[Spunger]

Hey guys,

No I don't own a home but where I live it's owned by my girlfriends parents so we usually have the OK to do things to it. Her dad won't touch electrical stuff and I know nothing about home electrical so I figured I'd ask here as most of you guys have homes and probably have done this stuff before.

I have a light switch I'd like to move over..........say 6" down in our garage because there are 3 garages and I am walling off 1 and 2 to make them seperate. The light swtich for garage #2 is on #1's side of the wall that I am building. I took the switch off the wall but the wires aren't long enough to extend them over to where I want it extended.

So my question is............can I wire nut, use a crimper, solder extensions onto the wires that aren't long enough to make them long enough? As long as it's the same guage and everything as the original wire?

I only ask because I am very fluent in automotive wiring (stereos/sensors etc....) and know I can do any of the above to make something OK, though I always know a fresh run is 100% and a crimp or solder is pretty close. I just know that's with 12v stuff, LOL not 120v home stuff.

Any help would be greatly appricated!

 

[SkaredShtles]

Usually code will require you do such work in a junction box. At least that's what my old man used to use.

 

[Spunger]

LOL.......well nothing in the building is probably too correct to code. Like I got a spliced extension cord running my treadmill. But I know what you mean, the correct way would be using conduit and a junction box. Hmmm.......seems like alot more work then I wanted going that route, but I know it's the CORRECT way to wire home stuff. I know some do it, some just ehhhh........work around it

 

[SkaredShtles]

LOL.......well nothing in the building is probably too correct to code. Like I got a spliced extension cord running my treadmill. But I know what you mean, the correct way would be using conduit and a junction box. Hmmm.......seems like alot more work then I wanted going that route, but I know it's the CORRECT way to wire home stuff. I know some do it, some just ehhhh........work around it

It's pretty easy - just replace the existing switch box with a junction box and then run your spliced wires down to the new location. It'll be a little safer than having the wires nutted together loose in the wall.

 

[johnbryanpeters]

Do not work around it. Buy a second box and do it right. Go to a book store and get a consumer's book on wiring. You need to use the right sized wire, wire nuts, and boxes. Soldering is not OK.

Code's not set up as an exercise in bureaucracy, it based on review of a lot of structure fires and deaths.

J

 

[Spunger]

A junction box.........is like the metal box that is recessed into the wall where the swtich is correct? I got one of those but I didn't want to mount it inside the wall, just tack it onto the side. The box is like it'd fit a switch or outlet, made of metal, and has tabs that you can break away so you can get the wires into the box. Is that a junction box?

 

[Reactor]

I don't know your local electrical code, but generally you can use wire nuts, or a terminal block in the existing box, and run a new wire over a new box you use for the new switch. I'm old fashioned, I like either solder or a terminal block.

 

[H8R]

Hey guys,

No I don't own a home but where I live it's owned by my girlfriends parents so we usually have the OK to do things to it. Her dad won't touch electrical stuff and I know nothing about home electrical so I figured I'd ask here as most of you guys have homes and probably have done this stuff before.

I have a light switch I'd like to move over..........say 6" down in our garage because there are 3 garages and I am walling off 1 and 2 to make them seperate. The light swtich for garage #2 is on #1's side of the wall that I am building. I took the switch off the wall but the wires aren't long enough to extend them over to where I want it extended.

So my question is............can I wire nut, use a crimper, solder extensions onto the wires that aren't long enough to make them long enough? As long as it's the same guage and everything as the original wire?

I only ask because I am very fluent in automotive wiring (stereos/sensors etc....) and know I can do any of the above to make something OK, though I always know a fresh run is 100% and a crimp or solder is pretty close. I just know that's with 12v stuff, LOL not 120v home stuff.

Any help would be greatly appricated!

Get a good book. Home depot has a ton of them.

If you are at all nervous, HAVE SOMEONE WHO KNOWS WHAT THEY ARE DOING LOOK AT IT.

 

[SkaredShtles]

A junction box.........is like the metal box that is recessed into the wall where the swtich is correct? I got one of those but I didn't want to mount it inside the wall, just tack it onto the side. The box is like it'd fit a switch or outlet, made of metal, and has tabs that you can break away so you can get the wires into the box. Is that a junction box?

Those look like the ones.

 

[DRB]

Get a good book. Home depot has a ton of them.

If you are at all nervous, HAVE SOMEONE WHO KNOWS WHAT THEY ARE DOING LOOK AT IT.

Ahh come on... what's the worse that could happen if he screws it up?

 

[Spunger]

Get a good book. Home depot has a ton of them.

If you are at all nervous, HAVE SOMEONE WHO KNOWS WHAT THEY ARE DOING LOOK AT IT.

No, if I can wire amps/speakers/sensors/digital ignitions whatever I have confidence in my wiring capabilites, I've just never wired anything in a house. It's not like I'm trying to run 20ft of wire, I just want to move a swtich 6" over on the wall.

I understand the use of junction boxes. I didn't know what they were called but I knew that was what I wanted. You usually can't see them when the walls are put up but they are at all the outlets/switches etc...

I'm just trying to figure out if I can remove the current switch, lengthen the wires enough, put a junction box up on the wall, run the new wires to it, and connect the switch back up (phew). That's my end goal.

 

[BikeGeek]

A junction box.........is like the metal box that is recessed into the wall where the swtich is correct? I got one of those but I didn't want to mount it inside the wall, just tack it onto the side. The box is like it'd fit a switch or outlet, made of metal, and has tabs that you can break away so you can get the wires into the box. Is that a junction box?

That's a switch box. A junction box is typically a little larger with punchouts on all sides, including the cover. It's simply to house your connections and is usually inside the wall. The wires that come from your junction box then go to your switch boxes that could mounted outside the wall if you wished.

 

[johnbryanpeters]

...I didn't want to mount it inside the wall, just tack it onto the side.

Get a surface-mount box.

 

[Brian HCM#1]

Any new connections MUST be place in a junction box. Just use the existing switch box as the junction box then make a jumper wire into the new box. The old switch/junction box just needs a metal cover and you're good to go. Wirenuts work just fine, make sure you get the proper size ones, it will list it on the package.

 

[splat]

and don't for get to turn off the circuit breaker first.

 

[Spunger]

Any new connections MUST be place in a junction box. Just use the existing switch box as the junction box then make a jumper wire into the new box. The old switch/junction box just needs a metal cover and you're good to go. Wirenuts work just fine, make sure you get the proper size ones, it will list it on the package.

When I pulled the cover off the switch box I Noticed that there were some wires that had been tapped into with wire nuts (I think for the sensor light outside) and then there's the wires that go to the switch. I figured I could just wirenut new wire onto those wires that went to the switch, move the switch, re-attach the wires and be done. It seems pretty stright forward, I just wanted to know if that's ok to do. I'd be using the correct guage wire and such.

I was thinking about that.......couldn't I just use where the switch is at now as the junction box? There will NEVER be anything else ran off that spot, no outlets or anything, just a stupid light switch.

 

[Spunger]

and don't for get to turn off the circuit breaker first.

LOL I know, I've been shocked by 12v, it's nothing, but 120v would probably send me on my butt quickly! That one I know

 

[H8R]

No, if I can wire amps/speakers/sensors/digital ignitions whatever I have confidence in my wiring capabilites, I've just never wired anything in a house. It's not like I'm trying to run 20ft of wire, I just want to move a swtich 6" over on the wall.

Meh. I wasn't bagging on your amptitude.

Not a bad idea to get a book that deals with household wiring. Household AC is a different animal. You can end up wiring the hot/neutral/ground incorrectly and the results can be tragic.

Just a good idea to get a solid understanding of it.

 

[Brian HCM#1]

When I pulled the cover off the switch box I Noticed that there were some wires that had been tapped into with wire nuts (I think for the sensor light outside) and then there's the wires that go to the switch. I figured I could just wirenut new wire onto those wires that went to the switch, move the switch, re-attach the wires and be done. It seems pretty stright forward, I just wanted to know if that's ok to do. I'd be using the correct guage wire and such.

I was thinking about that.......couldn't I just use where the switch is at now as the junction box? There will NEVER be anything else ran off that spot, no outlets or anything, just a stupid light switch.

Thats fine to do, just leave the least amount necessary of wirenuts.

 

[johnbryanpeters]

1) Mount the new switch box.
2) Turn off power.
3) Measure to make sure it's turned off.
4) Remove switch, noting carefully where wires go.
5) Run your wire.
6) Connect switch in new box.
7) Make your connections in old switch box (which is a junction box).
8) Double check your work.
9) Turn on power and test.

 

[N8 v2.0]

LOL I know, I've been shocked by 12v, it's nothing, but 120v would probably send me on my butt quickly! That one I know

FYI... it isn't the voltage that gets ya... it's the amperage.

 

[johnbryanpeters]

FYI... it isn't the voltage that gets ya... it's the amperage.

20 ma is enough.

 

[lux]

Ok, guys. Licensed electrical contractor here. Some good advice has been given; some not-so-good; but nothing hazardous.

Your switch box is a junction box. Soldering is OK and used to be how all connections were made, then changed to connecting neutrals, then fell outta favor for the faster method of wirenutting.

Here is how to affect your modification:

Turn off the circuit breaker for that switch.

Unless the existing box is where one of your new walls is going to land, simply run your Romex (or whatever brand name NM wire you'll be using) from the old box to the new.

You need to run the wire INSIDE the wall. If you'r not planning on peeling the wall covering off (sheetrock, paneling, etc.), and drilling holes through the studs, then you must run the romex in an external, surface-mounted conduit such as Wiremold.

If you need to move the old box, well, you might wanna PM me and I can call you and walk you through it (my cell phone plan covers outgoing for inside the US).


This work occurs in the old box:

Connect, with a wirenut, the new white wire to the wire which used to attach to the bottom lug of the switch.

Remark that wire black using either electrical tape or a sharpie.

Connect the black wire to the wire which was attached to the top of the switch.

Attach the ground wire, if sytem is grounded, to the bundle of ground wires in the box (either bare or green insulated).

Affix blank cover.


This work occurs in the new box:

Attach the white wire to the bottom of the switch and remark it black as you did in the junction box.

Attach the black wire to the top of the switch.

Attach the ground to the ground (green) lug on the switch.

Screw switch into box

Affix switch cover.


Viola, you've just created a switch leg!

 

[lux]

Oh, and a home handi-book on wiring would be a great idea. The ones I've seen have excellent diagrams and graphics for how to run wire, mount boxes, connect wires, staple, etc, etc...

And Brian HCM#1: If the existing box is plastic, I'd suggest a plastic blank cover in lieu of metal, just 'cause there's no way of grounding a metal cover to a plastic box.

Well, there are some pain-in-the ass ways, but plastic just assures one will never lean up against an energized cover plate.

If one were to be standing on a cement floor when touching an energized fixture -- see ya!

 

[Spunger]

Well........I wasn't able to move it because the wire wasn't wire, it was solid core (for whatever that's worth). There was no normal twisted wires in the wall. All solid core. SO I just left it rather than mess with it.

Thanks Lux for the info, I know home electrical is scary for most but I'm not scare of it as long as it looks familar, it's when it's not familar is when I go duh...LOL

 

[davep]

All home wireing is solid (at least anything modern) no big deal just use wire nuts to connect them. You could easily do this for under 20$maybe under 10$. I am NOT an electrician but i was able to do all the wireing on a 3 room 1000 sq ft addition by just referencing a $5 basic home wireing/code book i picked up at a local elec. supply placeand talking to the guys there. Follow the instructions above! You will need a new switch box, a cover for your old box, a couple of feet of romex (12 ga) and two romex clamps (dont know the real name) for where the romex enters the boxes, and some wire nuts. You can do it!

 

[lux]

...I wasn't able to move it because the wire wasn't wire, it was solid core (for whatever that's worth). There was no normal twisted wires in the wall. All solid core...

davep is correct. There are two common types of conductors -- Stranded (see note below) and Solid. NM (which stands for non-metallic outer insulation) is the most common wire for residential wiring. It contains solid, rather than stranded, conductors. Stranded is typically used as single-insulated conductor installed in metal or pvc conduit.


(Note on stranded: I assume you are referring to stranded wire as twisted -- twisted wire does exist, but is not used in many residential or commercial building wiring situations. Mostly machine, communication, sound applications.)

 

[DRB]

What's the odds on a "Get Well Soon" thread for Spunger in the near future?

 

[Reactor]

220v shocks you on your ass.

120v makes you lock on with a kung fu grip if you're unfortunate enough.

300 Volts - DC, makes you lay there rigid, trying to scream.

 

[lux]

Biggest hit I ever took was 277V AC (one phase leg off a 480V 3 phase system). Went in my finger and out my forearm. Felt like I'd been hit in the arm with a baseball bat.

 

[SkaredShtles]

<snip>
This work occurs in the old box:

Connect, with a wirenut, the new white wire to the wire which used to attach to the bottom lug of the switch.

Remark that wire black using either electrical tape or a sharpie.

Connect the black wire to the wire which was attached to the top of the switch.

What if the old switch was installed upside down?

 

[johnbryanpeters]

What if the old switch was installed upside down?

Ass pony...

 

[lux]

What if the old switch was installed upside down?

Makes absolutely no difference. Ass pony...

 

[johnbryanpeters]

Based on Spunger's responses to the answers he got, it's amazing he hasn't killed himself yet working on stereos.

At least he finally had the sense to leave it alone.

 

[SkaredShtles]

Makes absolutely no difference. Ass pony...

 

[lux]

Based on Spunger's responses to the answers he got, it's amazing he hasn't killed himself yet working on stereos.

At least he finally had the sense to leave it alone.

You might be on to something there.

 

[Spunger]

Based on Spunger's responses to the answers he got, it's amazing he hasn't killed himself yet working on stereos.

At least he finally had the sense to leave it alone.

Car stereo (or anything in a car that's electrical) is easy. As long as it's all disconnected you just hook everything up and go from there. I usually draw it out before I get into it so I know if it's going to work or not. Hooking up 1 amp is a piece of cake, but try doing 3-4, with 6-8 speakers, with extra batteries/capacitors and such and you really have to make sure all the wires are not only the right lengths but guage as well. I've never had 1 problem with automotive electronics. You can't really mess up postive's and negitives too much

But the home stuff I stopped on. I understand everything is solid core now, and that again, all I'm use to seeing is 1/0 guage stereo wire (which is twisted) to speaker wire (which is also twisted). So seeing a solid core wire threw me off. I can see it isn't hard to move it if need be. NO I haven't killed myself yet with home electrical :angry: but I do know when to stop. I imagine I could have figured it out with the help of the guys on here or a book but I fixed it anyways. All is ok.

Thanks again though guys for your help and words of encouragement (on dying and such) as it helped my understanding of it and my future confidence with home wiring j/k. It did help though as I've never even pulled off a face plate on the wall to see how everything is. But this house has wiring from like the 50's so it's all old stuff. I know new stuff is the same but it's probably laid out differently then here.

Thanks again though guys!

 

[lux]

...But this house has wiring from like the 50's so it's all old stuff...

One last thing then I'll let it lay.

If your wiring is from the late 50's, you may have aluminum wire. If so, there exist special wirenuts (CU/Alu) to handle copper to aluminum connections.

Good luck!