[Dave_Schuldt]

Those who tore up parts of the trail for thier DH bikes. We destroyed a jump and told the county guys that were working farther up the trail about the damage. THEY WILL BE MAD! This is the kind of crap that gets trails closed and it doesn't look good considering the county is giving us 100 acers at Duthie Hill to build a skills park. Your "secret" trail isn't secret any more. Any more building I find out there will be trashed and reported to the county.

Flame on......I don't care. I've spent lots of time doing lagit work on that trail and don't want to see it closed.

 

[ffonsok]

look here, although i wasnt the one who built the jump, that thing was NEEDED

there was a HUGE mud pit there and it was a bitch to always walk across it, now you can just jump it

there was an alternate route too if i'm not mistaken
and i wouldn't call it "damage"- if people were cutting down trees, THAT would be damage

yup, so keep up the "lagit" work on the trail, because if this is the attitude you cop, your going to be the only one doing it

 

[Snacks]

Eh, even though I can find Dave a little 'over the top' at times, I have to agree with him.

Rant on Dave

 

[Big B]

Where is this trail, specifically?

 

[ffonsok]

at the top of the highlands in sammamish, wa....
its ok, but its really muddy right now

basically dave, this is where i'm coming from

the jumps added to the trail were not dangerous, you could easily ride around them, and they were only placed in extremely muddy areas so people dont have to ride through the mud pits

but where's the duthie hill skill park?
is that over by the duthie hill park? how far does that park extend? i thought it was just a turnaround

 

[Borneo]

Yes, the routing there is a bit subject to scrutiny. Definately not where I would have routed it in places...
But, there's a bigger issue when "adding on" to public built trail systems. Same deal with issues at St. Ed's, etc. This is a pretty high profile place that will eventuallty interconnect to other places and provide a pretty cool system and will also connect to and through "that other place" which should still be kept on the down low so we don't alarm the anti bikers that may oppose it until everything is solid. Having bikers just go out and do their own thing looks really bad and is tough to explain to the anti-bikers that are also out there building a trail that we'll also get to use.

I understand Dave's frustration. He's about the only mtb representative at all the WTA (www.wta.org Pretty much a hiker only group.)work parties there and I'm sure he has to bear the brunt of the, ""why are there not more mountain bikers at the work parties?" questions.

Instead of just building ride arounds and jumps over muddy spots, the builders should show up at the work parties and explain their reasoning and work with the trail builders to reroute the trail as needed. Face to face always works better and would help the hiker people understand what mountain bikers are looking for in a trail. It won't be easy. But, that's the politics of trail use today.

 

[ffonsok]

yeah i get it...
just dont start pussifying the Exits

 

[Borneo]

Hehehehe. I hear ya. The DNR and FS will do what ever they want out there though.

And, looks like they already have on the clearcut portion near the hiker trail on dos siete.

 

[freeridekid]

so r there any trails in the area that allow the building of jumps? i hate how hikers want all the trails in a system to be tame and boring (like st. eds is now) when you can have just a few trails w/ jumps so there's something for everybody.

 

[Snacks]

so r there any trails in the area that allow the building of jumps?

Ya, your backyard.

 

[downhillracer]

so r there any trails in the area that allow the building of jumps? i hate how hikers want all the trails in a system to be tame and boring (like st. eds is now) when you can have just a few trails w/ jumps so there's something for everybody.

i agree
and about the grand ridge trail, i rode that trail and saw those things and i did not see how those things interfered with the trail at all. i actually talked to the guys who were out there building those things and they were very conscience of what they were doing, they were not trying to ruin existing trails. I personally don't see the problem with adding little things here and there that don't interfer with existing trails. If they were cutting new trails the whole way down the hill then I would see the problem.

 

[Borneo]

I'll tend to agree there. They were off to the side and actually pretty fun. But, as a trailbuilder, I'll say that I'm generally not pleased when a trail is either "dumbed down" or "built up" by someone who came along later and felt they had to add their thing to it.
In this case, if the perps had just worked with the people who got legal permission to build that trail in the first place, we might not be wasting keyboard time talking about this right now......

We'd all rather be putting our time in to building something that will stay than taking something else out. Right? usually, that means taking the time to do some up front work without a shovel.

BTW: Snacks, my backyard does have jumps.

 

[Neal]

was is a jump that you could do radical tricks like a bar-spin and tail whips? those are great. wouldn't it be great to have a contest and throw it down?

 

[elRey]

I think some people in this thread need to work on their english.

 

[Dave_Schuldt]

What maters is what the county thinks. Some of you old timers know who the Issaquah Alps Club is and the history. The jump I'm talking about was down near the RR grade. My fear is some hiker will get scared and bitch to the county. Not many hikers out there so hopefuly everything will stay cool. For some better trail try the going the other way from the new road up top. At the Y go right and cross the wetland on foot for more trail. Great XC pump. Show up for the work next fall and get to know the county guys, they are very cool.
For maps
http://community.webshots.com/myphotos?action=viewAllPhotos&albumID=551226766&security=aktmNx

 

[ummbikes]

i remember who did it
they all were riding kona's
and one kid had a shirt that said "MTN BIKERS SUCK LAWL"

i started screaming and running when i saw that they were building a bike jump, cuz thats just dangerous and it harms the trail!!!

So i started cussing at the kid, and he pulled out a taser gun and shocked me. then when i woke up, i realized that they had turned me into a supremasist.

the moral of the story is don't end up a nazi like me and let the kids build their jumps

Hey, join BBTC, work on some trails go to some user meetings and you will understand the real issues. It is easy to pirate crap, but in the long run doing the legitimate hard work pays much greater dividends for a longer time.

As fas as the Nazi stuff I pray you never experience anything close to living under a murderous regime. Read some books, it's not really funny.

 

[ffonsok]

was is a jump that you could do radical tricks like a bar-spin and tail whips? those are great. wouldn't it be great to have a contest and throw it down?

yea it was it was an UBER big jump-- like you could get about a foot of air

 

[Borneo]

That sentiment goes both ways. In this case, the "innocent" jump builders should have contacted the trail builders first. In not doing so and "just doing it" they put themselves in the negative light.

Most of the time, just asking first will alleviate a lot of problems down the road. Trail deviation pissing contests are no good for both parties.

Though, I've found that blocking the "improvements" with material that is screwed together and bailing wired together into one big unmovable mess is effective.

If riders don't like how a trail is built, they should go through the proper "legal" steps to have one built like they like. Sack up and do the boring pre-build stuff or....

 

[PsychO!1]

i was trying to make a point...
people who built (illegal) jumps on trails shouldnt be treated like nazis

Your not being treated like Nazi's, just pirate trail builders.

work with people, not against them

This is exactly what we want you to do. Work with people (the county), not against them.

 

[ffonsok]

uhh i wasnt the one who built the jump so dont go all US Soldier rampage on me

 

[trailhacker]

If riders don't like how a trail is built, they should go through the proper "legal" steps to have one built like they like. Sack up and do the boring pre-build stuff or....

If you are building "un-approved" items on an "approved" trail or in the general area, expect to get flack. Some one has spent a lot of time and effort just to make it so a legal trail can be built in that area.
Don't get pissy when they get upset as you are risking the whole area for a jump.
If you need those type of trails, go far away from anything someone has spent a great deal of time getting legalised. Keep it as secret as you can. Expect 1) someone in an official capicity to to find it and close it, 2) everyone finding out about it, riding the piss out of it with out ever doing any maintenance work on it and someone in an official capicity to find it and close it. Its a viscous cycle.

 

[ffonsok]

yeah i know what you mean... there was a sick ass secret trail in the Beav a while back, but it got raped by legal people

 

[Big B]

uhh i wasnt the one who built the jump so dont go all US Soldier rampage on me

Your posts are bust'in me up!

 

[largextracheese]

"yeah i know what you mean... there was a sick ass secret trail in the Beav a while back, but it got raped by legal people"

I know, I built that trail with alot of hardwork and it just happened to be on someone elses land. I learned my lesson. Messing with the Grand Ridge stuff is a major no no. I've been keeping track of all of Dave's posts about that trail and all the work it's taken over the past year. It's amazing to me that someone would want to jeopardize all that work with a few jumps. When my trail was discovered by the land owners, they police taped the whole area and cut off the main access to the park (ran across their acreage) and pretty much shut the whole area down for bikers and hikers alike. The landowners were only concerned with liability.... and justly so. I felt so bad for causing such a mess. Luckily the landowners worked with everyone on it and access was restored after my trail was removed. I must've affected 100 people that regularly use that place. The Ridge is a similar trail. It will be used by many and is a great resource. If I ever wanted to build a "secret" trail again, I'd make it so far out that nobody could find it. Times are tough for bikers that like to ride stunts and jumps. Dave, keep up the good work!

 

[FatalExposure]

Nicely stated XXLcheese.

 

[Skookum]

Would be nice for all these "diggers" to have somewhere close to work, i know the local clubs are working in that direction. Believe me i'm gonna be in a meeting in a few hours working that same angle. Legitamate gnarly is on the horizon, but it takes time, and it takes people who want that in the meetings.

In the meantime if you want to help dig or build "Freeride/DH" stuff you can help Whimps up in Galbraith or see if you can help restore Rat Pac.