[valve bouncer]

Well it looks like Hamas will, if not form the new Palestinian government, then at least have a big say in who does.
I can see this going 2 ways....
The glass half full view- Power will moderate Hamas and enable then to expand the work they've done in providing health, education and welfare which is probably why they did so well.
The glass half empty view-

 

[LordOpie]

agree with your assessment.

This is the eventual death of Hamas... they either have to start acting responsibily or die. They can no longer commit terrorist acts as they'd now be considered acts of war.

 

[Tenchiro]

New boy in the neighborhood
Lives downstairs and it is understood.
He’s there just to take good care of me,
Like he’s one of the family.

Hamas in Charge
Of our days and our nights
Hamas in Charge
Of our wrongs and our rights

And I sing, I want,
I want Hamas in Charge of me.

Hamas in Charge
Of our days and our nights
Hamas in Charge
Of our wrongs and our rights

And I sing, I want,
I want Hamas in Charge of me.

 

[Westy]

New boy in the neighborhood
Lives downstairs and it is understood.
He’s there just to take good care of me,
Like he’s one of the family.

Hamas in Charge
Of our days and our nights
Hamas in Charge
Of our wrongs and our rights

And I sing, I want,
I want Hamas in Charge of me.

Hamas in Charge
Of our days and our nights
Hamas in Charge
Of our wrongs and our rights

And I sing, I want,
I want Hamas in Charge of me.

Does Hamas have a dorky dumb friend that is always hanging out?

 

[LordOpie]

Does Hamas have sex with the people they're in-charge of?


Tenchiro = the funny

 

[Tenchiro]

Does Hamas have a dorky dumb friend that is always hanging out?

The part of Hasib Hussain will be played by Willie Ames.

 

[Changleen]

Seriously, The Israelis have commited more violence against the Palestinians than vice versa. The death toll is approximately 2 to 1 in favour of the Israelis. Just because they use jets and their army to facilitate their violence because they can afford it does not make their violence any more acceptable or 'right'.

Bush is an utter hypocrite to refuse to deal with Hamas, who have won a democratic election with clear majority, bigger than his, with a larger percentage turnout to the polls than in the US.

Bush says he refuses to deal with a party with an armed wing, well, what is the difference between that and the Israel's leading party using Israel's army for it's own ends? Simply a question of names. What a bunch of Bullsh1t.

This is exactly the reason people hate that fvcking cock bandit so much, utter utter obvious hypocracy. "We want you to adopt democracy" - So they get it - "We still won't talk to you because we actually just don't like you".

Fvck you George.

 

[fluff]

If you want peace you have to negotiate with people you don't like, just as the British govt talked with Sinn Fein to get peace in Ireland

 

[Changleen]

Exactly. Democracy doesn't mean 'Right wing christian supremacy'.

 

[Echo]

Bush is an utter hypocrite to refuse to deal with Hamas, who have won a democratic election with clear majority, bigger than his, with a larger percentage turnout to the polls than in the US.

Same thing with Venezuela's pres. Voted in with like an 80% majority if I remember correctly. Bush doesn't give a sh!t about "democracy" or "freedom", all the cares about is money and oil. Oh and political "favors".

 

[Changleen]

Grrr this enrages me....

 

[BurlyShirley]

I just hope at least on more guy in a wheel chair gets shot with a missile.

 

[LordOpie]

Seriously, The Israelis have commited more violence....

If you want peace you have to negotiate with people you don't like, just as the British govt talked with Sinn Fein to get peace in Ireland

What part of Hamas' pledge to destroy the nation of Israel at all cost don'tcha understand?

They've been quite open about their hatred. If they want peace, they're going to have to make some sort of statement retracting their previous position.

Otherwise, it's nothing more than a delay tactic while they prepare for battle.

 

[PonySoldier]

.....
Bush says he refuses to deal with a party with an armed wing, well, what is the difference between that and the Israel's leading party using Israel's army for it's own ends? Simply a question of names. What a bunch of Bullsh1t......

Actually this probably isn't far different then when FATAH first became organized as the representative Palestinian political authority...

 

[Westy]

Too bad it wasn't Hummus who gained power. Get Bagel Chips in control in Israel and it would be quite the tasty combo.

 

[Changleen]

What part of Hamas' pledge to destroy the nation of Israel at all cost don'tcha understand?

Uh, the part where they have no actual means or ability to carry it out? It's just sabre ratling, extremist Jews advocate the same thing about Palestine, and they DO have the means. both militarily and economically. However, the American media doesn't like to trumpet that so loudly for some reason.

They've been quite open about their hatred. If they want peace, they're going to have to make some sort of statement retracting their previous position.

Whereas Israel doesn't have to do anything? At least Hamas are honest about their feelings. I agree a statement like this would be quite helpful in the current circumstances though.

Otherwise, it's nothing more than a delay tactic while they prepare for battle.

Battle with their daily circumstances of abject poverty?

 

[Changleen]

Too bad it wasn't Hummus who gained power. Get Bagel Chips in control in Israel and it would be quite the tasty combo.

Bacon sprinkles go well with that.

 

[LordOpie]

Uh, the part where they have no actual means or ability to carry it out? It's just sabre ratling, extremist Jews advocate the same thing about Palestine, and they DO have the means. both militarily and economically. However, the American media doesn't like to trumpet that so loudly for some reason.

Whereas Israel doesn't have to do anything? At least Hamas are honest about their feelings. I agree a statement like this would be quite helpful in the current circumstances though.

Battle with their daily circumstances of abject poverty?

They have some means, maybe a little.

If the political party IN-CHARGE of Israel made statements that they want to kill all palestinians... yeah, I'd have a huge problem with that.

Israel isn't the golden child, they've certainly killed, but they were working (slowly) with Abbas towards something positive. As such, why does Israel need to do anything at this point other than accept an offer to continue negotiations?

Would you negotiate with someone who's formally declared their desire to destroy you and your family? Wouldn't you want something, anything, from them that at least hints that they're serious about long-term peace? Some small token?

 

[Changleen]

Yes, it would be nice. But as a Palestinian I'd also like it if I could sleep without worrying about being in the blast radus of a retaliatory airstrike or having my house bulldosed while I'm still in it.

Just because Israel doesn't openly declare their intentions towards Paelstine doesn't really change the reality of what they've been doing over the years - destroying these people's infrastructure and economics. A far more effective tactic than random desperate suicide bombings, and supported and paid for largely by the US.

 

[HarryCallahan]

Hamas is going to find out it is a lot harder to be in charge than to criticize the folks in charge. And if the guys at the top actually moderate their views to work for peace, the hardliners will accuse them of selling out.

I feel sorry for all the ordinary folks caught up in this, and what a choice: the old, corrupt bunch or Hamas.

 

[LordOpie]

Yes, it would be nice. But as a Palestinian I'd also like it if I could sleep without worrying about being in the blast radus of a retaliatory airstrike or having my house bulldosed while I'm still in it.

Just because Israel doesn't openly declare their intentions towards Paelstine doesn't really change the reality of what they've been doing over the years - destroying these people's infrastructure and economics. A far more effective tactic than random desperate suicide bombings, and supported and paid for largely by the US.

mmmm red herring is so tasty.

 

[BurlyShirley]

Hamas is going to find out it is a lot harder to be in charge than to criticize the folks in charge. And if the guys at the top actually moderate their views to work for peace, the hardliners will accuse them of selling out.

I feel sorry for all the ordinary folks caught up in this, and what a choice: the old, corrupt bunch or Hamas.

Why dont they just convert?

 

[Changleen]

Would you negotiate with someone who's formally declared their desire to destroy you and your family? Wouldn't you want something, anything, from them that at least hints that they're serious about long-term peace? Some small token?

Just to be clear, Yes, it would be helpful.

 

[Changleen]

Why dont they just convert?

Why don't you?

 

[Changleen]

mmmm red herring is so tasty.

Don't be gay.

 

[LordOpie]

Just to be clear, Yes, it would be helpful.

Just to be clear... it would be required.

Hamas aren't the type of people to lie about something like this... if they can utter the words: "we want peace" or "we accept your existence" or something like that, then Israel should move forward with effort.

Isn't it reasonable that they retract their statement of destroy Israel?

 

[BurlyShirley]

Why don't you?

Cause Im not being threatened at gunpoint.

 

[Changleen]

That attitude is why you'll have so much trouble getting peace.

Haven't you learned by now you never get everything you want?

Seriously, what's the point in demanding Hamas retract a statement they have no ability to ever carry out as a condition to continue peace talks? It's just a deliberate delaying tactic by people who'd rather not see peace at all.

If Israel wants such a statement from Hamas, doesn't Hamas deserve the same sentiment to be expressed by Israel?

Can't you just NOT get hung up on an old battle-cry from the bad old days and get on with things like adults? Probably not...

 

[Changleen]

Cause Im not being threatened at gunpoint.

LMAO. That's funny cos it's nasty.

 

[LordOpie]

How about this...

do any of you think Hamas wants peace?

 

[BurlyShirley]

How about this...

do any of you think Hamas wants peace?

No. I think they want all the jews dead. Honestly.

 

[Changleen]

How about this...

do any of you think Hamas wants peace?

I think they want Palestinain people to be able to live their lives in a reasonable level of security and comfort, just as anyone else does.

 

[Changleen]

No. I think they want all the jews dead. Honestly.

For some of them, who've lived their whole lives in a constant battle with a more powerful enemy, I can imagine that that seems like one of the only solutions. However, this is clearly an extreme point of view which won't be held by them all.

 

[Changleen]

This is how Hamas sees it:

"We are not playing terrorism or violence. We are under occupation," he told BBC World TV.

"The Israelis are continuing their aggression against our people, killing, detention, demolition and in order to stop these processes, we run effective self defence by all means, including using guns."

You've got to admit he has a point.

However both sides need to stop blaming the other for everything and man up.

 

[Changleen]

BTW, Hamas' pledge to destroy Israel did not feature in its poll manifesto.

and from the Beeb:

In the last few months, they [Hamas] have been discussing strengthening and extending the current ceasefire with the Israelis and pointedly not ruling out indirect negotiations with them.

 

[MikeD]

New boy in the neighborhood
Lives downstairs and it is understood.
He’s there just to take good care of me,
Like he’s one of the family.

Hamas in Charge
Of our days and our nights
Hamas in Charge
Of our wrongs and our rights

And I sing, I want,
I want Hamas in Charge of me.

Hamas in Charge
Of our days and our nights
Hamas in Charge
Of our wrongs and our rights

And I sing, I want,
I want Hamas in Charge of me.

Goddamn it, I was gonna post that at 630 AM, but I didn't have time to google the lyrics before I had to be at work...(damn dialup).

On another note, a Jersey band called "Loose" used to do a wicked cover of that song.

 

[MikeD]

What part of Hamas' pledge to destroy the nation of Israel at all cost don'tcha understand?

They've been quite open about their hatred. If they want peace, they're going to have to make some sort of statement retracting their previous position.

Otherwise, it's nothing more than a delay tactic while they prepare for battle.

Even if they do retract their statements, the proof is in the deed...and I'd still expect them to be hiding continuing aggressive preparations behind any front of conciliation.

That's not to put Israel totally in the light of a victim, either, but how can you trust Hamas in the long term? Even if they do make an honest attempt at peace, I guarantee that many people will make this impossible as they reject the leadership of the peacemongers, and continue (with or without a wink and a nod and apologies of helplessness) to try and destroy Israel.

Plus, the Palestinean machine is so corrupted that 'leadership' is pretty much gangster-style and used to provide for one's own faction, friends, and family rather than the nation as a whole...with the Palestinean leadership, it's an effort to dominate the 'nation' in order to cement your own as the cats in charge, IMHO. Thanks, Arafat, for your wonderful legacy...

MD

 

[ALEXIS_DH]

That attitude is why you'll have so much trouble getting peace.

Haven't you learned by now you never get everything you want?

Seriously, what's the point in demanding Hamas retract a statement they have no ability to ever carry out as a condition to continue peace talks? It's just a deliberate delaying tactic by people who'd rather not see peace at all.

If Israel wants such a statement from Hamas, doesn't Hamas deserve the same sentiment to be expressed by Israel?

Can't you just NOT get hung up on an old battle-cry from the bad old days and get on with things like adults? Probably not...

so not having the means to execute somebody, makes you a safe nutjob worth dealing with????

i dont think so.

 

[Changleen]

so not having the means to execute somebody, makes you a safe nutjob worth dealing with????

i dont think so.

If somebody doesn't have the power to offer a service, you shouldn't take his offer to provide it seriously.

 

[ALEXIS_DH]

If somebody doesn't have the power to offer a service, you shouldn't take his offer to provide it seriously.

firstable, thats not the right analogy. thats a double negative.

if its not 100% certain he´d not acquire the power at any future point, then i´d have to asign a value to that.

and even if 100% is not attainable, still... killing a few every now and then also give bargaining power.