Yup. Not worth wasting time/energy on it here.
Also, I'll accept the title "brand whore" whe they accept the title "moron."
Evil Undead
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- 2 months = 2 years 2 weeks =2 months baiters gonna bait buck me in the s buck the trend buck you! butthurt activate! consumerism could careless e-speculation! evil = blame the asians evil is evil evilhate=itsthenewblack expensive hobbies haters wanna hate hype machine rolling ih8rice wants new evil? its on the way new evil=no evil proto=2 yrs;production=?? suckers new evil≠old evil thetruth is dope trumpdoucheinvasion waiters gonna wait where is bradflyn
Also, I'll accept the title "brand whore" whe they accept the title "moron."
Are you kidding?
This thread is mostly full of people making **** up and propagating rumors based on things they have no first hand knowledge of.
Have you read the last few pages? People are interested in the frame. I don't see many serious posts claiming the frame will fail or Kevin is an Evil person and will kill a baby kitten for every frame he sells. I guess we see the world in different ways.
Unless comments like mine that I'm interested but want to wait for reviews after a season of riding are considered hating.
Unless comments like mine that I'm interested but want to wait for reviews after a season of riding are considered hating.
I agree with you- and what a shame when a supposedly top caliber rider is on here ripping one of the brightest tuning guys around for posing valid questions about a bike. Definately makes me want to steer clear of whatever sponsors or hook ups said "pro" may have.
Definately psyched to see evil recovering.
how is that a problem that doesn't exist? unless of course you were referring to the fact that these bikes are still just an idea and not a tangible product...
it's a legitimate concern actually...I'll admit it's not a HUGE deal, but on all of my turners(high degree of rotation) i've opted to try to run that stainless bearings/hardware because it's smoother and doesn't develop play as quickly...better than plastic just grinding on aluminum....i guess that comment shouldn't surprise me because 3 years later you still have evil bikes balls deep in your throat....hahahaaha
edit: to clear this up, i'm being a little abrasive because i thought you were as well, and i thought your comment was unfounded, Udi is a super helpful guy and has offerend tons of great advice on this board...in contrast most of what's come out of your mouth has been pretty snide and worthless in my opinion....
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Care to explain how I was 'hating'?
I only asked because I'm genuinely interested in the bike.
Thanks Ian Collins / norbar / 4130 for the support. For whatever it's worth Ian, I thought it was cool that the DW-DHR went with 8mm hardware instead of 10 for this very reason. It's not a huge issue but it's nice to have the flexibility, and the 8mm hardware also has the advantage of not eating into the links over time like the 10mm stuff does (thin walled steel edge vs. alloy). It's not a big deal at all, but just one of those little things.
yeah but Udi you aren't factory as fuçk like Dave Trumpore...stuff like that doesn't matter to Pro's like him...they just get maddd free stuff and durability doesn't matter, you're just "creating problems that don't exist"....you're just "hating" <-----most blown out, overused, whack ass word EVER
I just wanted to point out that someone was already proposing another possible"problem" on a bike that has only been seen in a few pictures. So yes it is a problem that does not exist... Only in RM world
The bulk of this thread is full of bull**** no one can base on facts. Including the verbal diarrhea you just offered us.
Stay Classy Ian Collins.
Enjoy your little broverdose here on RM.
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Can I trademark "factory as fvck™?"
I think it would help my innernet brand and facilitate open markets on my awesome™.
I think it would help my innernet brand and facilitate open markets on my awesome™.
I'm with you on that. It's a small thing but from the moment I went from part time to 40h+ work a week I really apreaciate anything that allows me to work on my bike less.
Dave chill out. User feedback is USEFUL. I don't know Kevin but genuine suggestions are helpful for any engineer. Stop freaking out. Frames don't have feelings.
i'll take a page from your book and work on that....
What prompted me to jump in is the fact that you shelled someone who is a helpful, technically savvy contributor to this board when he was just bringing up a legit concern for the development of a bike which (let's all be honest here) could use a little help, and is OBVIOUSLY still in a developmental stage....you referred to him as an "internet nerd" while posting on the same "INTERNET" based discussion board as he did...you look like a dipsh:t
as for lack of facts, all this stems from one fact: 3 years, NO FRAMES and dozens of burnt consumers....FACT
this might seem like a gross oversimplification, but i'd compare evil's run to the Obama administration, thus far they've made a bunch of idealistic promises that they can't keep, and have failed at following through.
just like obama, on paper they sound appealing, but in the real world they haven't provided anything tangible....the average evil customer(not the sick factory ones like you Dave, just the plebeians of the world) are standing around wondering where their new carbon replacement frames are, just like the average American is scratching his head wondering when the awesome free public health care he was promised 3 years ago will kick in...
your unwavering support and defense of a company that has been nothing but a failure THUS FAR makes you look like the bleeding heart liberal d:ckhead that still supports Obama while regurgitating "facts" they heard on CNN about "politics"....no one wants to hear it
disclaimer: while all of this may seem brash or seem like a jab at evil, it's not. I always root for the underdog, and would love to see evil make a huge comeback...the frame looks incredible and tons of engineering went into it. If i knew it would hold up, i'd ride it in a heartbeat....I love small companies, and i hope Evil can pull themselves up by the bootstraps, salvage their reputation and become a force in the boutique DH frame market.....
love and kisses Dave,
Ian
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Norbar... Did you read through it, or just find the title catchy? Honest question as the title is misleading as to what side of the coin that site is on.
Ian... Fair enough, we can agree to disagree.
I have a soft spot for the folks at Evil, as you have one for the folks at Turner (another brand that has it's fair share of struggles played out on the internet).
Hopefully the bikes turn out and everyone gets there replacements.
But the comparison with Obama... that's a stretch, haha. (of course one could argue that Bush and the conservatives set him up to fail just as Evil's factory did). But let's not make this a political debate, that's why it's a free country and we all get our chance to vote.
Yup
You could make the same website for any previous president.... But that still doesn't mean any of them got anything substantial done.
Clowns all of them... Seems like much of Europe is just as bad these days too.
Makes the bike industry look efficient and well run haha.
Wait, I thought the industry is running the government?
Now that you're both here, I couldn't resist. 
Seriously guys, I know you like to support your sponsored/preferred brands, but truth is - nothing is perfect. The cool thing about discussing problems openly is that people come up with solutions - whether that's the end-user or manufacturer (or both, in whichever order) it's good news for everyone really. If I find an issue with something, it's much nicer when it's a 'known issue' that someone has solved - because it means I can fix it and go back to being happy with the product.
If I didn't already make it obvious, I think the Evil frame looks awesome. The only reason I brought up the hardware is because I liked the frame enough to look into the little details - and the hardware on the Revolt (that's very similar to my current frame I believe) is one little niggle I had, and actually just posed a question as to whether the Undead was the same, and/or if there were different options available.
Seriously guys, I know you like to support your sponsored/preferred brands, but truth is - nothing is perfect. The cool thing about discussing problems openly is that people come up with solutions - whether that's the end-user or manufacturer (or both, in whichever order) it's good news for everyone really. If I find an issue with something, it's much nicer when it's a 'known issue' that someone has solved - because it means I can fix it and go back to being happy with the product.
If I didn't already make it obvious, I think the Evil frame looks awesome. The only reason I brought up the hardware is because I liked the frame enough to look into the little details - and the hardware on the Revolt (that's very similar to my current frame I believe) is one little niggle I had, and actually just posed a question as to whether the Undead was the same, and/or if there were different options available.
Cute pic... But actually the advice was for people to take the sticky ones apart and fill lowers with proper oil levels since SRAM forgot too ;-).Now that you're both here, I couldn't resist.
Seriously guys, I know you like to support your sponsored/preferred brands, but truth is - nothing is perfect. The cool thing about discussing problems openly is that people come up with solutions - whether that's the end-user or manufacturer (or both, in whichever order) it's good news for everyone really. If I find an issue with something, it's much nicer when it's a 'known issue' that someone has solved - because it means I can fix it and go back to being happy with the product.
If I didn't already make it obvious, I think the Evil frame looks awesome. The only reason I brought up the hardware is because I liked the frame enough to look into the little details - and the hardware on the Revolt (that's very similar to my current frame I believe) is one little niggle I had, and actually just posed a question as to whether the Undead was the same, and/or if there were different options available.
But cool story bro
On a serious note. The hardware on the evil was far better than the Sunday if that's what you are comparing to. Still 10mm but fits into the links better. Similar to a through axle and they didn't spin against the alloy links like some of the other 10 mm designs.
Since the main link is not one price on the evil the bigger hardware helps line everything up a bit better.
But hey what do I know. I owned an evil for a few years and according to this crew that means my opinion is irrelevant ;-)
Hold up, don't rope me into this just because I'm related. I'm just a neutral observer who thinks this argument is great entertainment.
The 3 of you getting all wound up over 2mm (well, mostly Ian and Dave) was the highlight of my morning forum reading. And just when I thought the spectating couldn't get any better it devolved into a mix of terrible political analogies, sh*t spraying and butt-hurt . . . and no one hates sh*t spraying and butt-hurt more than Rick Santorum.
Pretty sure I haven't weighed in on this thread at all (at least not in any meaningful way), mostly I just read for the amusement of how y'all can talk about an essentially non-existent frame for 47 pages.
Please don't stop
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Not sure how it could 'fit into the links better', care to elaborate? Is the contact point between reducer and link not still just the face of the reducer? Honest question there.
Only the bottom one would tend to spin on the Sunday because it's hard to develop enough reducer clamping force in that particular design (limited by the fact that it had to be pivot-concentric), but that doesn't apply on the Evil. The problem with both bottom and top though was that over the years the 10mm steel reducer's 1.35mm wall thickness ((12.7 - 10)/2) would 'bite' into the alloy links after a while. It's NOT a big issue but it's not perfect either, and on links without much stiffness on their own, you'd start pulling the links closer together as the reducer 'ate' into the links.
But now that you mention the 2-piece link, the need for 10mm does make sense. Perhaps a bit of a necessary compromise. Anyway I was just interested in some discussion on the topic, like I said the bike looks great to me and I'd happily ride one if they've nailed the durability / reliability aspects.
Posts 52-54 here if you needed a reference point. I just remember quite a few people being told to 'break in / actually ride their fork' because it was perfectly normal, and then a few months later RS released an updated bushing because it wasn't actually user error at all. The tone in here just reminded me of it. I'll butt out now and try not to hold you fast guys up while I punt down trails really slowly.
^^^^ Like I said above, leave me out of it. Dave and Ian are arguing with each other as usual over nothing about the topic. Certainly not the first time. That meme was for them.
Just 'cause I'm related doesn't mean I'm going to co-sign. And don't assume that just because I owned an Evil 3 years ago means I've got any skin in the game.
Just 'cause I'm related doesn't mean I'm going to co-sign. And don't assume that just because I owned an Evil 3 years ago means I've got any skin in the game.
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you cant fix stupid.... stop trying
trying to recall how the sundays went together. the bottom was crap i remember that though.
as for the evil there is essentially a through axle that goes through the shock and half way into the link on the other side. A bolt threads into it and pulls it all tight so it can not twist or rotate.
the usual aluminum spacers sit between the shock and the link. There is nothing to cut into the link or wear it down over time.
The "receiving" side of the link was bored out about halfway through for the axle to slide in and stop against. So the links could never be pulled closer together.
make sense?
as for the steal reducers, those hit the links, yes. but they don't spin, and can not be over tightened by flexing the links and digging in. And that reducer design has more to do with particular shock manufacturers more than frame hardware spec.
I know RS, Elka, and many others use similar method (steel reducer/aluminum spacers). Who besides fox still uses the two piece "tophat" style aluminum ones?
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Now that you're both here, I couldn't resist.
http://c.images.memegenerator.net/instances/400x/15248738.jpg [/quote]
I love this, thanks udi for reading my mind. I bought my 2010 boxer largely based on the whinging of those two and had nothing but problems...so much so that rs recalled the entire fork to replace it. You don't replace an entire product because of rider error or because you added too little oil from the factory. That thread made me so angry as this is supposed to be a rider community, not the douchebag club telling you everything is perfect and it can't possibly be their sponsors products fault....and then, even now, they cannot accept that they were wrong and that there were legitimate problems with the fork. I just have no respect for people like that.
Not sure where you get the 'even now' part since this has always been a thread about a prototype bike frame. But in case you missed it 3 years ago, I fully admitted to having my foot in my mouth at the time. A large batch of forks came with no lube and were easily fixed (at least among the 8-10 people I knew who had them), there was apparently another batch that was straight f*cked and felt the same as the decent ones. I was going on the experience of fixing dozens of forks for people over the years just by properly lubricating them, and the experiences of other forum members who were able to fix their '10's with a few tbsp of red rum. There was another run with a different problem, not exactly worth dwelling on for 3 years. Mea Culpa.
I think I even shared that I went through 3 forks myself that year and one of them came so absolutely messed up mechanically from the factory I had to overnight mail it back to Boobar directly (and I was a paying customer just like everyone else).
Aside from a public flogging I'd say that amounted to admitting wrong. That was 3 years ago, I've moved on.
However, that production run aside, I'll stand by the claim that 90% of the problems people complain about with their Boxxer (from 98-2012) can be avoided with extremely simple maintenance. It's never been a very good set-it-and-forget-it fork, and that's a significant issue for anyone who doesn't feel compelled or confident in taking care of it. Hands down I think that's the biggest negative going for it, but might as well call it is instead of inventing some other problem.
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PS, Dave, your recent posts make you sound like a twat.
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LOL...
Sweet Baby Jesus.
I leave you people alone for a week, ONE #^&$%#$ week and LOOK at the mess you made in here!
Everyone from Page 46 forward, GO to your ROOM.
ALL of you.
Udi - you're OK. You can go back outside.
Sweet Baby Jesus.
I leave you people alone for a week, ONE #^&$%#$ week and LOOK at the mess you made in here!
Everyone from Page 46 forward, GO to your ROOM.
ALL of you.
Udi - you're OK. You can go back outside.
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oh come on...it wasn't that bad....no one is really bent out of shape, and everyone kissed and made up, the dust settled and we're back on track...people will be speculating again in no time
eh, sorry about that. back to carbonez
I was thinking possibly that or just simple wheel changes with the rotor scrapping the inside of the carbon stay. As ham-fisted as some 'mechanics' are, I could see someone jamming the hell out of their chain stay with their rotor while they're trying to jimmy the back wheel in after a flat.
All bitching, dick-swinging, and speculation aside, that is a good looking bicycle.
Is that the 29er prototype?
Hope the Undead gets the success it deserves. I was pretty happy with my Revolt apart from the minor frame quality issues. If there aren't any problems with the frame I'll prolly get myself one of these aswell
Yeah, let's not kid ourselves - if the frame turns out to be durable, this will end up being a pretty iconic comeback. The Revolts were an amazing frame to ride, if the Undead solves the reliability (and to a far lesser extent the weight) issues, Evil will be hitting the rev limiter again soon enough. I really hope this is what happens!Hope the Undead gets the success it deserves. I was pretty happy with my Revolt apart from the minor frame quality issues. If there aren't any problems with the frame I'll prolly get myself one of these aswell