Quantcast

Hand Position

E

ezl_oo

Chimp
Jun 11, 2009
52
0
West New York, NJ
I have small hands and it's pretty tough for me when riding downhill to keep one finger on the brake lever and the rest of my fingers on the grips. Which results in my hands and forearms get tired and pumped really fast. I also don't feel like I have much control and grip when doing jumps and drops.

I was going to try to ride most of the time with my whole hand on the grip/bars and get my reaction timing fast enough to press the brakes whenever needed. What are you guys hand position while downhilling, do you guys have any techniques or recommendations?
 
norbar

norbar

KESSLER PROBLEM. Just cause
Jun 7, 2007
11,500
1,719
Warsaw :/
Smaller grips are a good idea but for arm pump just train your muscles. I've spent all my winter in the gym and now the only part of my body that gets tired on the track is the one I couldn't train due to injury. Last year I had similar problems.
 
chillindrdude

chillindrdude

Turbo Monkey
Jan 18, 2002
1,852
23
Northern VA, a peckerwood with too many guns
on the flats or non-technical dh portions i keep my hands off the brakes completely. while reaction time is longer, i think it psychologically makes me feel faster. i reason that i'm less apt to ride with the brakes on, and forced to brake later into corners and technical sections.
 
Sandwich

Sandwich

Pig my fish!
Staff member
May 23, 2002
21,671
6,888
borcester rhymes
Three things cured my arm pump, and I don't think any of them had anything to do with getting stronger or working out, since I haven't done that in a year.

1) Smaller grips. I switched from ODI lockon rogues to lockon Intenses with the flange. The grips are somewhat narrower and have a bit more padding, vs. the just thick rogues. Try a pair of ruffians, intenses, or sunlines. Or go back to non-lockon grips and glue the bejesus out of them.

2) Wider bars. These may not be the direct cure of my arm pump, but I went from 670mm monkey bars to way too wide Kore 800s and I love them. Conventional wisdom suggests somewhere in between, but I wouldn't go back to anything narrower than 29 on my DH bike and probably 28 on a trail bike, if I had my say.

3) Better brakes! I originally had a pair of paperweight strength Hopes on my bike, and no amount of bleeding or changing pads or lever positioning or anything could cure them. The pads were simply not big enough to deal with the heat of DH riding. By the end of the run, I had no power. I switched to magura gustavs, which had plenty of power, but no modulation, and an awful lever feel. Finally I got a set of the new 810 Saints, and they're perfect. I can dial in the levers so they're nice and close, there's plenty of power, and little or zero fade.

Somewhere in the mix of those three, I'm fatigue free at the end of most runs. I would personally start with narrower grips, then go wider, then go bigger brakes if necessary.
 
E

epic

Turbo Monkey
Sep 15, 2008
1,041
21
Also make sure you are in balance. Standing on the pedals not hanging from the bars. If I get defensive and behind the bike that's when my hands get tired.
 
Supa8

Supa8

Monkey
May 3, 2002
493
0
Middle of MA
Coming from a fellow no hander here are my tips.

Adjust levers so the throw is very short to the bar. Best is with a set of brakes that allow pad contact adjustment other wise you will need to reset you pad contact often by removing the front wheel and slightly squeezing the brakes.

Make sure your levers are not pointed to downward.

Run thinner grips. I like Ruffian extremes as they have a waffle pattern in the front of the grip.

Make sure your bar rotation is so it feels natural resting your hands and not curling your wrists too much.

All these take a bit of time to set up but make a big difference. The pad contact adjustment is a must running the lever throw short to the bar.
 
E

ezl_oo

Chimp
Jun 11, 2009
52
0
West New York, NJ
Thanks for all the good info!! I will try alot of these suggestions and see which ones work out the best. Here is some info on the bike.

1.) 28" wide - Sunline V1 OS low-rise Handlebars

2.) Sunline Half-Waffle Brown Grips

3.) 2006 Avid Codes with 203mm rotor up front and 185mm out back (they have the pad contact adjustment knob on the levers)
 
Supa8

Supa8

Monkey
May 3, 2002
493
0
Middle of MA
Try running your lever throw to the grip at about a contact point about 5-7mm away from touching the grip. Scary close but makes all the difference if you have zero fingers.
 
E

ezl_oo

Chimp
Jun 11, 2009
52
0
West New York, NJ
epic said:
Also make sure you are in balance. Standing on the pedals not hanging from the bars. If I get defensive and behind the bike that's when my hands get tired.
Click to expand...

This may have alot to do why my hands are so tired and have arm pump! I get defensive from the very beginning and find myself standing on the pedals hanging off the back of the bike for any little bump or drop. Also with brake lever adjustment and strength. My levers are pointing towards the floor, maybe I will bring them up more for comfort.
 
Supa8

Supa8

Monkey
May 3, 2002
493
0
Middle of MA
My levers are pointing towards the floor, maybe I will bring them up more for comfort.[/QUOTE]

That will make a big difference right there. I am super picky how my brakes are set up but have to be.
 
quickneonrt

quickneonrt

Turbo Monkey
Apr 8, 2003
1,611
0
Staten Island NY
Yeah move the levers up not horizontal with the ground though. I am a smaller guy and I have to ride either 2" or 1 1/2" x 28" bars. I tried 1" x 30" and it dosent work for me. I use the intense or ruffian grips and rotate the bars a little bit towards me. I also use a 35mm Diablous stem with a rise.
Lever adjustment you want the lever to rest comfortably in your 1st and 2nd knuckle from the tip of you index finger and move the lever further from the grip at the clamp so you can fit your hand on the grip and grab the end of the lever where it hooks. This gives you the best leverage for 1 finger braking which leaves the rest of your hand on the grip for more control without death gripping the bars and brakes.
I know most people are going lower and wider but anything over 28 spreads my arms out too far for good control. Also my dh bike is an SXT with a 180mm 66 so a lower bar and stem puts me too far over the bike, the taller bars and stem slacken it out more like a bigger dh bike making it easier for steep technical sections, rockgardens, drops and even jumps.
 
Sandwich

Sandwich

Pig my fish!
Staff member
May 23, 2002
21,671
6,888
borcester rhymes
You generally want your levers to be adjusted so your knuckles form a 45 degree angle. It maximizes grip strength and therefore reduces fatigue. Get on yo bike and get in your "downhill position" where you spend most of your time. Adjust levers so that from where your hands are, your knucks are about 45 degrees all the way around. They probably shouldn't be pointed straight down. As you ride more, you'll probably figure out what's most comfortable for you.

It's weird that the deitys and sunlines and codes and are still having these problems. Are you running heavily padded gloves?
 
Inclag

Inclag

Turbo Monkey
Sep 9, 2001
2,775
459
MA
There are a number of things that can be done to improve hand comfort and to reduce pump while riding. The reality is that there is no magical cure that will completely eliminate pump (actually there is one, but surgery is something that I think is ridiculous), however there are a number of things that can be done to reduce its effects.

Based on the OP it sounds as if one thing that you definitely need is a more ergonomic relationship between your hands, bars, and brake levers. Play around with different handlebar positions, grip diameters, brake lever position/rotation with relationship to the bar, brake lever reach, and lever throw. Playing around with these settings should rectify your issues with hand position.

Now, if pump is still persistent, 1st make sure that your brakes and suspension are properly set up. Fouled brakes and improperly tuned suspension can do a number on your arms and cause you to "death grip" the bars. When you do this, your forearm muscles contract and will swell while riding. Around these muscles is a sheath which does not expand, so when you are gripping your bars tightly, you are kind of "suffocating" them. They are not getting as much blood and oxygen as necessary, and nasties like lactic acid will build up.

Which brings me to physical things that you can do to reduce arm pump. Loosen up that grip, improve your cardio, and drink plenty of water. Improved muscle strength and core strength will do alot to help you remain stable on your bike and loosen your grip Of equal importance is good cardiovascular conditioning which will help blood flow through your restricted forearm muscles and of course staying hydrated since blood thickens when you're dehydrated.
 
soul-skier

soul-skier

Monkey
May 18, 2009
322
0
Mother Nature
what fork do you run? try slowing down the rebound and backing out the bottom-out. your brakes, bars, and grips sound fine. your lever position should allow your forearm, back of hand, and brake finger to align straight.
 
Bicyclist

Bicyclist

Turbo Monkey
Apr 4, 2004
10,152
2
SB
soul-skier said:
what fork do you run? try slowing down the rebound and backing out the bottom-out. your brakes, bars, and grips sound fine. your lever position should allow your forearm, back of hand, and brake finger to align straight.
Click to expand...
If anything faster rebound and more compression damping would be beneficial I would think...
 
Sandwich

Sandwich

Pig my fish!
Staff member
May 23, 2002
21,671
6,888
borcester rhymes
Bicyclist said:
If anything faster rebound and more compression damping would be beneficial I would think...
Click to expand...
word. ease up on the rebound and your fork will pack up less, i would think.

Codes are good brakes, I just didn't like the bleeding process. They have plenty of power. How thick are the deity grips?
 
soul-skier

soul-skier

Monkey
May 18, 2009
322
0
Mother Nature
Bicyclist said:
If anything faster rebound and more compression damping would be beneficial I would think...
Click to expand...
Perhaps this set-up would not allow the fork to fully use its travel, making for a harsher ride and causing excess arm pump. Speaking from experience my Foes Curnutt XTD fork gave me arm pump until a race clinic w/Shaums March. He adjusted my rebound and bottom-out. No more arm pump.:thumb:
 
C

ChrisKring

Turbo Monkey
Jan 30, 2002
2,399
6
Grand Haven, MI
Sandwich and Supa8 gave great advice. The only thing i can add/reiterate is that arm pump is primarly caused by death gripping the bars. Doing forearm exercises can make it worse. Small grips, thin gloves, proper ergonomics (bars and brakes) and being loose on the bike is where your solution is. The later comes with time on the bike and a good setup. It all builds on each other. Less arm pump, more comfortable leading to looser riding style, again leading to less arm pump. If your afraid, then your going to get arm pump.
 
gemini2k

gemini2k

Turbo Monkey
Jul 31, 2005
3,526
117
San Francisco
ChrisKring said:
Sandwich and Supa8 gave great advice. The only thing i can add/reiterate is that arm pump is primarly caused by death gripping the bars. Doing forearm exercises can make it worse. Small grips, thin gloves, proper ergonomics (bars and brakes) and being loose on the bike is where your solution is. The later comes with time on the bike and a good setup. It all builds on each other. Less arm pump, more comfortable leading to looser riding style, again leading to less arm pump. If your afraid, then your going to get arm pump.
Click to expand...
Listen to this man, he knows what he's doing. Loosen up.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top Bottom