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Frankenbrakes and brake improvement discussion

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TrumbullHucker

trumbullruxer
Aug 29, 2005
2,284
718
shimzbury, ct
Bent a lever on a Magura MT5, saw there is a one-finger option available to replace it with. Any using them? I don't hate the stock lever but I don't think I ever two-finger it, if you know what I mean
I went from the two lever to the HC1 levers before my whistler trip and I love them much more than the two finger levers. The levers have a same shape and feel as Zees.
I dont really notice a power difference; obviously two finger braking is stronger than one, but when I am braking with two fingers I feel super sketchy with only two other fingers gripping the bars.
 

djjohnr

Turbo Monkey
Apr 21, 2002
2,794
1,502
Northern California
I went from the two lever to the HC1 levers before my whistler trip and I love them much more than the two finger levers. The levers have a same shape and feel as Zees.
I dont really notice a power difference; obviously two finger braking is stronger than one, but when I am braking with two fingers I feel super sketchy with only two other fingers gripping the bars.
Does anyone actually two finger their brakes? Seems like a bad idea. With the two finger Magura levers I run them pretty far inboard so it's just my index finger on the hook.
 

Jm_

sled dog's bollocks
Jan 14, 2002
16,301
7,290
AK
When the brakes fade and/or your fingers don’t work. Usually your fingers don’t work because your brakes suck and get all tired from pulling.
 

TrumbullHucker

trumbullruxer
Aug 29, 2005
2,284
718
shimzbury, ct
When the brakes fade and/or your fingers don’t work. Usually your fingers don’t work because your brakes suck and get all tired from pulling.
Yeah a bit of both lol.. I'm just becoming a lame cautious af Rider.. dragging brakes too much. (To my defense I was on a brand new bike in Whistler, and coming off of two separate bone breaks)
Gotta find my balls again
 

Jm_

sled dog's bollocks
Jan 14, 2002
16,301
7,290
AK
Yeah a bit of both lol.. I'm just becoming a lame cautious af Rider.. dragging brakes too much. (To my defense I was on a brand new bike in Whistler, and coming off of two separate bone breaks)
Gotta find my balls again
Whisler is a good example on the steep slabs where you want all the freaking power in the world AND fade resistance. I was not let down by the 220 V4 setup, but I can still go for more power (Tech 4 lever for the front coming). Those are good examples though of some of the stuff I ride where I need those elements, sustained crap like that, even if a few dozen meters long, overheats small rotors wicked fast and that's where you get your wandering bite point as you try to reposition/re-grab/modulate. If you got the control there...man it saves your hands and your life. If you are just barely pulling it off every time...we've all been there...man that is scary and the 2-finger pull is usually a part of that...
 

Westy

the teste
Nov 22, 2002
49,381
14,826
Sleazattle
Given the fluid pressure in the line, I don't think the diameter matters at all. If anything, a smaller inner diameter + thicker hose walls would result in shorter lever throw because less expansion.
Yeah a smaller inner diameter has less area for the fluid to generate force that the line has to resist and will be stiffer for the same wall thickness.
 

HAB

Chelsea from Seattle
Apr 28, 2007
11,487
1,877
Seattle
Yeah a smaller inner diameter has less area for the fluid to generate force that the line has to resist and will be stiffer for the same wall thickness.
That, and flow rate/pressure drop due to a smaller ID are not an issue, at all.
 

Inclag

Turbo Monkey
Sep 9, 2001
2,682
359
MA
If you use finned pads and are annoyed by the rattle: Jesse Melamed puts o-rings on his caliper. No experience from my side, just sharing.
View attachment 180232
What are those orings going around? I was thinking it was one stretched over the outside pin head and and distal end of the pin, but that can't be the case based on the picture. What am I missing here?
 

HAB

Chelsea from Seattle
Apr 28, 2007
11,487
1,877
Seattle
What are those orings going around? I was thinking it was one stretched over the outside pin head and and distal end of the pin, but that can't be the case based on the picture. What am I missing here?
I think it's twisted in the middle and going under the pin a third time there.
 

HAB

Chelsea from Seattle
Apr 28, 2007
11,487
1,877
Seattle
That bottom thing isn't a standard brake mount by the looks. Must be something the frame comes with to adapt from frame to normal mount.
Yeah, the Altitude has a bolt-on mount that you flip around depending which chainstay flip chip setting you're using to move the brake caliper to match.
 

Inclag

Turbo Monkey
Sep 9, 2001
2,682
359
MA
Quick question. Bike has 180mm post mount and I'm looking to latch on a 223 rotor on the back. I'm just looking for someone to share the part number they're using to achieve this as I'm second guessing myself and I want to make sure I order the correct adapter before pulling the trigger.

Thanks!
 

Flo33

Turbo Monkey
Mar 3, 2015
1,761
1,011
Styria
Quick question. Bike has 180mm post mount and I'm looking to latch on a 223 rotor on the back. I'm just looking for someone to share the part number they're using to achieve this as I'm second guessing myself and I want to make sure I order the correct adapter before pulling the trigger.

Thanks!
You're looking for a PM7 to 223/+43 mm adapter.

Por ejemplo

 

Jm_

sled dog's bollocks
Jan 14, 2002
16,301
7,290
AK
Well I have the freaking Tech 4 lever sitting here...bike is still at a friends house. Once I'm able enough I plan on hooking that up to the V4 with the 223, but fuck if I know when that's going to happen now. Really want to try it. The 220/223 rotors were really instrumental in keeping the heat away from the V4s on 50% sustained grades and I just wanted more bite still.

People need to be punched in the face for saying stuff like this though:

It doesn’t matter how steep the trail gets, you’ll never run out of power and that is without having to use much force at the lever blade.
 

HAB

Chelsea from Seattle
Apr 28, 2007
11,487
1,877
Seattle
I'm getting along really well with the T4 V4s, and I'm very much one of those people who thought the T3s were super underpowered.
 

Westy

the teste
Nov 22, 2002
49,381
14,826
Sleazattle
Well I have the freaking Tech 4 lever sitting here...bike is still at a friends house. Once I'm able enough I plan on hooking that up to the V4 with the 223, but fuck if I know when that's going to happen now. Really want to try it. The 220/223 rotors were really instrumental in keeping the heat away from the V4s on 50% sustained grades and I just wanted more bite still.

People need to be punched in the face for saying stuff like this though:
At some point you don't need super powerful brakes for steep inclines because there just isn't the traction to do anything with. Unless you have some kind of cog railway setup.
 

Leafy

Monkey
Sep 13, 2019
267
193
At some point you don't need super powerful brakes for steep inclines because there just isn't the traction to do anything with. Unless you have some kind of cog railway setup.
The stronger the brakes the less force you need to brake at the limit of traction, the less force you need the more control you have and the less arm pump you get.
 

HAB

Chelsea from Seattle
Apr 28, 2007
11,487
1,877
Seattle
The stronger the brakes the less force you need to brake at the limit of traction, the less force you need the more control you have and the less arm pump you get.
What he said. Plus you've got more margin for still having working brakes when you get stuff hot.
 

HAB

Chelsea from Seattle
Apr 28, 2007
11,487
1,877
Seattle
What size rotor are you running them with?
I've tried 203s at both ends, and a 220 front. Didn't need more power than the 203, strictly speaking, but I'm pretty sold on the idea that going "overkill" is actually pretty great from a control and hand pump perspective, just because you don't have to squeeze as hard. At least provided that your trails are long and steep enough to put some heat into the brakes.
 

HAB

Chelsea from Seattle
Apr 28, 2007
11,487
1,877
Seattle
All that said, the Dominion A4 is still my favorite brake going (having not tried Trickstuff, but most everything else). The T4 V4 is very good second place.
 

Jm_

sled dog's bollocks
Jan 14, 2002
16,301
7,290
AK
Brakes bled for winter. So nice to not have grey sludge coming out. Fluid more than a season old looks exactly the same as when it went in.
0CA569E3-9AB4-4D20-A1FB-EA6081A0F07C.jpeg
534D0421-3C87-4CEE-B8CA-16B0669CF90F.jpeg
 

DukeWala

Chimp
Jul 31, 2022
2
1
What's the MC diameter on those DB8?
No clue. Just curious to see if anyone has every tried this mix. I never liked Shigura except with the XTR Race levers that don't have servowave. If they ever make Sram DB8 levers in an RSC version, they might be the best new lever to match with Magura calipers for folks that don't like the Magura levers. Personally, I love the hc3 levers, but it's always fun to experiment.
 

Boozzz

Chimp
Sep 12, 2019
49
57
Just tested the T4 V4 on my trials bike (green race pads, braided hoses). T3 V4 before these. So far so good! Way more power/hold, no lever play and quite a bit lighter lever action. Not as light as I had hoped though, the Hayes Dominions remain king in this (haven't tried Trickstuff).

Lever does feel a lot more solid and chunky than the Hayes lever, which I like. Feel less like I'm going to rip them apart on a crazy gap or up to rear when basically hanging on them with my full weight. Build quality/finish on the Hopes is a lot better, and power is very compareable. Here's to hoping they don't start leaking after a few rides like the Hayes. But if my old set is an indication, they should be good.
 

toodles

ridiculously corgi proportioned
Aug 24, 2004
4,575
3,408
Australia
Just tested the T4 V4 on my trials bike (green race pads, braided hoses). T3 V4 before these. So far so good! Way more power/hold, no lever play and quite a bit lighter lever action. Not as light as I had hoped though, the Hayes Dominions remain king in this (haven't tried Trickstuff).

Lever does feel a lot more solid and chunky than the Hayes lever, which I like. Feel less like I'm going to rip them apart on a crazy gap or up to rear when basically hanging on them with my full weight. Build quality/finish on the Hopes is a lot better, and power is very compareable. Here's to hoping they don't start leaking after a few rides like the Hayes. But if my old set is an indication, they should be good.
Hows the lever length/ergonomics compared to the T3 V4?
 

Jm_

sled dog's bollocks
Jan 14, 2002
16,301
7,290
AK
The T4 is way more like a lever, haha. Less like a brake lever. Not in a bad way. Only been playing with it tho.
 

Boozzz

Chimp
Sep 12, 2019
49
57
It feels thicker and squarer underneath your finger. As my hands are quite big, I do like that. It's a bit longer, but keeping them side by side, it's less than a cm difference. Position of the clamp on my bars is 5 mm or so more inboard. Bite point feels a tad softer, and dead stroke is very minimal with the adjuster turned all the way in.
 

Flo33

Turbo Monkey
Mar 3, 2015
1,761
1,011
Styria
They (AB) at least try to implement a good testing protocol with comparable parameters for every pad. We shall see how those fancy pads behave in real life. The marketing mambojumbo is strong in this ad.

edit: good point in the comments section, not breaking force was measured but lever force which says absolute nothing about the thing that really matters - stopping power. I think it's AB snake oil again.
 
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