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Habitual Felon charge Racist? NAACP rant

manimal

Ociffer Tackleberry
Feb 27, 2002
7,213
22
Blindly running into cactus
so i'm watching the news last night and they have a story about how the NAACP is claiming that north carolina's habitual felon law is racist. the law states that if you have 3 felonies, the 4th one will put you away for about 15 yrs. naacp claims that this targets the black community:confused: because the percentage of black inmates in NC is something like 62%.

i don't friggin get it. my perspective has changed drastically since i've been doing the arresting and the people that are going up for the habitual felon charge truly deserve it. take color out of the equation and it's just the way it should be, the criminals are going to jail since they obviously can't keep straight, even after 3 tries.

i used to think that the life of crime/poverty was 100% their choice, i now understand that some are screwed from the get go. so the liberal side says: spend government money to build community outreach systems. the only problem is that they abuse it. i can't tell you how many housing developments i go into where the kids are in rags, eating rice and the "baby daddy" is living there with his $50k escalade, 52" plasma tv, sound system and clothes that cost more than my bike.

so where do we draw the line? the "system" is so completely abused that it's sickening. seems like a lose/lose situation.

now back to the original question, how does this habitual felon charge equate to racism? i've arrested plenty of white dudes on the same charge. a criminal is a criminal regardless of color......just another way to claim victimization i guess :rolleyes:
 

jdcamb

Tool Time!
Feb 17, 2002
20,067
8,816
Nowhere Man!
No matter how I work it out in my mind that claim is BS. Three strikes and your out. There is no way you can claim disadvantage after the third offense. You have pretty much decided to be a outlaw at that point and the system can only consider you to be incorrigible.....jdcamb
 

manimal

Ociffer Tackleberry
Feb 27, 2002
7,213
22
Blindly running into cactus
Originally posted by ohio
you've got me stumped. I guess I wold need to see the NAACP argument.

i know....i looked for an online article on it but couldn't find anything. heard it on t.v. last night. i'll keep searching, or if you know more news sites than me........................
 

LordOpie

MOTHER HEN
Oct 17, 2002
21,022
3
Denver
ha! I wonder what the NAACP would say if a few particular :monkey:s were in charge... three strikes and YOU'RE :dead:
 

$tinkle

Expert on blowing
Feb 12, 2003
14,591
6
Originally posted by LordOpie
ha! I wonder what the NAACP would say if a few particular :monkey:s were in charge... three strikes and YOU'RE :dead:
monkies, eh? that's rich.

don't you also know whitey, that crack laws are racist? Get caught w/ X amount of coke, and do Y time, get caught with X amount of crack, do 20Y time.

nevermind the correlation 'tween crack & violence
nevermind the fact that crack is harder to find & easier to conceal, thusly less crack peddlers get caught (you can keep rocks in your mouth, which can't be searched w/o prob cause - try that w/ an 8-ball)
nevermind that for equal amounts of coke & crack, crack will be more widely distributed.

nevermind.
 

$tinkle

Expert on blowing
Feb 12, 2003
14,591
6
"oh so soft & cuddle-eee"

thanks, i really didn't have to have that in my head in a tight loop.
 

RhinofromWA

Brevity R Us
Aug 16, 2001
4,622
0
Lynnwood, WA
Originally posted by $tinkle
"oh so soft & cuddle-eee"

thanks, i really didn't have to have that in my head in a tight loop.
Hahaha

Yeah I think of that about once every couple years......

but on the monkey....it seams to pop up now and again. I am glad I could find it in a search... :D
 

llkoolkeg

Ranger LL
Sep 5, 2001
4,335
15
in da shed, mon, in da shed
You tell 'em, Tackleberry! :D

Sadly, a colorblind judicial process is just as ethereal a fantasy as one in which money and politics play no role. Justice is obtainable only by he who can most afford it. For the record, though, I agree with you. Three felonies is more than enough to warrant an extended jail stay. The law itself is not racist, IMO. The application of it is where we run into trouble.
 

Toshi

butthole powerwashing evangelist
Oct 23, 2001
40,208
9,103
Originally posted by $tinkle
do go on
the link of causality is from the law's application and the incarceration of people convicted of multiple felonies. there is merely a correlation between being a person convicted of multiple felonies and being a minority. one cannot make the leap as the naacp does and claim that the law is racist, for that would imply that there is a direct causal link from the law's enforcement and minorities being imprisoned, and, as any good student will tell you, "correlation does not imply causation".
 

$tinkle

Expert on blowing
Feb 12, 2003
14,591
6
Originally posted by Toshi
the link of causality is from the law's application and the incarceration of people convicted of multiple felonies. there is merely a correlation between being a person convicted of multiple felonies and being a minority. one cannot make the leap as the naacp does and claim that the law is racist, for that would imply that there is a direct causal link from the law's enforcement and minorities being imprisoned, and, as any good student will tell you, "correlation does not imply causation".
there you go again with the truth obstructing frivilous litigation
 

manimal

Ociffer Tackleberry
Feb 27, 2002
7,213
22
Blindly running into cactus
what you said:

Originally posted by Toshi
the link of causality is from the law's application and the incarceration of people convicted of multiple felonies. there is merely a correlation between being a person convicted of multiple felonies and being a minority. one cannot make the leap as the naacp does and claim that the law is racist, for that would imply that there is a direct causal link from the law's enforcement and minorities being imprisoned, and, as any good student will tell you, "correlation does not imply causation".

what i read:

"waa, waa, waa, waaa....wuaa wuaa wuaa" (charlie brown's parents noise)

so are you agreeing or disagreeing that the charge is racist?:confused: .......as i am NOT a good student :D
 

valve bouncer

Master Dildoist
Feb 11, 2002
7,843
114
Japan
Originally posted by manimal
what you said:




what i read:

"waa, waa, waa, waaa....wuaa wuaa wuaa" (charlie brown's parents noise)

so are you agreeing or disagreeing that the charge is racist?:confused: .......as i am NOT a good student :D
I think he called you a fag Manimal:D :D ;) :p
 

manimal

Ociffer Tackleberry
Feb 27, 2002
7,213
22
Blindly running into cactus
Originally posted by llkoolkeg
You tell 'em, Tackleberry! :D

Sadly, a colorblind judicial process is just as ethereal a fantasy as one in which money and politics play no role. Justice is obtainable only by he who can most afford it. For the record, though, I agree with you. Three felonies is more than enough to warrant an extended jail stay. The law itself is not racist, IMO. The application of it is where we run into trouble.
i guess it's just too simple for me. for instance:

silent bank alarm goes off. i turn on the lights and siren, floor it, see a guy running out of the store with a gun and some sort of bag. i point my gun at him and tell him to stop, make him lie down.........handcuffs go on. the bag had several thousand dollars of sequential $100 bills. i take him before the magistrate who then puts him up for a $500k bail. the dude goes to jail until his trial. now, does it matter to me whether the guy was black or white? if he is black, should i not chase and arrest him because the system is possibly unfair to him? so what if it turns out that he's done the same thing 3 times prior......is it society's fault that he can't quit robbing banks?
i'll just stick to catching the folks doing the crime and let the courts put 'em back out for me to catch.
 

llkoolkeg

Ranger LL
Sep 5, 2001
4,335
15
in da shed, mon, in da shed
Originally posted by manimal
i guess it's just too simple for me. for instance:

silent bank alarm goes off. i turn on the lights and siren, floor it, see a guy running out of the store with a gun and some sort of bag. i point my gun at him and tell him to stop, make him lie down.........handcuffs go on. the bag had several thousand dollars of sequential $100 bills. i take him before the magistrate who then puts him up for a $500k bail. the dude goes to jail until his trial. now, does it matter to me whether the guy was black or white? if he is black, should i not chase and arrest him because the system is possibly unfair to him? so what if it turns out that he's done the same thing 3 times prior......is it society's fault that he can't quit robbing banks?
i'll just stick to catching the folks doing the crime and let the courts put 'em back out for me to catch.
It sounds to me like you're doing your job. There are certain jobs, e.g. police, soldiers, etc. that require more doing and less preliminary debating. If before every arrest or kill they paused to consider the social ramifications of what they were about to do from all angles, there would be a lot more folded flags delivered to grieving widows and names chiseled into memorials than there already are.
 

Toshi

butthole powerwashing evangelist
Oct 23, 2001
40,208
9,103
Originally posted by manimal
what i read:

"waa, waa, waa, waaa....wuaa wuaa wuaa" (charlie brown's parents noise)

so are you agreeing or disagreeing that the charge is racist?:confused: .......as i am NOT a good student :D
i'm saying that the naacp is full of it :D
 

Toshi

butthole powerwashing evangelist
Oct 23, 2001
40,208
9,103
Originally posted by manimal
oh...ok....good! :D


is this the first time we've agreed?:confused: :cool: :D
heh. seeing as i tend to vote libertarian, you should only be in the wrong about half the time ;) :D
 
Originally posted by manimal
i guess it's just too simple for me. for instance:

silent bank alarm goes off. i turn on the lights and siren, floor it, see a guy running out of the store with a gun and some sort of bag. i point my gun at him and tell him to stop, make him lie down.........handcuffs go on. the bag had several thousand dollars of sequential $100 bills. i take him before the magistrate who then puts him up for a $500k bail. the dude goes to jail until his trial. now, does it matter to me whether the guy was black or white? if he is black, should i not chase and arrest him because the system is possibly unfair to him? so what if it turns out that he's done the same thing 3 times prior......is it society's fault that he can't quit robbing banks?
The Lampooned Liberal take - You should not chase or hinder him in any way that may be construed as inhibiting his inability to obey the basic laws of personal property. To do so would be proof of the insidious intolerance that runs rampant throughout our society. After all,what is a little loss of money, property or personal injury but a small inconvenience compared to the loftier feelgood goal of tolerance. Now everyone sing together...CUM by Ah.


The Lampooned Conservative view - You should not chase or hinder him in his criminal endeavor. You need not arrest him. Just pull out your weapon and shoot him. Cuts down on the paperwork, processing, fingerprinting,etc. And by doing this, you will be doing your part in downsizing our bloated government and helping to return more control into local hands.
 

ALEXIS_DH

Tirelessly Awesome
Jan 30, 2003
6,254
878
Lima, Peru, Peru
Originally posted by manimal
what you said:




what i read:

"waa, waa, waa, waaa....wuaa wuaa wuaa" (charlie brown's parents noise)

so are you agreeing or disagreeing that the charge is racist?:confused: .......as i am NOT a good student :D
can somebody bring on the hand puppets to explain!
 

ohio

The Fresno Kid
Nov 26, 2001
6,649
26
SF, CA
Originally posted by Jorvik
I think that might just be me.

Habitual felons? .45 round in the back of the head, shallow grave. Or bring back public hanging.
at point blank a .22 will do it, and save you on cleanup. quit wasting taxpayer money.
what are you, a friggin liberal or something?
 

Damn True

Monkey Pimp
Sep 10, 2001
4,015
3
Between a rock and a hard place.
Originally posted by Toshi
i'm saying that the naacp is full of it :D
We are in "agreeance" :D .

Is the NAACP saying that the statute should not exist at all, or that it's application to people of color is wrong, and thereby stating that it's ok if it is applied to caucasians?

A criminal is a criminal is a criminal. Nobody is ever forced to sell crack, rob a bank, or commit violent crime. It's all a matter of choice. If somone chooses to be a repeat offender they should be locked up.

If you can't do the time, don't do the crime.
~Baretta
 

Damn True

Monkey Pimp
Sep 10, 2001
4,015
3
Between a rock and a hard place.
Originally posted by ohio
at point blank a .22 will do it, and save you on cleanup. quit wasting taxpayer money.
what are you, a friggin liberal or something?
A rope can be recycled.

Fiscal responsibility and ecologial conservation all wrapped up into one tidy little knot. (pun intended):D
 

DRB

unemployed bum
Oct 24, 2002
15,242
0
Watchin' you. Writing it all down.
I think that I heard the samething (but then again maybe not). The NAACP's arguement was not with the law itself but the application of the law. Its was asserting that a disportional number of black criminals were being prosecuted under the 3 strikes law then white criminals.

In most states the prosecutors are granted a great deal of discretion in how to handle these three strike offenders. Its not automatic in application, which would remove all doubt about it. They were saying that it was more likely that in similar circumstances that the black criminal would be prosecuted then the white criminal using the three strike laws. I believe California was specifically mentioned along with one other state that I can't remember. The counter point was that the NAACP was not taking the specific crimes into consideration but the NAACP said they were. Again its percentages and statistics but that was what they were saying as I remember it.

I can't find any reference to the specific piece or article that the TV segment came from.
 

$tinkle

Expert on blowing
Feb 12, 2003
14,591
6
Originally posted by DRB
I think that I heard the samething (but then again maybe not). The NAACP's arguement was not with the law itself but the application of the law. Its was asserting that a disportional number of black criminals were being prosecuted under the 3 strikes law then white criminals.
i would be more interested to see a correlation tween income levels & conviction rate.
but, that's not part of the naacp charter, so i won't look to them for supporting facts. unless, of course, income levels are inherently racist, too (just like the video cams that caught perps perping).

micheal tremoglie, an ex-philly cop, had a few things to say about racial profiling, an antecedent to disproportionate convictions of blacks.
A study published in the journal of the American Society of Criminology[1], states that there is little data available to corroborate claims of racial profiling. However, one would never know that by the news reports and the public statements by politicians of both parties. According to these sources, racial profiling by law enforcement is an irrefutable fact. One could only think that there is a significant amount of scientific data and peer reviewed research that indicates the existence of racial profiling.

However, the study, by Professor Ronald Weitzer and Professor Steven Tuch, unequivocally states that “little empirical data exists on racial profiling...It is commonly believed that African-Americans are more likely to be stopped… (however) corroborating information...is limited.”

Racial profiling allegations have been fraught with such fallacious logic since the issue gained national attention in 1998. I wrote about a study of racial profiling in Philadelphia commissioned by the Philadelphia branches of the ACLU and the NAACP. It was obvious that the study was not in accordance with the fundamental tenets of research in that, among other things, it did not eliminate a rival hypothesis. Yet, it was reported by the Philadelphia Inquirer and quoted in other media as though it were gospel.

The Lamberth study to which Harris refers in his book is flawed, according to Heather MacDonald of the Manhattan Institute. In her book, Are Cops Racist? MacDonald cites that Lamberth’s methodology was lacking in that it did not use an appropriate survey sample.

In assessing Lamberth’s study I was unable to determine if it were published in a peer-reviewed scholarly journal. Such publication is standard for academic research. My email to Lamberth requesting the name of a peer-reviewed journal that published his study has not received a reply. I did learn, however, that Lamberth has formed his own consulting firm and has contracts with various municipalities to help eradicate racial profiling, seriously clouding his objectivity.
 

Damn True

Monkey Pimp
Sep 10, 2001
4,015
3
Between a rock and a hard place.
Translating:

The reason why the NAACP insits that racial profiling exists is because there are more people of color in prisons than caucasians. They have no other science to back it up.

Of course, one could also draw a differing, but equally ill concieved conclusion that because there are more people of color in prisons than caucasins that there are more crimes commited by people of color.

Looking back to Sub's comment, correlation is not causation.
 

Jorvik

Monkey
Jan 29, 2002
810
0
I honestly don't know anymore.
Originally posted by ohio
at point blank a .22 will do it, and save you on cleanup. quit wasting taxpayer money.
what are you, a friggin liberal or something?
I just want the job done right. Their heads better be splattered all over the deck in front of 'em. A .22 is just too pussy for public executions.
 

N8 v2.0

Not the sharpest tool in the shed
Oct 18, 2002
11,003
149
The Cleft of Venus
A friend of mine went to a Saudi execution while he was deployed there... Saudi is NOT the place you wanna end up on Death Row... :dead: