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Guitar related. Lespaul vs Strat (HSS).

Discussion in 'The Lounge' started by math2014, Aug 31, 2005.

  1. math2014

    math2014 wannabe curb dropper

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    So here is the deal. Last november i started playing the guitar as you can remember. I got a cheapo squier fat strat. Later on i got a second guitar in Greece, an SG epiphone so that i could play there while i was on vacation. Furthermore back in England, i moved to a proper tube amp, with hotplate and fuzz pedal, still with the squier. So its time with progress to get a proper guitar. I am mostly playing 60s and 70s hard rock (Zep, Cream, Sabbath, Grand Funk, etc.) and a spice of modern stuff such as Placebo, Tool and Metallica.

    So i am between a USA Std Strat, HSS (with humbucker), and a Japanese Tokai LesPaul (much better than the Gibson equivalents). What do you reckon? What would meet my needs better? Mahogany set neck and 2x hums or a strat with a hum and 2 singles?

    Pricewise we are talking for the same price for the Tokai and the Fender.

    Cheers
    Yannis
     

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  2. MMike

    MMike A fowl peckerwood.

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    Strat likley isn't your thing.... Doesn't sound like you play without distortion ever, so I doubt the Strat would suit you needs......
     
  3. math2014

    math2014 wannabe curb dropper

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    95% i play a tilted valve amp on distortion with a tonebender fuzz pedal slammed up front.
     
  4. pnj

    pnj Turbo Monkey till the fat lady sings

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    you've been playing for one year about?

    how much have you progressed? what can you play? can you read music? do you know theory? or are you just learning songs from tab/ear?
    do you play other instruments?
    just curious..

    I say get the gibson. look at the bands that play the music you are playing and see what they play...
     
  5. peter6061

    peter6061 Turbo Monkey

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    The price range on these Tokai guitars seems more similar to the Epiphone Les Pauls and not the actual Gibsons. Which models are you comparing to?
     
  6. math2014

    math2014 wannabe curb dropper

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    Ok here is the deal peter.

    Korean Tokais ALS series, is comparable and better than Epiphone Korea.
    Japanese Tokai LS series, is comparable with Gibsons only and usually better.

    For example.
    LS65-85 ~ Les Paul Std, Std Plus etc.
    LS200 ~ Les Paul Custom shop R5
    LS320 ~ Les Paul Custom Shop R9.

    As for what i do with music. I had no relationship whatsoever with music 1 year ago. I started selftaught, and now i play some songs from Led Zeppelin (Black Dog, The Rover, The Ocean, Moby Dick etc..), Cream, Deep Purple (Smoke on the water, Black night, Rush...), Black Sabbath (Ironman), Metallica (Enter Sandman), and some riffs/licks of my own. I need to make some progress on my solo/lead skills, on hammer ons, pulloffs and legatos.

    Mostly by ear and tab, and some pentatonic theory.
     
  7. pnj

    pnj Turbo Monkey till the fat lady sings

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    why do you need a new guitar? is yours a complete pile of junk?

    skills will always outweight equipment.

    *it's your money, do as you wish. I would suggest playing what you have for another year and save another grand or so and get a really really nice guitar when your skill level is higher....
     
  8. math2014

    math2014 wannabe curb dropper

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    Fair point bro, i need or want a new guitar coz really the Squire that i got now, is the cheapest guitar in the market, literally and metaphorically...
     
  9. MMike

    MMike A fowl peckerwood.

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    While I agree with pnj, a squire can be really annoying to play... won't stay in tune for more than 8 sec. etc......
     
  10. math2014

    math2014 wannabe curb dropper

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    Well the Squier was great as a starter, at a time where all guitars sounded and looked the same to me, but now i am at a point to tell a MIM from a MIA strat, an LP studio from LP classic, and LP std, just by playing and listening.

    But right now the Squier sounds thin above all, and upgrading her with new pickups etc, isnt the wisest idea imho.
     
  11. partsbara

    partsbara Turbo Monkey

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    sounds to me like you re more into the gibson / les paul kinda sound... strats and teles are great, very versatile, but you ll prolly enjoy a les paul more... i have a jap made epiphone LP in a sweet tigerstripe red / yellow... it s bar none (gibson and epi) the heaviest LP i ve ever felt.... like a brick

    personally i like my tele more... again a jap made axe... 52 reissue...

    i want an orange or-120 amp :drool:
     
  12. math2014

    math2014 wannabe curb dropper

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    So partsbara, you are a fan of jap axes huh? BTW, Epi Japan, Tokai, and ESP japan (all instruments unavailable to the USA) are supposedly the best of the crop as far as musical instruments go worldwide.
     
  13. Leethal

    Leethal Turbo Monkey

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    USA Fender vs. Tokai; I would get the USA Fender, the Fender is a life-time keeper, get it and later you can get a PRS Mccarty or something if you want that sound and have two nice guitars... IF you really want a nice humbucker sound for cheap check out the Yamaha's..
     
  14. MMike

    MMike A fowl peckerwood.

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    I have a jap strat (50's reissue) that I've had since 1993. It has treated me very well
     
  15. math2014

    math2014 wannabe curb dropper

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    How come the Fender is a keeper whereas the Tokai isnt? Just based on brand on the headstock?

    I am undecided on Fender vs Tokai so feel free to shoot with ideas and suggestions.
     
  16. Leethal

    Leethal Turbo Monkey

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    I guess so the Tokai is what it is, I mean great functional guitar but will never have the history and value holding properties of a Fender, right or wrong Fender has a much greater presence in the history of Rock... They don't have statues of Tokai guitars at the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame... sound wise a good amp is still a much bigger part of the picture.
     
  17. math2014

    math2014 wannabe curb dropper

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    well i got a good amp already so :), my next step is a good guitar .
     
  18. partsbara

    partsbara Turbo Monkey

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    did nt plan it that way with my 2 electrics... i was in japan for about 18 months... picked em both up there...

    i think the older - mid 80s jap stuff is as good as many american made guits... perhaps better ???
     
  19. DRB

    DRB unemployed bum

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    quit getting inbetween the gas threads
     
  20. pnj

    pnj Turbo Monkey till the fat lady sings

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    i'd buy a real gibson. you know you want to......
     
  21. Leethal

    Leethal Turbo Monkey

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  22. math2014

    math2014 wannabe curb dropper

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    A gibson? Never... i dislike them utterly, especially with the recent trade practices they administer. A gibson of the old time yes, but my $$ wont go to Gibson. Either Tokai or Fender, or anything not made by Gibson.

    BTW i saw this today

    http://www.prsguitars.com/showcase/current/moderneagle.html

    Nice guitar but not for playing ;)

    Oh, and the guitar thread inbetween the gas threads? You play guitar on the streets to get gas money :P
     
  23. peter6061

    peter6061 Turbo Monkey

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  24. offtheedge

    offtheedge Monkey

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    Dude there is nothing better than a "REAL" Les Paul.

    Gibson had some crap years, but even those compared to any rip offs are way better.

    I've played hundreds of different guitars from all makers and nothing beats a us made les paul. Spend the extra money on a custom shop (1900.00 on ebay) and have a rock solid guitar for life. Buy junk and replace it in 5 or 10 years, plus a real les paul only gains value. No knock off will do that.

    as for strats go mexican. cheap and reliable.

    a good amp will make a crappy guitar sing.
     
  25. Leethal

    Leethal Turbo Monkey

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    Just consider the scratches you put on it character building...
     
  26. math2014

    math2014 wannabe curb dropper

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    yes you got a point, but PRS to me looks like a jewel that i wouldnt wanna scratch.
     
  27. GumbaFish

    GumbaFish Turbo Monkey

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    first off how much are you looking to spend exactly? it doesn't sound like a fender is probably for you, i have a strat and play a lot of the music you do but i also have to play around with a pedal to get it closer to the kind of sound bands like led zeppelin have. the main reason i got a strat is because i mainly play blues and its pretty darn good for that in my opinion, especially since i am big into SRV and clapton. as far as i am concerned amps are more important then guitars. if you have a really good amp you can make a modestly decent guitar sound pretty darn good. then again i'd probably have a nicer electric if i didn't have a really nice acoustic and wasnt into biking. i know plenty of kids with epi's that sound good, just have to play around and get it right.
     
  28. math2014

    math2014 wannabe curb dropper

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    Well, i got a 30W class A british valve amp, with a boutique fuzz pedal (clone of what Page used) and a Thd hotplate in order to have the amp as high as i want without crushing the walls.

    Point is that indeed an Epi could suit my needs, but i already have an Epi in another country, and the price difference between an Epi LP and a Tokai (Gibson Level) LP is negligible.

    So a strat is more suited for blues and such even with a humbucker huh?
     
  29. pnj

    pnj Turbo Monkey till the fat lady sings

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    so your just buying the gibson LP shape then?
     
  30. math2014

    math2014 wannabe curb dropper

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    Yes, i am just considering an LP, not a Gibson. Same with strats, the best strats are not fender, they are Suhr, Anderson etc...
     
  31. pnj

    pnj Turbo Monkey till the fat lady sings

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    so you just buying a shape?

    think about it.......

    get a warlock then.;)
     
  32. math2014

    math2014 wannabe curb dropper

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    No i am buying an LP, ESP Japan, Burny and Tokai Japan are more LP 54 accurate than anything else (including Gibson in several cases).
     
  33. GumbaFish

    GumbaFish Turbo Monkey

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    ok to be fair if its not a fender(or squire) its not a strat and if its not a gibson (or epi) its not a les paul. they might be look alikes but its not the same. also i find it odd that you think the best 'strats' aren't even made by the company that invented them instead being made by a company that knocked them off.
     
  34. partsbara

    partsbara Turbo Monkey

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    what r u on ???
     
  35. math2014

    math2014 wannabe curb dropper

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    Well Leo for one, went on and started G&L, so G&L are less strats that Fender Strats?

    Imho what makes a guitar an LP is the shape and tone, and not the name on the headstock, just my 2cents. Slash for example played extensively an LP made by an LA luthier that wasnt Gibson.

    Now officially yes, Stratocaster, Telecaster, LesPaul etc, are registered trademarks/names for Fender FMIC group and Gibson Group of companies respectively.

    This is a bit like, if it is not Specialized it is not horst link/FSR, etc.
     
  36. GumbaFish

    GumbaFish Turbo Monkey

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    i guess i'm just used to referring to guitars by their actual names instead of based on the body shape, but i see what you mean now. i can't say i am familiar with japanese brands so i thought the ones you were looking at were just the cheap knock off variety. and fyi i'm not 'on' anything, i've just never mey anybody who refers to guitars of a similar shape and sound to a strat or lp as a strat or lp.
     
  37. pnj

    pnj Turbo Monkey till the fat lady sings

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    gibson makes LP
    Fender makes Strats

    other people make copies....

    ;)
     
  38. math2014

    math2014 wannabe curb dropper

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    Totally fair enough gumba i didnt say you r on anything :).

    My main beef is to , "should i get a strat or an LP style guitar for my purposes"
     
  39. MMike

    MMike A fowl peckerwood.

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    I retract my answers because I have no idea what the copies sound like.