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france....

stoney

stoney

Part of the unwashed, middle-American horde
Jul 26, 2006
22,023
7,928
Colorado
A. Legit refugees? You are saying that ISIS is taking advantage of refugees. This attack occured by CITIZENS OF FRANCE AND BELGIUM! They are not refugees. This attack has NOTHING to do with refugees. The assumption of refugees working with ISIS is purely speculation at this point.

B. Islam is not directly related to terrorism in the same sense that Christianity is not related to attacks on abortion clinics. It's radicals of ALL religions that cause these problems. I lived with a Muslim family for four years (my father was married to a Muslim woman at the time) and the family was one of the most charitable, pacifist families I have ever met. They would help anybody and everybody who needed it. Radicalism - be it Christianity, Islam, Budhism, Judism, etc - is what we need to be focusing on, not a single religion.
 
Westy

Westy

the teste
Nov 22, 2002
56,388
22,453
Sleazattle
As much as ISIS likes to kill westerners, they kill a lot more of your average Muslim. Worse than a non Muslim, a bad one must be killed. Christians are allowed to like in Isis territory if they admit subservience, Muslims who do not follow their rules are kill on the spot.

ISIS does not see the west as their enemy, but everyone who is not ISIS.

Long but interesting read, know thy enemy.

http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2015/03/what-isis-really-wants/384980/
 
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dtm1

Monkey
Apr 11, 2015
101
2
stoney said:
A. Legit refugees? You are saying that ISIS is taking advantage of refugees. This attack occured by CITIZENS OF FRANCE AND BELGIUM! They are not refugees. This attack has NOTHING to do with refugees. The assumption of refugees working with ISIS is purely speculation at this point.

No you're misunderstanding ... ISIS is responsible for France, AND Isis will conduct further attacks. One way they will do so involves sneaking terrorists into other countries (ie Honduras just yesterday) under the guise of refugee.... And they were ISLAMIC citizens of France and Belgium

B. Islam is not directly related to terrorism in the same sense that Christianity is not related to attacks on abortion clinics. It's radicals of ALL religions that cause these problems. I lived with a Muslim family for four years (my father was married to a Muslim woman at the time) and the family was one of the most charitable, pacifist families I have ever met. They would help anybody and everybody who needed it. Radicalism - be it Christianity, Islam, Budhism, Judism, etc - is what we need to be focusing on, not a single religion.

I get your point in theory. But in reality, by every US intelligence sources estimate, 15-25 % of the world's 1.2 billion Muslims are radical. Yes that leaves 75% that aren't, like the family you lived with, but 200-300 million radical Muslims devoted to the destruction of "the Roman west" is a huge number. The number of radical nutjobs who call themselves Christian is < 1/10 of 1%. Imagine if 200-300 million crazies were bombing abortion clinics, KrankyJon would implode.
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dtm1

Monkey
Apr 11, 2015
101
2
Westy said:
As much as ISIS likes to kill westerners, they kill a lot more of your average Muslim. Worse than a non Muslim, a bad one must be killed. Christians are allowed to like in Isis territory if they admit subservience, Muslims who do not follow their rules are kill on the spot.

ISIS does not see the west as their enemy, but everyone who is not ISIS.

Long but interesting read, know thy enemy.

http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2015/03/what-isis-really-wants/384980/
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That's the point, anyone who does not convert to their form of Islam is infidel and to be killed. I said this in the America's direction thread and a few guys just started rambling about "oh yeah, well The crusaders crusaded at The crusading crusade."

The west IS their ultimate enemy.

They are just not in a position to invade the US like they have Syria and Iraq.

My biggest concern is that they're smart enough to not pull a Paris here, as that will "awaken the dragon" and the American public will force President Binky to bin Laden them.
 
Westy

Westy

the teste
Nov 22, 2002
56,388
22,453
Sleazattle
dtm1 said:
That's the point, anyone who does not convert to their form of Islam is infidel and to be killed. I said this in the America's direction thread and a few guys just started rambling about "oh yeah, well The crusaders crusaded at The crusading crusade."

The west IS their ultimate enemy.

They are just not in a position to invade the US like they have Syria and Iraq.

My biggest concern is that they're smart enough to not pull a Paris here, as that will "awaken the dragon" and the American public will force President Binky to bin Laden them.
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Pull a Paris here? Since when has a mass public shooting resulted in a government reaction in the US?

I though Paris happened because of French gun laws?
 
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stoney

stoney

Part of the unwashed, middle-American horde
Jul 26, 2006
22,023
7,928
Colorado
dtm1 said:
And then what? If I post a reputable source, you'll be open minded to the possibility?
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Quoting numbers without sources is at best rhetoric. Having sources backing up claim gives basis to an argument.
 
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dtm1

Monkey
Apr 11, 2015
101
2
Westy said:
Pull a Paris here? Since when has a mass public shooting resulted in a government reaction in the US?
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Do you even think before you post? This is on par with your "the Middle East was peaceful before WW1"
 
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dtm1

Monkey
Apr 11, 2015
101
2
stoney said:
Quoting numbers without sources is at best rhetoric. Having sources backing up claim gives basis to an argument.
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Yes I understand that. You didn't answer my question. I'll post the source if you're willing to actually consider it, as opposed to just being argumentative.

Here's a teaser:
image.jpeg
 
jonKranked

jonKranked

Detective Dookie
Nov 10, 2005
89,375
27,599
media blackout
so its starting to look like the guy carrying the syrian passport wasn't actually a refugee, but he wanted everyone to think he was.

On Tuesday night, French police distributed the photograph of one of the three dead attackers from the Stade de France, who is believed to have travelled through Greece and the rest of the Balkans in the two months before the attacks carrying a passport in the name of Ahmad Almohammad, with the details of a long-dead Syrian soldier.

All the other known attackers, as well as Abaaoud, are of French and Belgian nationality with similar life stories of limited petty crime or drug taking, and radicalisation in their late teens or early twenties. At least four are known to have spent time in Syria with Islamic State extremists.

As European citizens, there was no need to resort to subterfuge or risk Mediterranean sea crossings to reach their target. They could travel freely around the continent even when the authorities in their home countries were aware of their extreme views and foreign travels.
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http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/nov/18/paris-attacks-latest-evidence-st-denis-wider-conspiracy-isis
 
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dtm1

Monkey
Apr 11, 2015
101
2
Pesqueeb said:
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Like when the Ft. Hood shooting isn't even labeled terrorism, but workplace violence, because he was Muslim and terrorism doesn't happen on Obama's watch... And how the confederate flag gets banned in SC because of that mass murdering redneck idiot? Yeah, I see your point.
 
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dtm1

Monkey
Apr 11, 2015
101
2
stoney said:
That is a spreadsheet with no source. I could have made that myself.
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Yes but I didn't.

So I guess you don't want the facts.

Proving the point that liberals never let the facts get in the way of their forgone agenda-serving conclusions.

you really should just lie and say you'll be open minded, the study is pretty mind blowing, even to one as well informed as me. :)
 
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dtm1

Monkey
Apr 11, 2015
101
2
stoney said:
Those are not actually refugees. I do conceed that ISIS will likely try to take advantage of the situation, but the refugees are not the problem.
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That's exactly what I said. We agree on that point... Don't tell pesquirt though, he'll ban you from Bernie's Boot Licking Squad
 
stoney

stoney

Part of the unwashed, middle-American horde
Jul 26, 2006
22,023
7,928
Colorado
dtm1 said:
Yes but I didn't.

So I guess you don't want the facts.

Proving the point that liberals never let the facts get in the way of their forgone agenda-serving conclusions.

you really should just lie and say you'll be open minded, the study is pretty mind blowing, even to one as well informed as me. :)
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Provide me the research to read. I don't want talking point. I want to READ the fact.
 
stoney

stoney

Part of the unwashed, middle-American horde
Jul 26, 2006
22,023
7,928
Colorado
dtm1 said:
Here you go
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Page 10:

Pew Research said:
Few U.S. Muslims voice support for suicide bombing or other forms of violence against civilians in the name of Islam; 81% say such acts are never justified, while fewer than one-in-ten say violence against civilians either is often justified (1%) or is sometimes justified (7%) to defend Islam. Around the world, most Muslims also reject suicide bombing and other attacks against civilians. However, substantial minorities in several countries say such acts of violence are at least sometimes justified, including 26% of Muslims in Bangladesh, 29% in Egypt, 39% in Afghanistan and 40% in the Palestinian territories.
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Pew Research said:
At least half of Muslims in most countries surveyed say they are concerned about religious extremist groups in their country, including two-thirds or more of Muslims in Egypt (67%), Tunisia (67%), Iraq (68%), Guinea Bissau (72%) and Indonesia (78%). On balance, more are worried about Islamic extremists than about Christian extremists.
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Pew Research said:
In most countries where a question about so-called “honor” killings was asked, majorities of Muslims say such killings are never justified. Only in two countries – Afghanistan and Iraq – do majorities condone extra-judicial executions of women who allegedly have shamed their families by engaging in premarital sex or adultery.
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I think you need to read the whole report.
 
IH8Rice

IH8Rice

I'm Mr. Negative! I Fail!
Aug 2, 2008
24,524
494
Im over here now
Police in France have been given huge new powers including the ability to put people under house arrest without trial and to block websites.....

Such a decision gives the police powers including the ability to keep people in their homes without trial, searching the homes of people without a warrant from a judge, and the power to block any website that is deemed a problem.
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http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/france-state-of-emergency-declared-for-three-months-allowing-authorities-to-shut-down-websites-and-a6740886.html
 
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