s and 26s.

fiddy ryder: how tall are you?

can you attest to how it feels for the more techy lines? i wouldn't mind hearing a few different opinions. im not worried much about the BB height because i will be using 24's. i ask because i kind of want a more BMXish feel for the tech lines, and the Geo doesn't seem to be based around that. but...it is donahue's frame so i could be wrong.

 

[kidwoo]

5'11.

There's no way a reg DOC will be too big for you. I'm 5'7"

 

[kidwoo]

can you attest to how it feels for the more techy lines? i wouldn't mind hearing a few different opinions. im not worried much about the BB height because i will be using 24's. i ask because i kind of want a more BMXish feel for the tech lines, and the Geo doesn't seem to be based around that. but...it is donahue's frame so i could be wrong.

For what I consider techy, it's incredibly nimble. That's mostly dirtjumps/slalom track type stuff though. I don't ride street.

Check out the ride reports forum for a video I put up. That's me in the red shirt and in a black/grey shirt with the star spangled helmet on a reg sized black doc. I'm not sure if that's what you consider techy or not but the smaller, quick direction changes with small pumps and such are within my definition.

Mike bike:

wheelbase :40.5
BB height: 13.0
Headangle: 70
chainstay: 15.7 (slammed as short as it goes)
with a 3" manitou sherman fork and arrow 2.24 tires

Feels pretty bmx to me but I don't ride 20s

 

[untitledsince89]

The DOC has a 13" bb with 26" wheels. It's about half an inch higher than a lot of other frames because it's MADE TO RIDE WITH 24s AS WELL AS 26s.

So that puts the bb at 12" with 24s. The wheelbase on mine is 40.5 inches, the same size as a medium ToP, shorter than the specialized bikes and about the same as the longer MOB frames. It's in the same range as every other dj frame in terms of length, shorter than some, slightly, longer than very few others.

bicyclist......you're arguing over half inch increments on bikes I doubt you've even ridden. Seriously man.......come back to earth. Aaron chase is a little guy and his bikes have an 11.7" high BB. I understand the theory as well as you do but he seems to be able to bunny hop and manual just fine and a half inch isn't going to make or break anyone. Chris donahue, Nigel quarless, heiki hall as well as many others all ride docs and kill it on both 24s and 26s.

fiddy ryder: how tall are you?

couldn't have said it better myself

 

[ebrider510]

For what I consider techy, it's incredibly nimble. That's mostly dirtjumps/slalom track type stuff though. I don't ride street.

Check out the ride reports forum for a video I put up. That's me in the red shirt and in a black/grey shirt with the star spangled helmet on a reg sized black doc. I'm not sure if that's what you consider techy or not but the smaller, quick direction changes with small pumps and such are within my definition.

Mike bike:

wheelbase :40.5
BB height: 13.0
Headangle: 70
chainstay: 15.7 (slammed as short as it goes)
with a 3" manitou sherman fork and arrow 2.24 tires

Feels pretty bmx to me but I don't ride 20s

that video was sick! ya i would definitely consider those lines techy, just in a different way then i meant at the time. mad props for hitting those lines so well

basically as far as DJ'n goes...im pretty sold on the DOC. the way i meant techy though was referring to street riding. aka wallrides, bank sessions, 360 tire taps and 180's off of any given structure...basically stuff you would find when riding around the city. although it will see a lot of DJ/4X action as well, which i kind of forgot about in my original post. overall, just wouldn't want the bike to feel too big for the street stuff. im just over 6ft. though so mite feel good. i'll have to keep an eye out and think it over. thanks for all the help

if i do get one...it would be set up similar to nigel's on 24's

http://www.evil-bikes.com/squad_nigel.htm

 

[kidwoo]

FWIW, I ride with one of the evil guys ("hacksaw" on here) a good bit in the winter. Before he got a sovereign, he was on a small DOC (I have no idea how he rides a bike that small at his size). He's over 6 foot and kills it riding street with bags of tricks including everything you listed and then some. He rides 26s on his.

I'm going to putting mine up for sale soon if you're interested. Might save you some money. It's an 06 with the beefed up seatstays in black.

Reason I'm selling is (are you ready for this.....) I want something a little longer.

 

[ebrider510]

FWIW, I ride with one of the evil guys ("hacksaw" on here) a good bit in the winter. Before he got a sovereign, he was on a small DOC (I have no idea how he rides a bike that small at his size). He's over 6 foot and kills it riding street with bags of tricks including everything you listed and then some. He rides 26s on his.

I'm going to putting mine up for sale soon if you're interested. Might save you some money. It's an 06 with the beefed up seatstays in black.

Reason I'm selling is (are you ready for this.....) I want something a little longer.

haha, awesome. PM me or something when you have it up for sale. i'll see if i can get the money soon enough thanks again

 

[ufdff15]

FWIW, I ride with one of the evil guys ("hacksaw" on here) a good bit in the winter. Before he got a sovereign, he was on a small DOC (I have no idea how he rides a bike that small at his size). He's over 6 foot and kills it riding street with bags of tricks including everything you listed and then some. He rides 26s on his.

http://www.evil-bikes.com/intelligence.htm

No too up to date on your boy are you

I would say to the original poster, if you want a pure street frame you cannot beat a 24" specific frame(Molly, Fall Guy or Nemesis Project)

 

[kidwoo]

http://www.evil-bikes.com/intelligence.htm

No too up to date on your boy are you

I knew that before evil did

Still doesn't change the fact he's ridden evils the last two years and was on one up to 3 weeks ago.....or what I posted previously.

edit: wanna place bets on who he's riding for next? I bet I win

 

[ufdff15]

I knew that before evil did

Still doesn't change the fact he's ridden evils the last two years and was on one up to 3 weeks ago.....or what I posted previously.

edit: wanna place bets on who he's riding for next? I bet I win

I was just kidding around.
I am very curious, but i'm not willing to bet with someone that clearly already know where he's going.

 

[kidwoo]

I was just kidding around.
I am very curious, but i'm not willing to bet with someone that clearly already know where he's going.

It's all good. I was being obnoxious because what frame he's riding next (atomlab) in no way invalidates what I was saying before.......that he kills (killed) it in the streets on his evils. The bikes are capable. I have to use him as an example because he's the only guy I ride with that rides that stuff. If it's not dirt, I don't go near it