[Silver]

A magical mythical exchange will be created by 2013 that will solve all the problems? Ponies for everyone?

Great news. And I'm sure that my premiums, which have gone from $300 to more than $700 a month over the last 3 or 4 years are going to stop rising now that insurance companies can't weed out the people who are actually sick.

Genius! Vive le free market! And hey, it's only four years down the road. Christ, this is a bigger domestic failure than Katrina.

 

[sanjuro]

 

[stevew]

so his speech was a failure?

no dancing in the aisles upon its conclusion?

 

[MMike]

so his speech was a failure?

no dancing in the aisles upon its conclusion?

Now waaaa-aayyy-aaayyt a minute!
Ya know you make me want to SHOUT
Kick my heels up and SHOUT
Throw my hands up and SHOUT

 

[ATOMICFIREBALL]

This would make a good bumper sticker!

 

[drkenan]

Yep - my policy has increased 25% annually since its inception in 2002. It's like clockwork - I can predict my premiums for years out.

So why was he in such a hurry this past summer if this ain't gonna take effect until 2013?

 

[stevew]

Yep - my policy has increased 25% annually since its inception in 2002. It's like clockwork - I can predict my premiums for years out.

So why was he in such a hurry this past summer if this ain't gonna take effect until 2013?

because he plans on a second term.

he's learning the fine art of putting sh*t off....

 

[dante]

Yep - my policy has increased 25% annually since its inception in 2002. It's like clockwork - I can predict my premiums for years out.

So why was he in such a hurry this past summer if this ain't gonna take effect until 2013?

Yup, health care costs are exploding in this country, and we pay more than anyone else in the world for it. As a result of this "awesome health care", we're ranked 30th in the world for life expectancy.

Now I have no idea if the president's plan is going to succeed, fail, drive us into bankruptcy or lead us to Nirvana, but can we all at least agree that the status quo is NOT the way to go?

 

[sanjuro]

Yep - my policy has increased 25% annually since its inception in 2002. It's like clockwork - I can predict my premiums for years out.

So why was he in such a hurry this past summer if this ain't gonna take effect until 2013?

 

[drkenan]

Now I have no idea if the president's plan is going to succeed, fail, drive us into bankruptcy or lead us to Nirvana, but can we all at least agree that the status quo is NOT the way to go?

Have you seen the news recently? It seems everyone in their right mind knows that healthcare as we know it is spiraling out of control but some (re: GOP) just want to turn it into a political debate when that's the last thing it should be.

 

[I Are Baboon]

That outburst was exactly what the Republicans needed to help repair their party's image and credibility.

 

[jonKranked]

That outburst was exactly what the Republicans needed to help repair their party's image and credibility.

At least he didn't yell that Obama was born in Kenya.

 

[moff_quigley]

That outburst was exactly what the Republicans needed to help repair their party's image and credibility.

 

[X3pilot]

A magical mythical exchange will be created by 2013 that will solve all the problems? Ponies for everyone?

Ponies, you bet!

 

[Jim Mac]

Yup, health care costs are exploding in this country, and we pay more than anyone else in the world for it. As a result of this "awesome health care", we're ranked 30th in the world for life expectancy.

Now I have no idea if the president's plan is going to succeed, fail, drive us into bankruptcy or lead us to Nirvana, but can we all at least agree that the status quo is NOT the way to go?

Yes! 5 years ago, a visit to my dr. for a sinus infection coast me $30, now it cost me $109. My job "cost shifted" HI and moved from an HMO to EPO model, hence they pay less and I pay more. And this is not including my family monthly premiums of about $250!

This is really what the problem is, not "death panels".

Sarah Palin:

 

[DamienC]

At least he didn't yell that Obama was born in Kenya.

No, he left that to 'Lord' Charles Boustany.

 

[drkenan]

This is really what the problem is, not "death panels".

Sarah Palin:

I'm still laughing that she spouted that complete and total BS and that PEOPLE ACTUALLY BELIEVED IT! How can someone get away with that?!?

 

[X3pilot]

In all seriousness, how hard would it be for the government to offer the same health care plan I have as a retired military member? Try this on for size:

Family Tricare coverage
Annual premium= $460
Primary care Dr. visit= $12
Prescription co pay= $9
Emergency room visit= $33
point of service option (non network Dr or non-covered service i.e. chiro) $150/visit up to $3000/family/year cap
$3000 catastrophic cap

Are there that many families that couldn't cover those cost?

True, this doesn't cover eye or dental, but it's a start, yes?

 

[dante]

^^^ See, since the government is already offering it now, it's called government services. If they offer that to *other* people, then it's SOCIALISM, dammit, and I'm not going to stand for it!!

 

[stevew]

i'd paint that on the side of a van......if i had one

 

[Secret Squirrel]

In all seriousness, how hard would it be for the government to offer the same health care plan I have as a retired military member? Try this on for size:

Family Tricare coverage
Annual premium= $460
Primary care Dr. visit= $12
Prescription co pay= $9
Emergency room visit= $33
point of service option (non network Dr or non-covered service i.e. chiro) $150/visit up to $3000/family/year cap
$3000 catastrophic cap

Are there that many families that couldn't cover those cost?

True, this doesn't cover eye or dental, but it's a start, yes?

Difference is...family members get/got shot at...which isn't really an issue in Baltimore...but for my neighborhood, might be hard to come by...




There has to be a cost/benefit analysis out there...it *is* the gov't for f*ck's sake...

 

[Silver]

In all seriousness, how hard would it be for the government to offer the same health care plan I have as a retired military member? Try this on for size:

Family Tricare coverage
Annual premium= $460
Primary care Dr. visit= $12
Prescription co pay= $9
Emergency room visit= $33
point of service option (non network Dr or non-covered service i.e. chiro) $150/visit up to $3000/family/year cap
$3000 catastrophic cap

Are there that many families that couldn't cover those cost?

True, this doesn't cover eye or dental, but it's a start, yes?

Your annual premium is about 2/3rds of my monthly premium, and my copays are $40 for a doctor visit. No eye or dental for me either. I sleep secure in the knowledge that I'm not a socialist, though, so it's well worth it...

 

[X3pilot]

Your annual premium is about 2/3rds of my monthly premium, and my copays are $40 for a doctor visit. No eye or dental for me either. I sleep secure in the knowledge that I'm not a socialist, though, so it's well worth it...

Sarcasm noted, but seriously, I'm wondering about any valid reasons why this wouldn't work??

Oh, and btw, since my employer doesn't have to foot part of my medical insurance, they provide free life insurance, plus pay me a supplemental of $2K a year since I'm saving them 10-12K at least. That's right, and that supplement pays my premiums, copays, also covers my dental plan premiums ($32/month family) and eye glasses, etc.

Should I maybe write my fine elected representatives with this idea?

 

[Silver]

Sarcasm noted, but seriously, I'm wondering about any valid reasons why this wouldn't work??

Oh, and btw, since my employer doesn't have to foot part of my medical insurance, they provide free life insurance, plus pay me a supplemental of $2K a year since I'm saving them 10-12K at least. That's right, and that supplement pays my premiums, copays, also covers my dental plan premiums ($32/month family) and eye glasses, etc.

Should I maybe write my fine elected representatives with this idea?

It's not directed at you.

Seriously though, the only benefit that my insurance gives me over yours is likely that the CEO of my health insurance company can afford a $1500 an hour Vegas hooker instead of a handjob from an old Korean woman down at the corner rub and tug.

 

[Secret Squirrel]

Sarcasm noted, but seriously, I'm wondering about any valid reasons why this wouldn't work??

Oh, and btw, since my employer doesn't have to foot part of my medical insurance, they provide free life insurance, plus pay me a supplemental of $2K a year since I'm saving them 10-12K at least. That's right, and that supplement pays my premiums, copays, also covers my dental plan premiums ($32/month family) and eye glasses, etc.

Should I maybe write my fine elected representatives with this idea?

Just noticed your new custom title...heh...


I was kinda-sorta serious with the final line in my previous post...

There has to be a reason that this isn't the preferred method of choice going forward.

I would venture a guess (pretty much all I do around here, I know...) that because of the size and scale of the country vs. the service members that it's going to ding some company (or persons) pretty high up the food chain somewhere...

 

[X3pilot]

I just noticed it too. That's pretty funny.

But to the plan, it can't ding any company, it's a private company that manages this plan. (I guess it's like an HMO or something like that) that is subsidized by the government. The doctors and practitioners have to agree to accept what Tricare pays when they sign up, but i think it pays along the same scale as Medicare(not sure).

Cost savings to the government at a national scale could come from the fact that I can't get name brand pharmaceuticals if generic are available. Maybe if the majority of the country were on a plan like that, it would cease being profitable for drug makers to send salesmen to Dr's offices and advertising on TV, therefore driving cost of medicine down, that savings being used to fund the plan.

Also, reducing the amount companies have to pay for health care might stimulate some hiring, I would imagine, allowing more families to afford that $460 per year payment.

To avoid the argument of a government monopoly, divide the country into regions (like Tricare does) and have regional managerial and administrative companies that use a prescribed percentage of all available health systems in that region, provided they agree to accept standard payments for services with a guaranteed client base.

I'm not smart enough to author a 3700 page detailed bill, but there has to be a way to look at this. It's not a secret by any means, figure how many active duty, reserve and retired military families there are in this country that use this system...

 

[-BB-]

As a result of this "awesome health care", we're ranked 30th in the world for life expectancy.

Yeah... it has nothing to do with McDonalds, Krispy Cream, stuffed crust pizza, 560 calorie doubel carmel macchiatos or the fact that we love driving to the store when it is only a block away.


Brown Rice, bikes and soybeans... the ticket to long life.

 

[ohio]

it's a private company that manages this plan. (I guess it's like an HMO or something like that) that is subsidized by the government.

Any idea how much the subsidy is? If the government is covering 90% and the real cost is similar to Silver's we haven't gotten anywhere. But I suspect the subsidy is not 10x your premium...

 

[Jim Mac]

Ahhhhh, too funny!

http://blog.newsweek.com/blogs/thegaggle/archive/2009/09/10/joe-wilson-s-dirty-health-care-secret.aspx

Joe Wilson's Dirty Health-Care Secret
By Adam Weinstein

Poor Joe Wilson. The conservative Republican representative from South Carolina stepped in it Wednesday night when he broke with centuries of decorum by screaming, "You lie!" at President Obama during his health-care speech to a joint session of Congress.
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Cut the man some slack. He's passionate! I know this because he told me, in the sole message that blazes across his campaign Web site: JOE WILSON IS PASSIONATE ABOUT STOPPING GOVERNMENT RUN HEALTH CARE!

Except that he's not─at least not when it comes to his, and his family's, government-run health care. As a retired Army National Guard colonel, Wilson gets a lot of benefits (one of which, apparently, was not a full appreciation of the customs, traditions, and courtesies that mandate respect for one's commander in chief). And with four sons in the armed services, the entire Wilson brood has enjoyed multiple generations of free military medical coverage, known as TRICARE.

Yes, it's true. As politicos and town-hall criers debate the finer points of the public option, employer mandates, coverage for undocumented immigrants, and who's more Hitler-like, they seem to miss a larger point: the United States has single-payer health care. It covers 9.5 million active-duty servicemen and women, military retirees, and their dependents─including almost a 10th of all Californians and Floridians, and nearly a quarter of a million residents of Wilson's home state.

Military beneficiaries like Wilson─who, as a retiree, is eligible for lifetime coverage─never have to worry about an eye exam, a CT scan, a prolonged labor, or an open-heart surgery. They have access not only to the military's 133,500 uniformed health professionals, but cooperating private doctors as well─whose fees are paid by the Department of Defense. It's high-quality care, too: surveys from 2007 and 2008 list TRICARE among "the best health insurer(s) in the nation" by customer satisfaction. Yet Wilson insists government-run health care is a problem.

To be fair, Wilson has been consistent in his policymaking if not his personal life: according to his last congressional opponent, Wilson voted 11 times against health care for veterans in eight years, even as he voted "aye" for the Iraq War (during the debate on the war vote, he even called one Democrat "viscerally anti-American"─several times). He voted to cut veterans' benefits─not his own─to make room for President George W. Bush's tax cuts. He repeatedly voted for budgets that slashed funding to the Veterans Administration and TRICARE. And perhaps most bizarrely, he refused─repeatedly─to approve Democratic-led initiatives that would have extended TRICARE coverage to all reservists and National Guard members, even though a disproportionate number of them have served multiple tours in Iraq and Afghanistan─and many lost access to their civilian work benefits when they did so.

There's one other notable exception to Wilson's tough-on-government record: In July, when the health-insurance debate just started heating up, he offered an amendment that would exempt TRICARE from any system of employer mandates in a health-care bill. It's not clear whether this is necessary, since most such bills in Congress keep government benefits exempt from the rules as a matter of course. But Wilson took the opportunity to make his stand.

"As a 31-year Army Guard and Reserve veteran, I know the importance of TRICARE," he said in a press release. "The number of individuals who choose to enroll in TRICARE continues to rise because TRICARE is a low cost, comprehensive health plan that is portable and available in some form world-wide." He went on to call TRICARE "world class health care," concluding on a personal note. "I am grateful to have four sons now serving in the military, and I know that their families appreciate the availability of TRICARE," he said.

What does that mean? Nothing─except that Joe Wilson was against government-run health care before he was for it. And now he's against it again. Just not when it comes to his own flesh and blood.

Adam Weinstein, an Iraq veteran, is a freelance journalist. He is uninsured.

 

[syadasti]

Great article Need to use this graphic again before sanjuro does

Joe Wilson

 

[syadasti]

Bob Dole pities the tea bagger fool...

The Week - Editor's Letter - Sept 24, 2009

Bob Dole sends his regrets.

That seems to be the gist of an interview he gave to The New York Times recently, in which the former Republican Senate leader blamed political gamesmanship for the defeat of health reform in the 1990s. “President Clinton was covering his political bases,” Dole explained, “and so was I.” In terms of political candor, we can’t expect much more than that. Basically Dole said that health reform failed 15 years ago because there were personal and political fish to fry. Clinton’s agenda was to pass health reform and ride it to re-election; Dole’s was to kill reform in order to weaken Clinton and give Dole a shot at replacing him in the White House. The rest of us were mere bystanders, ricochet victims of a drive-by shooting.

Dole, 86, is now lobbying for Congress to pass the kind of bipartisan health-reform legislation he shunned in 1994. But it’s not clear that in 2009 there is any bipartisanship left for a retired senator to leverage. The last, tattered remnants of the vital center began vacating the premises around the time that Dole resigned, in 1996. The polarization that gripped Washington as Dole’s career was ending has filled the vacuum in the capital and expanded outward. In state legislatures from Albany to Sacramento, partisan gridlock, dysfunction, and flight from responsibility are commonplace. If the nation’s political works were faltering by the end of Dole’s long, storied career, today the two-party engine appears to have seized. No doubt the political bases are still well covered. But personal ambition, ideological rigidity, and partisan opportunism are everywhere exposed.

Francis Wilkinson

 

[Silver]

Bob Dole pities the tea bagger fool...

Thanks Bob. How many people died?

 

[jonKranked]

Sydasti, I read that elsewhere actually. In that Clinton interview I posted up a while back, Clinton basically said that reform in '94 died because Dole realized he had to kill it if he wanted a shot at the white house. Big load of good that did him.