Quantcast

Fort Bragg soldier flees to Canada

N8 v2.0

Not the sharpest tool in the shed
Oct 18, 2002
11,003
149
The Cleft of Venus
Fort Bragg soldier flees to Canada
Indep. Weekly | 11 Feb 04 | PATRICK O'NEILL

On New Year's Eve, Jeremy Hinzman sat in a McDonald's on N.C. 401 in Fuquay-Varina explaining his precarious situation. On Dec. 20, Hinzman, a U.S. Army specialist stationed at Fort Bragg, got the news he had dreaded. His unit--the 504th Brigade, 2nd Battalion--would be shipping out to Iraq shortly after the new year for an indefinite deployment in the war on terrorism. Last year, Hinzman, 25, the father of a 1-year-old son, was deployed for more than eight months to Afghanistan. When he left, Hinzman's son, Liam, was just 7 months old. When Hinzman returned, Liam was walking and didn't remember his father. While he didn't see any combat in that first deployment, Hinzman said he had a bad feeling about going to Iraq.

In Iraq, Hinzman, said he felt like he would have to do some things he'd regret. During Christmas leave, Hinzman, who is a member of the Fayetteville Friends Meeting, discussed his options with his wife, Nga Nguyen. He could go to Iraq--an option both he and Nguyen rejected. He could refuse the deployment order and face court martial and a likely prison term. Or he could follow a plan of action that thousands of young men like himself had taken during the Vietnam War--he could flee to Canada.

He chose option three. On Jan. 2, Hinzman and his family packed up their small car with a few essentials, leaving almost all of their possessions behind. They left post housing under the cover of darkness for the 17-hour drive to the U.S.-Canadian border. Quakers living in the U.S. made contacts in Ontario, and the family was set up with places to stay until they moved into a Toronto apartment on Feb. 1.

READ MORE
 

jdcamb

Tool Time!
Feb 17, 2002
20,067
8,816
Nowhere Man!
Originally posted by Jorvik
Hope he comes back to the US so he can be shot for cowardice.
Actually I think it took a lot of balls to do what he did. If he is a coward then why haven't you gone over yet? My question to you is how many Patriots from Lexington MA are currently serving in Iraq and Afghanistan as compared to Brockton, Lowell, or Dorchester? I read the Boston papers and everytime someone dies serving their country as I did they are always from those 3 towns. Very few are from the whitebread towns like Lexington or Belmont. Right? Put your money were your mouth is buddy.....join today and I am sure you can go have some fun in the desert.....jdcamb
 

BurlyShirley

Rex Grossman Will Rise Again
Jul 4, 2002
19,180
17
TN
Originally posted by jdcamb
Actually I think it took a lot of balls to do what he did. If he is a coward then why haven't you gone over yet? My question to you is how many Patriots from Lexington MA are currently serving in Iraq and Afghanistan as compared to Brockton, Lowell, or Dorchester? I read the Boston papers and everytime someone dies serving their country as I did they are always from those 3 towns. Very few are from the whitebread towns like Lexington or Belmont. Right? Put your money were your mouth is buddy.....join today and I am sure you can go have some fun in the desert.....jdcamb
I dont think it took alot of balls to wuss out of a war. He had the training, he signed the contract...he should pay the price for being a deserter. If everyone in the service just decided they were going to fight only for the issues they agreed with...well, we wouldnt have a very effective force now would we?
Jorvik's already signed up by the way JD, so hopefully he will have some fun.
 

Andyman_1970

Turbo Monkey
Apr 4, 2003
3,105
5
The Natural State
Originally posted by jdcamb
Actually I think it took a lot of balls to do what he did. If he is a coward then why haven't you gone over yet? My question to you is how many Patriots from Lexington MA are currently serving in Iraq and Afghanistan as compared to Brockton, Lowell, or Dorchester? I read the Boston papers and everytime someone dies serving their country as I did they are always from those 3 towns. Very few are from the whitebread towns like Lexington or Belmont. Right? Put your money were your mouth is buddy.....join today and I am sure you can go have some fun in the desert.....jdcamb
How is running away from your commitment to your country and ultimatly your family "take balls"?

Isn't the risk you run when you join the military is that you may lose your life?

What was your point about few of them are from "whitebread" towns? Almost all the folks I know either going or have gone to Iraq or Afganistan are white, and I live in Arkansas with a MUCH larger black population than up north.

BTW, if I could have joined (I was denied) I would have and would love to be "playing in the sandbox" right now serving my country.
 

LordOpie

MOTHER HEN
Oct 17, 2002
21,022
3
Denver
did he run because he didn't believe in the cause or because he didn't want to fulfill his commitment?

He as in the Army, right? Not the National Guard? I could see people signing up for 2 weeks/year, a weekend a month saying, "Hey, I signed up to fill domestic positions of those going over seas... not actually going overseas. Or helping out with a domestic crisis."
 

zod

Turbo Monkey
Jul 17, 2003
1,376
0
G-County, NC
Originally posted by LordOpie
did he run because he didn't believe in the cause or because he didn't want to fulfill his commitment?

He as in the Army, right? Not the National Guard? I could see people signing up for 2 weeks/year, a weekend a month saying, "Hey, I signed up to fill domestic positions of those going over seas... not actually going overseas. Or helping out with a domestic crisis."
People who sign up for the National Guard should understand that they can end up over seas.....I have a friend in the Nat. Guard who is getting ready to deploy to Iraq.

Whether this dude deserted b/c he didn't believe in the cause or because he didn't want to fulfill his commitment doesn't really matter, either way it's inexcusible. You sign up for service making a committment to do what your C.O.C. orders you to do, personal feelings are to be pushed aside.

I have no problem with him deserting as long as he loses his citizenship and is never aloud back in the country again....along with his wife.
 

ohio

The Fresno Kid
Nov 26, 2001
6,649
26
SF, CA
Originally posted by Andyman_1970
How is running away from your commitment to your country and ultimatly your family "take balls"?
I'll agree that he ran away from his committment to his country. Could you expand what you mean by "ultimately [his] family?" From my point of view, it was his commitment to his family (among other things) that convinced him to stay... you'd have to ask him, but for me it would be much easier to go if I didn't have a responsibility to a wife and child.

By the way, I'm not necessarily of the opinion that what he did was right or acceptable... still making up my mind. That's why I'm curious about this point.
 

Andyman_1970

Turbo Monkey
Apr 4, 2003
3,105
5
The Natural State
Originally posted by ohio
I'll agree that he ran away from his committment to his country. Could you expand what you mean by "ultimately [his] family?" From my point of view, it was his commitment to his family (among other things) that convinced him to stay... you'd have to ask him, but for me it would be much easier to go if I didn't have a responsibility to a wife and child.

By the way, I'm not necessarily of the opinion that what he did was right or acceptable... still making up my mind. That's why I'm curious about this point.
My point if view is his commitment to his country is also a commitment to his family. His commitment to his country is to protect and defend the US, if his family are citizens then his commitment is ultimatly invovles the protection of his family also.
 

jdcamb

Tool Time!
Feb 17, 2002
20,067
8,816
Nowhere Man!
Originally posted by Andyman_1970
How is running away from your commitment to your country and ultimatly your family "take balls"?

Isn't the risk you run when you join the military is that you may lose your life?

What was your point about few of them are from "whitebread" towns? Almost all the folks I know either going or have gone to Iraq or Afganistan are white, and I live in Arkansas with a MUCH larger black population than up north.

BTW, if I could have joined (I was denied) I would have and would love to be "playing in the sandbox" right now serving my country.
When he signed up he may have not really thought the whole Military Service thing out. He was what 18/19 years old (when you make the best life decisions right??). He went to Afghanistan and served. He came home and got married, had a child, and then Iraq pops up. He then decided with his wife that he couldn't fullfill his obligation in Iraq based on the fact that he didn't think it was a just war. So he decided to opt out. Now seeing as there are very few opt outs he decided to take matters in his own hands. That took balls. I personally think he should have gone ahead fulfilled his obligation, then leave the service. He did sign the papers knowing that he might have to serve. To many folks use the the Reservist system to go to school and think the Military Obligation part isn't important. They have recently learned they were wrong.

Whitebread in the context I used it is Rich Affluent Suburbs where the folks have big silver spoons and plenty of other options in life then serving their country or for that matter their communities. It has nothing to do with Race. Lexington is indeed one of those communities. It sounds as if Jorvik isn't one of those individuals and I am glad Jorvik is putting his money where his mouth is. We need more Jorviks......jdcamb
 

Andyman_1970

Turbo Monkey
Apr 4, 2003
3,105
5
The Natural State
Originally posted by jdcamb
When he signed up he may have not really thought the whole Military Service thing out. He was what 18/19 years old (when you make the best life decisions right??).
And your point is? When I was 18 I signed the dotted line for my student loans not fully knowing how long it would take to pay them off. Now that I'm "older and wiser" I would not have done that. Now since I have had a change of heart and I don't really want the responsibility of paying them off does that mean I can stop paying on them and get off scott free??

Originally posted by jdcamb
He went to Afghanistan and served.
If he was called to Afganistan with the MOS he has then he shouldn't be too surprised that he is now called to Iraq. I mean comeon if you're based at Ft. Bragg what do you think is going to happen?

Originally posted by jdcamb
He then decided with his wife that he couldn't fullfill his obligation in Iraq based on the fact that he didn't think it was a just war.
I don't think they ask you when you are indoctrinated if you will serve "if you think it's just". Burley Surly might be able to shed more light on that.

Originally posted by jdcamb
So he decided to opt out. Now seeing as there are very few opt outs he decided to take matters in his own hands. That took balls.
No it takes "balls" to follow through with the obligations and commitments you make. Anyone can run away from their obligations, which has become rapant in our society (i.e. deadbeat dads, bankruptcy[sp?], litigation over "coffee that's too hot", etc.......).
 

jdcamb

Tool Time!
Feb 17, 2002
20,067
8,816
Nowhere Man!
Originally posted by Andyman_1970
And your point is? When I was 18 I signed the dotted line for my student loans not fully knowing how long it would take to pay them off. Now that I'm "older and wiser" I would not have done that. Now since I have had a change of heart and I don't really want the responsibility of paying them off does that mean I can stop paying on them and get off scott free??



If he was called to Afganistan with the MOS he has then he shouldn't be too surprised that he is now called to Iraq. I mean comeon if you're based at Ft. Bragg what do you think is going to happen?



I don't think they ask you when you are indoctrinated if you will serve "if you think it's just". Burley Surly might be able to shed more light on that.



No it takes "balls" to follow through with the obligations and commitments you make. Anyone can run away from their obligations, which has become rapant in our society (i.e. deadbeat dads, bankruptcy[sp?], litigation over "coffee that's too hot", etc.......).
My point is it takes balls to (even though I don't agree with his actions) to go AWOL, take your family on the run, escape to another country, and start a new life based on what he believed. Who are we to question it? I mean if he got caught then he could possibly get life in prison and all the ugliness involved with that. That was ballsy....stupid but ballsy. Reniging on a student loan isn't even in the same ballpark buddy. To qualify it takes balls to rob a bank too, even though it is wrong and stupid.

The other point I had is that some 18 year olds are not mature enough to make the life and death decision that joining the military involves. No recruiter would ever admit that though. They feel they can make a man out of a boy. Instead of recruiting everything with a pulse, they might try to recruit those suited for the military. I know I wasn't suited for the military and that was why I didn't make a career out of it.

Your right on the Ft. Bragg point.

No when your indoctrinated they don't ask you that. In fact they don't ask you anything, they tell you! I remember the "ceremony" and a foolish youngman who was squashed when he asked a simple question before he signed. It was funny at the time but now that I tink about it. They should have answered it before he signed. They didn't....

If it wasn't for deadbeat dads, bankruptcy, and litigation over "coffee that is to hot" etc. I wouldn't have a job
:D ....jdcamb
 

jdcamb

Tool Time!
Feb 17, 2002
20,067
8,816
Nowhere Man!
Originally posted by ohio
I'll agree that he ran away from his committment to his country. Could you expand what you mean by "ultimately [his] family?" From my point of view, it was his commitment to his family (among other things) that convinced him to stay... you'd have to ask him, but for me it would be much easier to go if I didn't have a responsibility to a wife and child.

By the way, I'm not necessarily of the opinion that what he did was right or acceptable... still making up my mind. That's why I'm curious about this point.
Do you believe your country has a committment to you? ....jdcamb
 

LordOpie

MOTHER HEN
Oct 17, 2002
21,022
3
Denver
Originally posted by zod
Whether this dude deserted b/c he didn't believe in the cause or because he didn't want to fulfill his commitment doesn't really matter, either way it's inexcusible.
yes, except that if his honest reason was he didn't believe in the cause, then he did have a fourth option, I think, and someone in the know would have to elaborate on conscientious objector.
 

ohio

The Fresno Kid
Nov 26, 2001
6,649
26
SF, CA
Originally posted by jdcamb
Do you believe your country has a committment to you? ....jdcamb
I believe my country should have a committment to me, as I do have a committment to my country.
 

BurlyShirley

Rex Grossman Will Rise Again
Jul 4, 2002
19,180
17
TN
Originally posted by jdcamb
To qualify it takes balls to rob a bank too, even though it is wrong and stupid.
Yes, and bank robbers are prosecuted...even if they only robbed the bank because of personal beleifs. Not that that's ever really happened, but someone could easily claim that and would suffer the same fate.
If you dont fit in with the military, you do your 4 and get out...you dont screw over your family, unit and the taxpayers. The role of the military is to perform the will of the people...the people's elected officials wanted to go to war...so the military did. Personal feelings should be a non issue. This guy IMO for whatever his reason (cowardice, conscience, rebellion) should be prosecuted regardless.
 

jdcamb

Tool Time!
Feb 17, 2002
20,067
8,816
Nowhere Man!
Originally posted by BurlySurly
Not that that's ever really happened.

Yes not that thats ever happened...

If you dont fit in with the military, you do your 4 and get out...you dont screw over your family, unit and the taxpayers. The role of the military is to perform the will of the people...the people's elected officials wanted to go to war...so the military did.

Thats how I would have handled it. But hey I am lazy and always take the path of least resistance....

Personal feelings should be a non issue.

Dude personal feelings always matter no matter what. Personal feelings are who we are. I can't control how I feel, can you? You responded to my post based on your basic need to express your personal feelings. Right? Can everyone in the military feel the same about everything? Is there never disagreement among the ranks? I worked for the DOD and had contact with all branches of the military and they all hated each other, all worked independently unless they were "ordered" to. Why do you think they have MP's and Shore Patrol? To break up fights between the Army and the Marines, the Navy and the Air Force, whatever.... Personal feelings are always an issue and we have no control over that.....jdcamb
 
If this guy was a Quaker, what the Hell was he doing joining the Army in the first place? The free food? The spiffy duds? And if he became a Quaker after joining, his religious rationale for desertion becomes suspect.

IMO, he volunteered. If he comes back, prosecute his sorry butt.

This type of thing happened during our first excursion into Iraq. I can remember seeing an interview with this whiny little soldier who actually said, "I never thought I would have to fight. I wanted the free education". What a maroon.
 

RhinofromWA

Brevity R Us
Aug 16, 2001
4,622
0
Lynnwood, WA
What are we argueing? If it took balls?

Having balls to run doesn't releive you of the reality that what you did was wrong (even if "right" for you) and that you will be help accountable for running.

Military personel who run should be handled accordingly. "I didn't think I would have to fight" is a non issue. Ignorance is never a defense....not a good one atleast.

If he objected I am sure there are ways to leave the military.....but he chose the easy route....if it wasn't easier he would have stayed and did it correctly.

I think he ran away afraid and had no balls (though he would probably punch my lights out at a bar if I told him that) Volunteering for the military means you are ready for war...no matter if you actually go or not. That is why they provide for you the training and assistance durring and after you leave. Helping with school is a perk of duty...not the reason to sign up. I think paying for an education for soldiers is a good thing. People crying that they thought they were getting a free education for dressing up and playing soldier during peace times is ignorant, but no reason to refuse to go into action.

New family or not, he had a duty to the military that he refused and ran from to escape answering for, shows his lack of courage. If you have ideals like that then you shouldn't be in the military.

Oye, that was longer than I planned on this post.
 

Jorvik

Monkey
Jan 29, 2002
810
0
I honestly don't know anymore.
Originally posted by jdcamb
Actually I think it took a lot of balls to do what he did. If he is a coward then why haven't you gone over yet? My question to you is how many Patriots from Lexington MA are currently serving in Iraq and Afghanistan as compared to Brockton, Lowell, or Dorchester? I read the Boston papers and everytime someone dies serving their country as I did they are always from those 3 towns. Very few are from the whitebread towns like Lexington or Belmont. Right? Put your money were your mouth is buddy.....join today and I am sure you can go have some fun in the desert.....jdcamb
I've been waiting to go over for some time now. Swore in at MEPS on June 26, 2003. Had knee surgery which temporarily disqualified me. Don't leave for Parris Island until April 26th now (tenative). Signed up for Infantry. All I do now is train. I'm PTing near 30 hours a week, and when I'm not PTing or working, I'm either kicking knowledge about the Marine Corps or learning more hand to hand combat. I'm going to go to war, don't you worry about that.

From Lexington in the past 3 graduating classes of the high school, 9 (off the top of my head) have joined the Marines. One of my best friends is at West Point right now, and I know a few others who are in the AF Academy. Not a large amount choose the service, but not a tiny amount either. Do I think more people should be going? Absolutly. Too many of the kids in the towns around me take what they have for granted. They all want to be lawers, doctors, and engineers. Many of them should, but quite a few are wasting their time because they only do what everybody expects them to do. Already a couple of my friends have dropped out of school their freshman year in college. Why? Their parents made them go to school but they lacked the maturity to actually study. I'll probably eventually wind up in college, but by then I'll have the discipline from the Marine Corps to actually put forth the effort required. I'm ranting now, I'll stop.
 

jdcamb

Tool Time!
Feb 17, 2002
20,067
8,816
Nowhere Man!
Originally posted by Jorvik
I've been waiting to go over for some time now. Swore in at MEPS on June 26, 2003. Had knee surgery which temporarily disqualified me. Don't leave for Parris Island until April 26th now (tenative). Signed up for Infantry. All I do now is train. I'm PTing near 30 hours a week, and when I'm not PTing or working, I'm either kicking knowledge about the Marine Corps or learning more hand to hand combat. I'm going to go to war, don't you worry about that.

From Lexington in the past 3 graduating classes of the high school, 9 (off the top of my head) have joined the Marines. One of my best friends is at West Point right now, and I know a few others who are in the AF Academy. Not a large amount choose the service, but not a tiny amount either. Do I think more people should be going? Absolutly. Too many of the kids in the towns around me take what they have for granted. They all want to be lawers, doctors, and engineers. Many of them should, but quite a few are wasting their time because they only do what everybody expects them to do. Already a couple of my friends have dropped out of school their freshman year in college. Why? Their parents made them go to school but they lacked the maturity to actually study. I'll probably eventually wind up in college, but by then I'll have the discipline from the Marine Corps to actually put forth the effort required. I'm ranting now, I'll stop.
Good luck for you Brother. You sound like you have a good head on your shoulders. Be careful and be safe man. Keep us posted on how your doing too. Infantry ooh boy that takes some courage. Make us :monkey: proud.....jdcamb
 

BurlyShirley

Rex Grossman Will Rise Again
Jul 4, 2002
19,180
17
TN
Originally posted by Jorvik
Signed up for Infantry.
Pshhht!

Be a man and go Public Affairs...maybe you could be a Combat Correspondent like me someday.:p Life is hard when Im typing up press releases and doing on-camera interviews...let me tell you.

As far as wanting to go to war...if that's what you REALLY want...you'll end up sitting in Okinawa or on a ship somewhere doing nothing for the entire time. Its just the way it always seemed for me. Good luck...and Im going to write you in boot camp...maybe talk to your DI's so you get the special "monkey" treatment.
 
Originally posted by Jorvik
I've been waiting to go over for some time now. Swore in at MEPS on June 26, 2003. Had knee surgery which temporarily disqualified me. Don't leave for Parris Island until April 26th now (tenative). Signed up for Infantry. All I do now is train. I'm PTing near 30 hours a week, and when I'm not PTing or working, I'm either kicking knowledge about the Marine Corps or learning more hand to hand combat. I'm going to go to war, don't you worry about that.

From Lexington in the past 3 graduating classes of the high school, 9 (off the top of my head) have joined the Marines. One of my best friends is at West Point right now, and I know a few others who are in the AF Academy. Not a large amount choose the service, but not a tiny amount either. Do I think more people should be going? Absolutly. Too many of the kids in the towns around me take what they have for granted. They all want to be lawers, doctors, and engineers. Many of them should, but quite a few are wasting their time because they only do what everybody expects them to do. Already a couple of my friends have dropped out of school their freshman year in college. Why? Their parents made them go to school but they lacked the maturity to actually study. I'll probably eventually wind up in college, but by then I'll have the discipline from the Marine Corps to actually put forth the effort required. I'm ranting now, I'll stop.
I was Infantry for a little over 9 years. I Invaded Panama in 1989 only 2 years after joining. Served 2 tours on the DMZ in Korea, been to the desert 3 times, etc. I hated as much as I loved it at times, and it was hard to leave my family. I made a promise to serve my country and to obey the orders of the Commander in Chief (president). I had soldiers in my unit who were there for the college money. Then they were the soldiers that were there because it was their passion. This guy who ran....he is easily forgotten, but people like you will not be forgotten.
Oh and the skills / disipline for college will not be gained from the military. When I got out and entered class after 9 years in the infantry (no females) going to class was my priority....it was full of beautiful women! Thats the discipline my man! :D
 

Jorvik

Monkey
Jan 29, 2002
810
0
I honestly don't know anymore.
Originally posted by BurlySurly
Pshhht!

Be a man and go Public Affairs...maybe you could be a Combat Correspondent like me someday.:p Life is hard when Im typing up press releases and doing on-camera interviews...let me tell you.

As far as wanting to go to war...if that's what you REALLY want...you'll end up sitting in Okinawa or on a ship somewhere doing nothing for the entire time. Its just the way it always seemed for me. Good luck...and Im going to write you in boot camp...maybe talk to your DI's so you get the special "monkey" treatment.
I'll give you my company address as soon as I can. My ship date isn't set in stone yet, because I still have to be cleared by the doctors at MEPS in mid-April

Thanks for all the kind words y'all, it really means a lot.
 

Transcend

My Nuts Are Flat
Apr 18, 2002
18,040
3
Towing the party line.
Canada accepting him as a refugee is absolute BS. I can understand during vietnam, when citizens were being conscripted. Let's face it, some people just aren't cut out for that.

But for an idiot to JOIN the army of his own free will just to get some $, and then run crying when it's time to ACTUALLY do the damn job you were trained for...

It makes me angry. As Yoda would say "Do, or do not. There is no try."
 

Jorvik

Monkey
Jan 29, 2002
810
0
I honestly don't know anymore.
Originally posted by Damn True
Someone refresh my memory on what penalty the UCMJ provides for desertion?

This wuss deserves every bit of what he gets for abandoning his unit and breaking his commitment.
Death for during a time of war. I was wrong to say in my first post that it was cowardice (it is, but just not the UCMJ definition of it, I believe).
 

jdcamb

Tool Time!
Feb 17, 2002
20,067
8,816
Nowhere Man!
Originally posted by Transcend
Canada accepting him as a refugee is absolute BS. I can understand during vietnam, when citizens were being conscripted.......It makes me angry. As Yoda would say "Do, or do not. There is no try."
What I don't understand is why isn't the US gov trying to extradict him? I know Canada won't extradict if the person is facing capital punishment for murder. But they usually just indict the person for lifetime imprisonment then sort it out when the person gets back to the States. Is this because the Canadian gov doesn't support the war in Iraq? If he deserted from Afghanistan would they extradict him? Canada supports and sends troops to there.... We do have a active and broad extradition treaty with Canada. Is he really a Refugee? Come on N8 we need the whole story here :D ......jdcamb
 

Transcend

My Nuts Are Flat
Apr 18, 2002
18,040
3
Towing the party line.
Originally posted by jdcamb
What I don't understand is why isn't the US gov trying to extradict him? I know Canada won't extradict if the person is facing capital punishment for murder. But they usually just indict the person for lifetime imprisonment then sort it out when the person gets back to the States. Is this because the Canadian gov doesn't support the war in Iraq? If he deserted from Afghanistan would they extradict him? Canada supports and sends troops to there.... We do have a active and broad extradition treaty with Canada. Is he really a Refugee? Come on N8 we need the whole story here :D ......jdcamb
According to international law (my current speciality) he technically IS a refugee, as he faces persecution in his homeland, and thus, cannot WILL NOT extradict him.

Canada has a very liberal and braod approach to this sort of thing, he will not be sent back to the us as long as he faces charges for desertion.

As a side note, Canada has NEVER extracted any derserters (including during 'nam)
 

Damn True

Monkey Pimp
Sep 10, 2001
4,015
3
Between a rock and a hard place.
Originally posted by Transcend
According to international law (my current speciality) he technically IS a refugee, as he faces persecution in his homeland, and thus, cannot WILL NOT extradict him.

Canada has a very liberal and braod approach to this sort of thing, he will not be sent back to the us as long as he faces charges for desertion.

As a side note, Canada has NEVER extracted any derserters (including during 'nam)

Reason # 47238 to annex that puppy.
Reason # 22401 to dislike Canada. Harbouring cowards, deserters, criminals......yeah, ya'all ought to be real proud.
 

jdcamb

Tool Time!
Feb 17, 2002
20,067
8,816
Nowhere Man!
Originally posted by Transcend
ya we'll take the cowards and deserters, you guys can keep the rednecks, bigots and ass backwards leaders!
Isn't this covered by NAFTA? Isn't that a trade imbalance? Here is another glaring example of how Canada isn't holding there end of the fair trade bargain. Man how can you guys live with yourselves. We insist you take some of our rednecks, bigots and ass backwards leaders. You may have to change your hand gun laws first but hey fair is fair:D ......jdcamb
 

Transcend

My Nuts Are Flat
Apr 18, 2002
18,040
3
Towing the party line.
Originally posted by jdcamb
Isn't this covered by NAFTA? Isn't that a trade imbalance? Here is another glaring example of how Canada isn't holding there end of the fair trade bargain. Man how can you guys live with yourselves. We insist you take some of our rednecks, bigots and ass backwards leaders. You may have to change your hand gun laws first but hey fair is fair:D ......jdcamb
We had our assbackwards leader, he was lopsided, literally he talked outta the side of his mouth. He is gone now. Now we have a new leader, who aparently funnelled a few million into other people's pockets. Priceless.

I guess we can be happy in that we didnt invade random countries, of course, that's hard to do with 3 planes and 1 APC (and no money cuz they funnelled it all away into PR firms).:p

BTW nafta doesn't have a special asshat clause, I wish it did tho. Then we could trade me to Boulder in return for a mexican illegal (asssombrero??).
 

jdcamb

Tool Time!
Feb 17, 2002
20,067
8,816
Nowhere Man!
Originally posted by Transcend
Then we could trade me to Boulder in return for a mexican illegal
No can do.....Mr. Bush says we need all the Illegal aliens to stay here.....they are good for the economy. Sorry about that. Canadians only take the jobs we do want away when they come here (like in the Bike Industry!:D )...jdcamb