Guerrilla Gravity, badass frame manufacturer in Colorado
- Thread starter mtg
- Start date
Low 30s isn't anything weird. My back tire is rarely below that and my front is close by. Either you're getting over damped shocks, you're running too much pressure in the air versions, or you you're sagging out your fork too much and pulling too much weight distribution from the rear. There's nothing weird about the suspension on the frames.....their strong point actually.
I'm not kidding about mailing you some shocks, especially if you're in AZ for a while. It could be that you're getting aggro bro tunes.
I'm not kidding about mailing you some shocks, especially if you're in AZ for a while. It could be that you're getting aggro bro tunes.
That’s a real good idea. My sweat certainly does more damage than leaving it dirty for a few days.
I could take you up on that next year, I’m not here for a while and I probably won’t be able to get things dialed until I get more dirt riding in…but yeah, the dirt riding has not been as much fun this year on shocks that don’t work for crap. At least I’m glad to hear that it’s not widespread and may be more down to the shocks…
Is it the ext bottom out circuit being adjusted to firmly? I don’t remember the specifics of that shock but I seem to recall something about a bottom out adjuster of some kind.
Yes, a few posts above.
Doesn’t fit on this frame.
Well it could be that the recommended settings for you are wrong for you. I have a buddy that is at least 20-30lbs heavier than me but likes his fork so soft it is un-rideable to me.
The ride yesterday was marginally better by letting air pressure down to 145psi..which seems too low. It leaves me about 2-3mm of travel on the shock...but nothing I did was a huge hit IMO. There was a double black trail, but no huge air and lots of slower tech with some steep pitches. Seemed like the rear tire was still skidding around a little too much and not absorbing the sharp stuff as well, but the pressure also bothers me, as in at my 170-ish wight it jut seems too low and that I'm having to sag it abnormally to get the compliance. The EXT is definitely still a jackhammer. The MegNeg was suggested by Steve at Vorpsrung. Another thing I don't get, if I have to run the compression controls on these shocks wide open, why the F do I even have useless fiddly knobs in the first place? That mostly applies to the EXT, but also the Bomber and the SD.
Naw, done with that guy and his BS. Just remembering yesterday (because it did) how my Avy cart weeps oil at the top of the cap when I push hard, I brought this up once, asking for new o-ring or whatever and I got an earful about how that was impossible, blah blah. Not keeping me updated of delays was the final straw though. I also ordered a receiver from e-trailer at a similar time to my Avy shock and those people actually got in touch with me and kept me updated when the projected dates rolled around and issues persisted. At Avy it was just leave me in the dark until I called and then push the date out further and further. More like a "hope he doesn't call"-situation. I have no doubts that eventually I would have gotten a product, but a totally undefined timeline is not acceptable. I'm ok with shit happening, but when the date comes around, multiple times, you need to contact the customer and at least let them know that you, in fact, don't know.
But back to the main point, it shouldn't be this damn hard to get some decent suspension out of this thing. That's my main issue here. I can't be out in left field IMO, I'm riding pretty damn hard compared to everyone I catch on the trail and I really never get anyone catching me, yet all these tunes seem to be for either 60-foot road gaps on smooth flow trails or something, because they are jackhammer at any speed in rough stuff. Although we do have some flow trails, I can make up for that with more pressure or fiddly knobs for more resistance, but what I can't do is get HSC (and HSR to a slightly lesser extent) compliance. What I really want is for the damn thing to work in chunky bumps, because that's the primary reason I have suspension. My fork by comparison, bit of weeping in mind, doesn't really give AF and takes everything and anything I throw at it. It's the "it works perfectly because you never think of it" type of deal. Meanwhile, my rear end is ricocheting off of everything.
Yeah, it's a mind-fuck having to go this light on compression tunes and no one else is? I don't get it.
Last edited:
y u no coil?
Like this? Most aftermarket stuff is at least "medium" compression tunes. Good luck finding a "light" tune aftermarket. My theory is that metric shocks with more stroke and lower suspension LRs are turning "medium" tunes into effectively "heavy" tunes, and so on. I got a light tune in it right now, compression is ok, rebound is still a little wonky and it does a little wonky stuff.
I was thinking more along the lines of 'get a Trek'
How many miles do you have on the bike so far? I got about 250 in before I gave up on the head tube stuff. I ran a CC inline coil that worked very well. My gripe was a death knock coming from the head tube. I tried it in short and long. I swapped lower cups. I swapped crown races. I lubricated everything. I sent the fork in for a service. I changed stems. It's a bummer because I thought the GG rode really well despite the knock. New frame with all the same parts and no death knock.
How many miles do you have on the bike so far? I got about 250 in before I gave up on the head tube stuff. I ran a CC inline coil that worked very well. My gripe was a death knock coming from the head tube. I tried it in short and long. I swapped lower cups. I swapped crown races. I lubricated everything. I sent the fork in for a service. I changed stems. It's a bummer because I thought the GG rode really well despite the knock. New frame with all the same parts and no death knock.
That's a Smash, JM has a Megatrail. 11-6 doesn't fit on the Megatrail, but does on most of the rest of the GGs. Something with the shape of the seatstay mount.
I didn't on this last trip. On previous outings and rides I was going back and forth quite a bit.
It's the new spherical bearings on the 11-6 that are the problem. An old one would work, if valved correctly.
One other idea. I have been riding a lot of very rough trails lately and have been really speeding up my rebound (nearly wide open on properly valved shocks), while still running a good bit of compression damping. I revert to a middle-ish rebound setup on normal trails that are like "half buff" and "half rough".
Not a setup for every trail, for sure, but this has really opened up the shock for certain trails. @mtg thinks I am crazy, but hey, just tossing it out there as something you might try.
Last edited:
what's the theory behind this setup approach?
I do something similar. My reasoning is that in between hits, it helps the shock recover to the initial part of the stroke where the leverage ratio is the highest (most compliant), rather than staying mid to deep in the ramped up part. Basically aggressively tuning away from packing up.
Interesting. I hadn't thought of it that way before. wouldn't you have to run very high spring rate for this to work? (i.e. very little sag).
Not necessarily, it would just reduce dynamic sag vs static sag.
I always run a fair bit more rebound in the back of the bike vs up front in part so the geometry slackens a bit when shit gets hairy.
Last edited:
JM, which frame incarnation do you have?
On my megatrail in short travel mode 145psi is exactly what I ran in a fox dpx and I weigh the same as you just fyi
On my megatrail in short travel mode 145psi is exactly what I ran in a fox dpx and I weigh the same as you just fyi
It's actually right there when someone says their bike is "hanging up" or "packing up" on bumps. Sometimes people attribute that feeling to excessive compression harshness, when (as Andeh said) at least some of it comes from suspension that is getting stuck down from too much rebound damping.
Yeah, otherwise I get the rear end kicking up on jumps due to the lack of rebound.
I think it's better to achieve that (keeping fork riding high) a bit more pressure, rather than forcing the rear to pack. I run a bit less fork sag than is usually recommended (I typically do 16-18% vs. the 20% most manufacturers suggest) to achieve a similar goal of keeping fork slack on steep/big hits. And fast (but not quite as crazy fast) rebound on the fork as well. On my Megatrail, I'm at like 29% sag rear with rebound at 8/10, and fork at 18% and 14/20 rebound (from closed on both).
I've experimented with running both rebounds WFO before and the main downside to me was that it's incredibly fatiguing on my feet and arms because everything is moving so fast. If my arches were better I could probably handle the shock rebound fully open but no way on the fork. For the fork it seems a lot easier to have it overshoot the dynamic sag point and cause oscillations, since there's less body weight on it than the rear.
@Jm_ How about you put it in Gravity mode to get the higher starting leverage ratio for the plush and compliant feel you are after but you then proceed to put a travel reducer on the shaft to get the 155mm you are after. It looks to me like your starting leverage ratio is too low for your liking and a higher one would probably benefit you. How about you grab a piece of cutting board and make a little chubby clip in travel reducing spacer.
@marshalolson What’s the starting leverage ratio in the trail mode versus the gravity mode? I bet he would just need a higher starting leverage ratio OR a lighter damped shock.
@marshalolson What’s the starting leverage ratio in the trail mode versus the gravity mode? I bet he would just need a higher starting leverage ratio OR a lighter damped shock.
Why bother with a travel limiter, just setup the shock for less travel and leave the rest in reserve for poor decisions?
Just basing that on his response to @mtg. He seems to have established that 155mm “should be enough” and total travel is a priority over leverage ratio (if I am interpreting correctly). Sounds like his leverage ratio is low enough that he is feeling like he is having too much damping versus spring. I guess he would like more spring than damping as far as wheel rate feel. Over spring/under damped versus undersprung/over damped would be the brackets. Sounds like he feels like he is off too far in one direction and doesn’t have a useable adjustable range.
If he is insisting on 155 should be enough then this would be a way to have his cake and eat it too.
Just fyi, I have two different shocks for each travel mode of my megatrail (3 actually)
I like that the BIKE has two different travel modes but expecting the same shock to work ideally with two different leverage ratios isn't realistic.
I like that the BIKE has two different travel modes but expecting the same shock to work ideally with two different leverage ratios isn't realistic.
Yeah, thing is, it's not like I haven't tried the other travel setting with multiple shocks and multiple tunes or that I just started realizing this yesterday, it's what I've been struggling with all summer, exhausting every possible setup that I can think of.
I have a 60mm stroke TTX coil that you are welcome to borrow. Valved for a 475# spring on a GG. It would generate ~15Xmm of travel if you run it in Gravity Mode. I had it on my Gnarvana for two years and loved it. Happy to ship it to you if you wanted to give it a go.... at least it is something more you could try without spending extra money on the bike.
Feel free to PM me if you are interested.