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Full Send Bike Park, near Conifer CO

Toshi

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,319
7,744
dump said:
The vast majority of Pennsylvania is below 3,000 ft, fwiw. (@Toshi)
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Yup. Long term screwed for snow!

For reference, the two places I go the most: Copper is 9,712 ft at the base, 12,313 at peak. Winter Park is 9,000 at the base, 12,060 at the peak.

Meanwhile in the Alps...

www.npr.org

Lack Of Snow In French Alps Is Affecting Lower Altitude Ski Resorts

A lack of snow in the Alps is causing headaches for French ski resorts. Some lower altitude resorts have shut runs or even closed permanently. Others are resorting to unusual methods to bring in snow.
www.npr.org www.npr.org

Morzine is 3,281 ft at the base, 8,091 at the peak (quite the drop!).
 
maxyedor

maxyedor

<b>TOOL PRO</b>
Oct 20, 2005
5,496
3,141
In the bathroom, fighting a battle
rpet said:
The soil is much better in NH than typical western mountains.

I think sufficient irrigation should be very high on the list for a project like this. Depending on the vertical, I'd take a well irrigated and maintained trail system over a fast lift.
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Snow Summit and Mammoth are absolute dustbowls, and are always crowded as hell in the summer. After a trip to Summit I've got dusty brown boogers for a week. Having good dirt only matters if better dirt is available nearby. Out here it's either pedal up dry loose dirt, or take a chairlift up dry loose dirt. I don't see why anybody in CO would have an issue, as nobody is going to open a competing park with sprinklers on all the trails, water is a thing of the past in the Western States.
 
Bikael Molton

Bikael Molton

goofy for life
Jun 9, 2003
4,028
1,163
El Lay
Yeah, I basically don't ride Summit, because the lift price isn't worth it to me to ride powder and pavers.

Santa's Village and the irrigated trails at Northstar are a bit better imho.

IMO a modern bike park experience in these regions should include irrigation as integral to the park design, not an afterthought or band-aid.

Out East, they get rain year round, so it's a totally different story.

maxyedor said:
Snow Summit and Mammoth are absolute dustbowls, and are always crowded as hell in the summer. After a trip to Summit I've got dusty brown boogers for a week. Having good dirt only matters if better dirt is available nearby. Out here it's either pedal up dry loose dirt, or take a chairlift up dry loose dirt. I don't see why anybody in CO would have an issue, as nobody is going to open a competing park with sprinklers on all the trails, water is a thing of the past in the Western States.
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Westy

Westy

the teste
Nov 22, 2002
54,442
20,247
Sleazattle
The wet is getting wetter and the dry dryer.

Despite wetter winters we are also getting better summers and lots of fires.
 
Bikael Molton

Bikael Molton

goofy for life
Jun 9, 2003
4,028
1,163
El Lay
La Niña down here. Precip status = fycked. 55% of normal for the season.
This is why I run an Assegai in the front.

In other 10 years, maybe Bellingham will have weather like the SF Bay used to... and I'll relocate.
 
dump

dump

Turbo Monkey
Oct 12, 2001
8,224
4,478
rpet said:
Yeah, I basically don't ride Summit, because the lift price isn't worth it to me to ride powder and pavers.

Santa's Village and the irrigated trails at Northstar are a bit better imho.

IMO a modern bike park experience in these regions should include irrigation as integral to the park design, not an afterthought or band-aid.

Out East, they get rain year round, so it's a totally different story.
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I only ride (irrigated) park!
 
A

Andeh

Customer Title
Mar 3, 2020
1,020
992
I should really get around to getting my Canadian passport now before the rush (future Bay Area refugee).
 
SylentK

SylentK

Turbo Monkey
Feb 25, 2004
2,332
878
coloRADo
Oh man...you can't go swinging a dead cat in most CO trail advocacy group meetings without hitting an ex-east coaster boasting how good they had it back there and how they want to make that happen in CO. Only to realize, this is not the east coast and things are different.... Just sayin'...

I wish these guys luck. I did a study of this for an MBA school project. I have a very good, smart entrepreneur friend that looked into this as well. Albeit it was back in 2005. Long story short, it's all in the land cost. Just like paying rent for your new bike shop you want to open in that strip mall. It's fixed costs. From a CO perspective, of course.

My conclusion was that you COULD make it work as a non-profit. Or if land was donated. A third contributing factor is getting sponsors, like in a race series, to help cover costs to at least break even. No one is going to get rich on this in CO.

I think looking into how those dudes in TX started their lift service mtb would be a good case model. But that's Texas. I hear they are paying people to buy land down there....;)
 
jstuhlman

jstuhlman

bagpipe wanker
Dec 3, 2009
16,696
13,051
Cackalacka du Nord
we're working on trying to get our little local mountain donated (there are a ton of pirate trails up on it already) nd it sits adjacent to the park where the main trail system is. although there's no way in hell it would happen, there's a powerline cut right up the front of it that i sometimes dream of them installing some sort of mtb magic carpet type of contraption going up it. if we get legit access we'll probably just put in a climbing trail up the back. the current fire road can get a bit steep. overall drop is 700 feet over somewhere between 1/3 and 1/2 mile, depending on how you go.
1612931493365.jpeg
 
Westy

Westy

the teste
Nov 22, 2002
54,442
20,247
Sleazattle
jstuhlman said:
we're working on trying to get our little local mountain donated (there are a ton of pirate trails up on it already) nd it sits adjacent to the park where the main trail system is. although there's no way in hell it would happen, there's a powerline cut right up the front of it that i sometimes dream of them installing some sort of mtb magic carpet type of contraption going up it. if we get legit access we'll probably just put in a climbing trail up the back. the current fire road can get a bit steep. overall drop is 700 feet over somewhere between 1/3 and 1/2 mile, depending on how you go.
View attachment 156343
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Looks like the shitty powerline climb at O-hill.

We have a lot of dedicated climb trails here. Super nice. Just go into a low gear and chill at your own pace. Nothing too steep, no need for lower gears, but gets you up efficiently. Cuts through a nice forest and beats the hell out of a fire road.
 
toodles

toodles

ridiculously corgi proportioned
Aug 24, 2004
5,516
4,768
Australia
It never ceases to amaze me how vocal environmental groups are when MTB trails are suggested but how useless they are at stopping actual threats like development or roads going through.
 
Westy

Westy

the teste
Nov 22, 2002
54,442
20,247
Sleazattle
toodles said:
It never ceases to amaze me how vocal environmental groups are when MTB trails are suggested but how useless they are at stopping actual threats like development or roads going through.
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Many moons ago I got suckered into going on a group hike with a local environmental club by this girl, because she was hot. On the hike the group had an invasive species expert identify all the different invasive species on the trail, which he explained were there because they came from suburban lawns and had an advantage over native species in the compressed soils around trails. Along the hike the large group took many off trail excursions to see various overlooks, and to claim they climbed a peak that had no trail.

We carpooled there and I was in a car full of these freaks on the way home. The issue of bikes came up and when I said I was an avid biker they turned on me, claiming bikes caused erosion and killed small animals that used the trail. They said that their group always lobbied against bike access because of the harm they did.

I explained to them that all trails will erode over time without maintenance. I explained that mountain bikers were actually responsible for building and maintaining the trails they had enjoyed that day. I asked them if anyone had ever lifted a finger to perform trail maintenance, the answer was no.

I then explained that bikes always stayed on the trail, and that all of their off trail behavior not only contributed to soil compaction and the spread of the very same invasive species they were trying to prevent but that they trampled on a complex forest floor ecosystem and undoubtedly killed numerous small critters. I suggested they examine their own behavior before criticizing others as they ignorantly fucked shit up. It was a very quiet ride the rest of the way.
 
sethimus

sethimus

neu bizutch
Feb 5, 2006
4,974
2,187
not in Whistler anymore :/
jstuhlman said:
we're working on trying to get our little local mountain donated (there are a ton of pirate trails up on it already) nd it sits adjacent to the park where the main trail system is. although there's no way in hell it would happen, there's a powerline cut right up the front of it that i sometimes dream of them installing some sort of mtb magic carpet type of contraption going up it. if we get legit access we'll probably just put in a climbing trail up the back. the current fire road can get a bit steep. overall drop is 700 feet over somewhere between 1/3 and 1/2 mile, depending on how you go.
View attachment 156343
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how much is a t-bar lift these days? in my hometown the old lift got reactivated after 20 years, new owner invented a new hook system for easy lifting and started a bike park. opens this year. lifts you up 160m vertical in under 4 mins:

1612960218758.jpeg


 
SylentK

SylentK

Turbo Monkey
Feb 25, 2004
2,332
878
coloRADo
6thElement said:
Winter Park
Keystone
Granby
Steamboat
Powderhorn
Aspen

Then are they including the not really bike park ski resorts that let you take your bike up??
Vail
Copper
??
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Give Vail a chance. Or ride it with me some day. Or maybe not. Errr....NO, don't go to Vail. :)

I have never ridden Copper. But Cooper, yes, sorta.

You are missing Crested Butte and Telluride

Heck Monarch pass area (or "zone" to the Canadians) may as well be a bike park.

Fruita 18rd could be a bike park. As can the GJ trails for that matter.

Durango/Purgatory?

Silverton? Actually I think those days are over. Need real world input on that one.
 
6thElement

6thElement

Schrodinger's Immigrant
Jul 29, 2008
15,975
13,228
SylentK said:
Give Vail a chance. Or ride it with me some day. Or maybe not. Errr....NO, don't go to Vail. :)

I have never ridden Copper. But Cooper, yes, sorta.

You are missing Crested Butte and Telluride

Heck Monarch pass area (or "zone" to the Canadians) may as well be a bike park.

Fruita 18rd could be a bike park. As can the GJ trails for that matter.

Durango/Purgatory?

Silverton? Actually I think those days are over. Need real world input on that one.
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Didn't realize Vail was actually spinning lifts and still had a trail system. I've only ever climbed Game Creek to descend Two Elk.


Might have to make a day trip out there if we ever get vaccinated.

@Nick you ever ridden the lifts there?
 
rideit

rideit

Bob the Builder
Aug 24, 2004
23,348
11,515
In the cleavage of the Tetons
I have had a really fun day at Vail, good flow stuff, but not very gnar.
Kinda like winter, now that I think about it.
Granted, I was with wifey.
Easy to get laps in to Minturn. (not with her)
 
SylentK

SylentK

Turbo Monkey
Feb 25, 2004
2,332
878
coloRADo
The best part of Vail is the dirt. And the Aspens. And well, the hot euro MILFs. But you didn't hear it from me.

There is gnar, it's not crazy gnar, if you know how to ride a bike. But more like "yes! that's nice gnar."

Magic Forest to Old 9. If you tell me you never puckered up just a little on Old 9, then I'd say you're a really good rider or you're lying.

Thing with Vail is that there are sweet trails on their map. And there are sweet trails not on their map, but on USFS maps. And then there are the sweet trails not on any maps.

Back in the day, if the lightning came to Keystone early, we'd shuttle Leenawee. Same thing with Vail. But you're doing 2elks, which is way more epic. Or you can just drink beer until the storm passes while watching said MILFs.

Downsides: There's the closing trails due to winter improvement projects. Those are the worst. If Magic Forest and Old 9 are open. Do them. And there's parking and the cost of Vail. But to me, it's worth it.

The wife loves Berrypicker (that's a hiking trail to the top and she can catch the gondi down for free) which this concept doesn't really exist at Keystone or WP.

Perhaps I've already said too much...In summary Vail Sucks.
 
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Nick

Nick

My name is Nick
Sep 21, 2001
24,065
14,716
where the trails are
Agree with @SylentK Old 9 is the goods.

BITD we would lap the OG 94 world cup course, or from the top of the gondola we'd duck out to the ... North? West? Anyway towards matterhorn. There used to be fun, steep trails over there: radio flyer, John Holmes, I think I recall another. Those were really good days.
 
SylentK

SylentK

Turbo Monkey
Feb 25, 2004
2,332
878
coloRADo
Nick said:
Agree with @SylentK Old 9 is the goods.

BITD we would lap the OG 94 world cup course, or from the top of the gondola we'd duck out to the ... North? West? Anyway towards matterhorn. There used to be fun, steep trails over there: radio flyer, John Holmes, I think I recall another. Those were really good days.
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The 94 course is gone. Notice it's not on the map 6th Element posted. But there is a new blue flow trail instead, it's on the new current maps. It's ok.

If you can find the old 2001 World's course, that was the shit. You'll need an old school local for that. A small portion goes under Gondi 1 (used to be Riva Bahn lift), and sometimes you see bike tracks. So you know peeps know what's up and I think that's awesome.

Matterhorn is still awesome. Altho since it is technically a USFS trail, downed trees are a recurring problem. Still awesome tho.
 
jonKranked

jonKranked

Detective Dookie
Nov 10, 2005
85,983
24,535
media blackout
sethimus said:
how much is a t-bar lift these days? in my hometown the old lift got reactivated after 20 years, new owner invented a new hook system for easy lifting and started a bike park. opens this year. lifts you up 160m vertical in under 4 mins:

View attachment 156347

Click to expand...

Used Ski Lifts For Sale | SkiResortEquipment.com

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