[RhinofromWA]

Man we are just not gonna agree on this one. It would be disengenous of them to advertise their products as being capable of hard use AND light weight, then turn around and hide behind some argument about consumer demand in the way you suggest.

You're right that depending on Fox's response, the customers might not have any other option. Except to buy a different fork next time. And that's what will happen.

I guess DH buyers are THAT stupid?

What do you expect, really, when you use Hard Use and Lightweight in the same concept in DHing?

If they buy a fork that was not right for "their intended abuse" than yes they should chalk it up to a learning experience and find a fork more suitable for their requirements. That should not be as hard to understand....yet the general public can't seem to grasp that concept.

 

[Zutroy]

Not to be rational or anything, but how many have broke verses in the market?

 

[AR_]

It's like what Keith Bontrager said (again).. 'cept this time it's just light

 

[ohio]

Hahaha, whoa Nelly, now hold on a second. I know that the fact that anything is warrantied at all is a huge bonus and that everyone is pretty much on their own as soon as a purchase is made.

But the reality is that Fox markets these forks as superior products for racing and freeride. Superior to other forks like the 888. They WANT people to buy their forks for this kind of riding. They are happy when they see lots of 40s at places like Whistler and Plattekill. They are convincing people to choose their product.

If the product is not fit for the intended uses - the uses they advertise - then they should make good on it. I agree there is a huge range of DH and freeride use. Sorry, but before you tell me this fork is better than a 888 or a Boxxer, you better make sure it can handle the same kind of riding. That's the reality here, and I don't really care what their warranty card and disclaimers say about it. This is their entry into this market - if they have a problem they better fix it.

Nice post. First reasonable justification for warranty replacement I've seen in 10 pages.

What it comes down to is that it doesn't matter whether something is a defect or not. It's very difficult to define what reasonable use for a DH fork is. However, if it's not holding up to use that it's competitors ARE holding up to, than it's in Fox's best interest to take care of those customers.

 

[OGRipper]

It's like what Keith Bontrager said (again).. 'cept this time it's just light

Funny, I was thinking at one point that this fork should satisfy the Bontrager conundrum, because it's not cheap.

If they buy a fork that was not right for "their intended abuse" than yes they should chalk it up to a learning experience and find a fork more suitable for their requirements.

If I ever said "intended abuse" it was Freudian, I'm pretty sure I said intended use.

What if they buy a fork for the advertised use? Aren't they entitled to think it's up to the task?

Like I said, we're just not going to agree but that's ok. Just let me if you ever sell DH forks ok?

 

[Zutroy]

Nice post. First reasonable justification for warranty replacement I've seen in 10 pages.

What it comes down to is that it doesn't matter whether something is a defect or not. It's very difficult to define what reasonable use for a DH fork is. However, if it's not holding up to use that it's competitors ARE holding up to, than it's in Fox's best interest to take care of those customers.

And you know there not holding up to what the others are cause you are getting failure reports from all the manufactures? Wasen't it about this time last year that the 888s were POSs and all of them were breaking, pre the ridemonley speak.

 

[OGRipper]

And you know there not holding up to what the others are cause you are getting failure reports from all the manufactures? Wasen't it about this time last year that the 888s were POSs and all of them were breaking, pre the ridemonley speak.

Well yeah but Marz gave free lowers and service for those that were defective.

Problems happen, especially with first run products. Nobody rational thinks otherwise. It's what the company does about it that makes the difference.

And with this post, we are now officially beating a dead horse. Congrats everyone!!

 

[Repack]

I had an interesting conversation today that made me change my mind. I asked the buyer/warranty guy at my old shop if he had heard any stories about arches breaking. He said no, but that they have had other issues with Fox products and that their tech/warranty dept is operating. He said that they have had two significant issues with 40s. One was brand new on a Demo 8 and the other belonged to a pro friend of mine ranked well within the top ten nationally. The pro had a damper blow up. When asked about warranty service, the user was told, you guys are the "test pilots". No deal. With the Demo 8 40, the fork came with air in one of the cartridges. It blew up after 4 days of riding. It took a month to get it back.

Since the subject of movie quotes has come up, anybody recognize,
"You can only hear that story about Richard Gear and the gerbil so many times before you start thinking its true." Or something like that. There could be a million different reasons for it, but it seems like Fox's customer service has gone down hill. Maybe they are being forced to do too much with too little from the corporate level, maybe not. But whatever it is, there seems to be a level of consistency between all of the complaints.

I am going to try to not reply to this post again. Everything about it sucks. I'm sorry for participating.

 

[James | Go-Ride]

I am going to try to not reply to this post again. Everything about it sucks. I'm sorry for participating.

Shut up, you're wrong. Argue more with us and don't concede any points, regardless of blatant evidence for one side or the other.

 

[OGRipper]

Richard Gear

I can't believe I haven't seen a Monkey with that screen name yet.

James, on a more important note, where are this year's moustache pics?

 

[James | Go-Ride]

I can't believe I haven't seen a Monkey with that screen name yet.

James, on a more important note, where are this year's moustache pics?

Same as last year. August 31st.

 

[zedro]

Have you looked at any of the Fox marketing? The website says it is "the strongest downhill fork made." The intended usage: DH. In other places they talk up and down about how racers and freeriders are winning races. They have Kyle Strait at the Rampage doing the biggest, nastiest hucks ever. Nowhere do they say, "It's a little lighter than the others and as a result we can't say for sure if it's as strong." .....

so? it is all those things, its been proven (well ok not the strongest part...). But out of all this, nothing says about how long it can take abuse. I know its a geeky engineering thing, but strength and toughness are not the same thing, and quite frequently the opposite. In almost any other (motor)sport, this would be obvious and a non-issue, but somehow we're diluded into believing theres miracle products until we all learn our lessons (again) and relearn what things are actually capable of.

When forks were getting bigger and bigger, weight was almost celebrated, we were in aww of the burlyness. Now the XC/roadie mentality of weight has come back but with the usual expectations of downhill tough.

They made a fork that has certain potential and certain limits, and they'll probably stick to that premise in the after sales.

 

[James | Go-Ride]

things about stuff.

. . . but somehow we're delusioned into believing there are miracle products . . .

. . . we were in awe of the burlyness . . .

 

[OGRipper]

so?

I'm not sure I get your point. These forks have not been available long enough that any regular consumer has been on one for more than a year or so. Are you saying that is too long to expect them to perform as advertised? Even the most race-specific parts should last for one season no?

I've said this enough times, and nothing anyone says here is going to change my opinion on this specific point: In this case, the "expectations of downhill tough" come from Fox's advertising and other marketing efforts as much as they do from unrealistic consumers. If the fork is not fit for the advertised use, they should warranty those that have already been sold and change the marketing. Again, I say "should" in the sense of what is right in my opinion, not what they are required to do.

It wouldn't be the first time a marketing department doesn't understand the actual capability of a product. But please don't try to tell me that they didn't know what people were going to do with these forks. Fox WANTS this market.

 

[ohio]

And you know there not holding up to what the others are cause you are getting failure reports from all the manufactures? Wasen't it about this time last year that the 888s were POSs and all of them were breaking, pre the ridemonley speak.

Whoa whoa whoa, cheeeeellllll booyyeeeeeeee.

I didn't say whether or not I thought Fox was in the wrong or not. I just said that the first valid argument I've seen for why Fox might address this issue was NOT because there may or may not be a defect, but because they may be driven by the market to deliver a product that is percieved to be as strong/tough/durable as its competitors.

Obviously it's not a necessity. The boxxer has done very well while filling a niche of "very light and tough enough" but I think they tread the line. If fox can't maintain an image/perception of being at least as strong as a boxxer, it doesn't matter what the engineering or the customer service truths are, their sales will suffer.

Now, having not done the engineering for the fork, nor seen the number of occurances versus the number of sales, nor having any experience with Fox cust service, I (unlike most of the jackasses in this thread) and not about to speculate on whether there really is a problem with them breaking, nor if there is, whether it's a defect or not.

 

[zedro]

....Even the most race-specific parts should last for one season no?

.....Fox's advertising and other marketing efforts ......

well thats what you expect in particular, unless you were were racing in just about any other sport.


And this industry is full of BS marketing, use your head instead of the brochure to tell you what to think (edit: dont mean to sound too ass-ey ). Some downright lie (or are completly ignorant) on claims that can be scientifically (dis)proven. Like it was said, people are putting this fork on a pedastle, and now the mud is flying. Its happened with just about every other race fork, and when the dust settles it'll be no different than knowing what the Boxxers or Dorados deficiencies are, and everyone will move on.

 

[Daver]

Well its probably null and void by now, but...

I picked my forks up today (saturday) from my shop, and Fox had not only done a 3day turnaround, but they even rebuilt the rest of the fork.

The following is important:

Cracked/bent parts are NOT a fox warranty matter- at the moment i have directions to replace lowers on forks that have NO other parts damaged and at my disgretion, BUT i believe fox will soon vito this lee-way. In bending and twisting impacts the brace is the first part to fail, ironically due to its rigidity.

I spoke to the owner XXXX XXXXXXX, his honest admission that he had crashed, then found the cracks tilted me towards giving this lee-way.

Straight from the horse's mouth fellas. I got my new (free lowers AND rebuild) and i'm stoked with fox customer service in Australia.

Oh, and "snowskilz "- go jam a 3" riser bar up your ass- if you didn't send your lowers to Fox, then i think that your opinion is useless. Companies won't even consider a warranty or offer you new lowers at a discounted price unless they can see your fork.

 

[vitox]

. . . but somehow we're delusioned into believing there are miracle products . . .

. . . we were in awe of the burlyness . . .

i dunno really, i always thought it was fairly logical that there would be a problem like this down the line with the 40, i mean, its made out of the same (amount and type) materials as a boxxer, only spread out over a bigger area.

 

[OGRipper]

Well its probably null and void by now, but...

I picked my forks up today (saturday) from my shop, and Fox had not only done a 3day turnaround, but they even rebuilt the rest of the fork.



Straight from the horse's mouth fellas. I got my new (free lowers AND rebuild) and i'm stoked with fox customer service in Australia.

Oh, and "snowskilz "- go jam a 3" riser bar up your ass- if you didn't send your lowers to Fox, then i think that your opinion is useless. Companies won't even consider a warranty or offer you new lowers at a discounted price unless they can see your fork.

Thanks for that, it's not null and void at all, it's good to see that they took care of you, which is exactly what they should do: Make sure you understand the warranty, but fix it anyway.

And zedro, I recognized earlier that we all need to employ a BS detector before we buy anything. No kidding. But this fork was touted as the next progression, the next step: something light and strong enough for DH and freeride, yet still with a coil. It should not be unreasonable to expect that a fork with only one spring, a smaller amount of oil, and larger diameter tubes will live up to the hype. Of course, fork evolution for you stopped with the Shiver... :eviltongu

 

[zedro]

And zedro, I recognized earlier that we all need to employ a BS detector before we buy anything. No kidding. But this fork was touted as the next progression, the next step: something light and strong enough for DH and freeride, yet still with a coil. It should not be unreasonable to expect that a fork with only one spring, a smaller amount of oil, and larger diameter tubes will live up to the hype. Of course, fork evolution for you stopped with the Shiver... :eviltongu

well that is the BS part isnt it, and hell, i blame us and our foamy mouthes (attached to our big stupid heads )

actually i removed a spring, and only one of my dampers works, and the uppers are 40mm.....its like a F40 that lasts 10 times as long!

 

[James | Go-Ride]

i dunno really, i always thought it was fairly logical that there would be a problem like this down the line with the 40, i mean, its made out of the same (amount and type) materials as a boxxer, only spread out over a bigger area.

I was just being a jerk and pointing out grammar/spelling errors.

 

[zedro]

I was just being a jerk and pointing out grammar/spelling errors.

just for that i'm not wearing my Go-Ride shirt for a week :angry:

 

[RhinofromWA]

If I ever said "intended abuse" it was Freudian, I'm pretty sure I said intended use.

What if they buy a fork for the advertised use? Aren't they entitled to think it's up to the task?

Like I said, we're just not going to agree but that's ok. Just let me if you ever sell DH forks ok?

No sorry I didn't mean to imply you said "intended abuse"....I mentioned it because that IS what DHing is all about.

I still don't see how these forks neccesarilly(Go-Ride can correct my bad spelling ) are not performing as advertised. Just because you (a colletive "us" you) cause the fork to fail, whether as you leave the parking lot or 6 months later. Doesn't automatically earn you a freebie....it just might get you a place on the "Dip**** Wall of Fame" (I should make one for a LBS)

I have never sold bike parts....or worked in a shop. I don't have the stomach to put up with the whiney ass SOB's that would continually pour in. Another reason would be I would never sell much because I would tell the idiots not to put that peice on his bike if he excpects to drop stuff.....might turn off "know it all" customers that way.

Have you experienced other sports where the collective mentallity is "I wan't my F'n Warranty"? The fact that a 98 6" Boxxer weighs near the same amount as a 8" DH40 should clue you in........right?

To quote a redneck comedian "Here's your sign" lol

 

[RhinofromWA]

I was just being a jerk and pointing out grammar/spelling errors.

BURN!

Rhino "doesn't care to reread his posts for spelling errors" fromWA