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Guitar related. Lespaul vs Strat (HSS).

math2014

wannabe curb dropper
Sep 2, 2003
1,198
0
I want to move to BC!!!
So here is the deal. Last november i started playing the guitar as you can remember. I got a cheapo squier fat strat. Later on i got a second guitar in Greece, an SG epiphone so that i could play there while i was on vacation. Furthermore back in England, i moved to a proper tube amp, with hotplate and fuzz pedal, still with the squier. So its time with progress to get a proper guitar. I am mostly playing 60s and 70s hard rock (Zep, Cream, Sabbath, Grand Funk, etc.) and a spice of modern stuff such as Placebo, Tool and Metallica.

So i am between a USA Std Strat, HSS (with humbucker), and a Japanese Tokai LesPaul (much better than the Gibson equivalents). What do you reckon? What would meet my needs better? Mahogany set neck and 2x hums or a strat with a hum and 2 singles?

Pricewise we are talking for the same price for the Tokai and the Fender.

Cheers
Yannis
 

pnj

Turbo Monkey till the fat lady sings
Aug 14, 2002
4,699
40
seattle
you've been playing for one year about?

how much have you progressed? what can you play? can you read music? do you know theory? or are you just learning songs from tab/ear?
do you play other instruments?
just curious..

I say get the gibson. look at the bands that play the music you are playing and see what they play...
 

peter6061

Turbo Monkey
Nov 19, 2001
1,577
0
Kenmore, WA
math2014 said:
So i am between a USA Std Strat, HSS (with humbucker), and a Japanese Tokai LesPaul (much better than the Gibson equivalents). What do you reckon? What would meet my needs better? Mahogany set neck and 2x hums or a strat with a hum and 2 singles?
The price range on these Tokai guitars seems more similar to the Epiphone Les Pauls and not the actual Gibsons. Which models are you comparing to?
 

math2014

wannabe curb dropper
Sep 2, 2003
1,198
0
I want to move to BC!!!
Ok here is the deal peter.

Korean Tokais ALS series, is comparable and better than Epiphone Korea.
Japanese Tokai LS series, is comparable with Gibsons only and usually better.

For example.
LS65-85 ~ Les Paul Std, Std Plus etc.
LS200 ~ Les Paul Custom shop R5
LS320 ~ Les Paul Custom Shop R9.

As for what i do with music. I had no relationship whatsoever with music 1 year ago. I started selftaught, and now i play some songs from Led Zeppelin (Black Dog, The Rover, The Ocean, Moby Dick etc..), Cream, Deep Purple (Smoke on the water, Black night, Rush...), Black Sabbath (Ironman), Metallica (Enter Sandman), and some riffs/licks of my own. I need to make some progress on my solo/lead skills, on hammer ons, pulloffs and legatos.

Mostly by ear and tab, and some pentatonic theory.
 

pnj

Turbo Monkey till the fat lady sings
Aug 14, 2002
4,699
40
seattle
why do you need a new guitar? is yours a complete pile of junk?

skills will always outweight equipment.

*it's your money, do as you wish. I would suggest playing what you have for another year and save another grand or so and get a really really nice guitar when your skill level is higher....
 

math2014

wannabe curb dropper
Sep 2, 2003
1,198
0
I want to move to BC!!!
pnj said:
why do you need a new guitar? is yours a complete pile of junk?

skills will always outweight equipment.

*it's your money, do as you wish. I would suggest playing what you have for another year and save another grand or so and get a really really nice guitar when your skill level is higher....
Fair point bro, i need or want a new guitar coz really the Squire that i got now, is the cheapest guitar in the market, literally and metaphorically...
 

math2014

wannabe curb dropper
Sep 2, 2003
1,198
0
I want to move to BC!!!
Well the Squier was great as a starter, at a time where all guitars sounded and looked the same to me, but now i am at a point to tell a MIM from a MIA strat, an LP studio from LP classic, and LP std, just by playing and listening.

But right now the Squier sounds thin above all, and upgrading her with new pickups etc, isnt the wisest idea imho.
 

partsbara

Turbo Monkey
Nov 16, 2001
3,996
0
getting Xtreme !
sounds to me like you re more into the gibson / les paul kinda sound... strats and teles are great, very versatile, but you ll prolly enjoy a les paul more... i have a jap made epiphone LP in a sweet tigerstripe red / yellow... it s bar none (gibson and epi) the heaviest LP i ve ever felt.... like a brick

personally i like my tele more... again a jap made axe... 52 reissue...

i want an orange or-120 amp :drool:
 

math2014

wannabe curb dropper
Sep 2, 2003
1,198
0
I want to move to BC!!!
So partsbara, you are a fan of jap axes huh? BTW, Epi Japan, Tokai, and ESP japan (all instruments unavailable to the USA) are supposedly the best of the crop as far as musical instruments go worldwide.
 

Leethal

Turbo Monkey
Oct 27, 2001
1,244
0
Avondale (Phoenix)
USA Fender vs. Tokai; I would get the USA Fender, the Fender is a life-time keeper, get it and later you can get a PRS Mccarty or something if you want that sound and have two nice guitars... IF you really want a nice humbucker sound for cheap check out the Yamaha's..
 

math2014

wannabe curb dropper
Sep 2, 2003
1,198
0
I want to move to BC!!!
Leethal said:
USA Fender vs. Tokai; I would get the USA Fender, the Fender is a life-time keeper, get it and later you can get a PRS Mccarty or something if you want that sound and have two nice guitars... IF you really want a nice humbucker sound for cheap check out the Yamaha's..
How come the Fender is a keeper whereas the Tokai isnt? Just based on brand on the headstock?

I am undecided on Fender vs Tokai so feel free to shoot with ideas and suggestions.
 

Leethal

Turbo Monkey
Oct 27, 2001
1,244
0
Avondale (Phoenix)
math2014 said:
How come the Fender is a keeper whereas the Tokai isnt? Just based on brand on the headstock?

I am undecided on Fender vs Tokai so feel free to shoot with ideas and suggestions.
I guess so the Tokai is what it is, I mean great functional guitar but will never have the history and value holding properties of a Fender, right or wrong Fender has a much greater presence in the history of Rock... They don't have statues of Tokai guitars at the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame... sound wise a good amp is still a much bigger part of the picture.
 

partsbara

Turbo Monkey
Nov 16, 2001
3,996
0
getting Xtreme !
math2014 said:
So partsbara, you are a fan of jap axes huh? BTW, Epi Japan, Tokai, and ESP japan (all instruments unavailable to the USA) are supposedly the best of the crop as far as musical instruments go worldwide.

did nt plan it that way with my 2 electrics... i was in japan for about 18 months... picked em both up there...

i think the older - mid 80s jap stuff is as good as many american made guits... perhaps better ???
 

math2014

wannabe curb dropper
Sep 2, 2003
1,198
0
I want to move to BC!!!
A gibson? Never... i dislike them utterly, especially with the recent trade practices they administer. A gibson of the old time yes, but my $$ wont go to Gibson. Either Tokai or Fender, or anything not made by Gibson.

BTW i saw this today

http://www.prsguitars.com/showcase/current/moderneagle.html

Nice guitar but not for playing ;)

Oh, and the guitar thread inbetween the gas threads? You play guitar on the streets to get gas money :P
 

offtheedge

Monkey
Aug 26, 2005
955
0
LB
Dude there is nothing better than a "REAL" Les Paul.

Gibson had some crap years, but even those compared to any rip offs are way better.

I've played hundreds of different guitars from all makers and nothing beats a us made les paul. Spend the extra money on a custom shop (1900.00 on ebay) and have a rock solid guitar for life. Buy junk and replace it in 5 or 10 years, plus a real les paul only gains value. No knock off will do that.

as for strats go mexican. cheap and reliable.

a good amp will make a crappy guitar sing.
 

GumbaFish

Turbo Monkey
Oct 5, 2004
1,747
0
Rochester N.Y.
first off how much are you looking to spend exactly? it doesn't sound like a fender is probably for you, i have a strat and play a lot of the music you do but i also have to play around with a pedal to get it closer to the kind of sound bands like led zeppelin have. the main reason i got a strat is because i mainly play blues and its pretty darn good for that in my opinion, especially since i am big into SRV and clapton. as far as i am concerned amps are more important then guitars. if you have a really good amp you can make a modestly decent guitar sound pretty darn good. then again i'd probably have a nicer electric if i didn't have a really nice acoustic and wasnt into biking. i know plenty of kids with epi's that sound good, just have to play around and get it right.
 

math2014

wannabe curb dropper
Sep 2, 2003
1,198
0
I want to move to BC!!!
Well, i got a 30W class A british valve amp, with a boutique fuzz pedal (clone of what Page used) and a Thd hotplate in order to have the amp as high as i want without crushing the walls.

Point is that indeed an Epi could suit my needs, but i already have an Epi in another country, and the price difference between an Epi LP and a Tokai (Gibson Level) LP is negligible.

So a strat is more suited for blues and such even with a humbucker huh?
 

pnj

Turbo Monkey till the fat lady sings
Aug 14, 2002
4,699
40
seattle
so you just buying a shape?

think about it.......

get a warlock then.;)
 

GumbaFish

Turbo Monkey
Oct 5, 2004
1,747
0
Rochester N.Y.
ok to be fair if its not a fender(or squire) its not a strat and if its not a gibson (or epi) its not a les paul. they might be look alikes but its not the same. also i find it odd that you think the best 'strats' aren't even made by the company that invented them instead being made by a company that knocked them off.
 

partsbara

Turbo Monkey
Nov 16, 2001
3,996
0
getting Xtreme !
GumbaFish said:
ok to be fair if its not a fender(or squire) its not a strat and if its not a gibson (or epi) its not a les paul. they might be look alikes but its not the same. also i find it odd that you think the best 'strats' aren't even made by the company that invented them instead being made by a company that knocked them off.
what r u on ???
 

math2014

wannabe curb dropper
Sep 2, 2003
1,198
0
I want to move to BC!!!
Well Leo for one, went on and started G&L, so G&L are less strats that Fender Strats?

Imho what makes a guitar an LP is the shape and tone, and not the name on the headstock, just my 2cents. Slash for example played extensively an LP made by an LA luthier that wasnt Gibson.

Now officially yes, Stratocaster, Telecaster, LesPaul etc, are registered trademarks/names for Fender FMIC group and Gibson Group of companies respectively.

This is a bit like, if it is not Specialized it is not horst link/FSR, etc.
 

GumbaFish

Turbo Monkey
Oct 5, 2004
1,747
0
Rochester N.Y.
i guess i'm just used to referring to guitars by their actual names instead of based on the body shape, but i see what you mean now. i can't say i am familiar with japanese brands so i thought the ones you were looking at were just the cheap knock off variety. and fyi i'm not 'on' anything, i've just never mey anybody who refers to guitars of a similar shape and sound to a strat or lp as a strat or lp.
 

pnj

Turbo Monkey till the fat lady sings
Aug 14, 2002
4,699
40
seattle
gibson makes LP
Fender makes Strats

other people make copies....

;)