[Changleen]

The fascists are coming! Bet you hippies are gonna start giving a **** who Bush puts on the supreme court now!

http://www.cbc.ca/story/world/national/2005/06/06/us-pot050606.html

U.S. court finds pot illegal, even on doctor's orders

Sick people can't smoke marijuana in the United States, even under doctor's orders, the U.S. Supreme Court has ruled.

Six of the court's nine justices supported the decision, which overturns laws passed in 10 of the 50 states that allowed people to grow their own pot and use it to treat various illnesses.

The case before the court involved two seriously ill women in California who were smoking marijuana, on the advice of their doctor, to relieve chronic pain.

Angel Raich, who lives in Oakland, suffers from ailments including scoliosis, a brain tumour, chronic nausea, fatigue and pain. She said she was partly paralyzed until she started smoking pot several times a day.

Diane Monson, who has a degenerative spine disease, grows marijuana in her Oroville backyard.

A California court ruled in 2003 that prosecution of medical marijuana users such as Raich and Monson under the federal Controlled Substances Act was unconstitutional. The Bush administration appealed that finding, and the Supreme Court's majority said on Monday the federal law was a valid exercise of Congress's power, "even as applied to the troubling facts of this case."

California's medical marijuana law, passed by voters as a proposition in the 1996 general election, allows people to grow, smoke or obtain marijuana for medical needs with a doctor's recommendation.

The states of Alaska, Colorado, Hawaii, Maine, Montana, Nevada, Oregon, Vermont and Washington have medical marijuana laws similar to California's.

The legal question presented a dilemma for the Supreme Court's conservatives, who have pushed to broaden states' rights in recent years.

Justice John Paul Stevens wrote the majority opinion, which raised concerns about abuse of marijuana laws. "Our cases have taught us that there are some unscrupulous physicians who over-prescribe when it is sufficiently profitable to do so," he said.

Justice Sandra Day O'Connor filed a dissent, arguing that states should be allowed to set their own rules. "The states' core police powers have always included authority to define criminal law and to protect the health, safety and welfare of their citizens," she said.

What a bunch of crap. All this will do is force more people to use more expensive prescription drugs for their problems. Hmm. Who will benefit from that?

 

[N8 v2.0]

HAHAHAHA!!!!

Poor stoners...

 

[Silver]

I have to admit, I was wrong about Rehnquist and Thomas on this one.

I see Scalia still managed to worm his way over to the no side though...

 

[Changleen]

HAHAHAHA!!!!

Poor stoners...

So that's what it is about republicans - they just plain don't want other people to be happy. Lame.

 

[N8 v2.0]

So that's what it is about republicans - they just plain don't want other people to be happy. Lame.

We don't want people stoned and not working.

 

[Changleen]

We don't want people stoned and not working.

So it's fine to be stoned at work?

 

[Silver]

So it's fine to be stoned at work?

Limbaugh pulled it off for years...

 

[reflux]

We don't want people stoned and not working.

So it's also your opinion that those people with severe degenerative spine diseases can sit at a desk for 8+ hours a day or wait tables? Isht, I'm getting over a bruised rib and I didn't even want to stand up; I can't imagine the real pain that some people go through just living.

 

[Lexx D]

We don't want people stoned and not working.

Didn't know working a 45-60 hour week counted as "not working". I'm such a lazy pothead.

 

[Zark]

We don't want people stoned and not working.

I smoke pot after work, I work my ass off the rest of the time.

Get bent fascist

 

[valve bouncer]

VB- "So N8 why is pot illegal?"
N8- "Cos' it's bad"
VB- "Wipe that drool off your chin boy. Now, why is it bad?"
N8- "Cos' it's illegal"
N8 walks away confident in the knowledge that his impeccable logic is keeping the world safe for frotherdom. VB just sits in the corner slowly shaking his head.

 

[MMike]

We don't want people stoned and not working.

Like we all are in Canada.... good thinkin'!!

 

[H8R]

We don't want people stoned and not working.

So all the people suffering from chronic pain and nausea will just hop right back to work if they put down the weed, right?

Brilliant.

 

[Ciaran]

More turd fiesta from N8.

 

[MikeD]

The decision noted that Congress hadn't perhaps made the best choice of laws, but that they were within their powers to regulate a commodity that had a national market. It's not the Supreme Court's job to decide which laws suck, just which ones are within the bounds of the Gov't's constitutional authority and which aren't.

Still, I don't get how the Federal laws trump state laws when it comes to a commodity produced and consumed entirely within a given state's borders. Then again, I'm not a supreme court justice... and federal drug laws DO apply within all the states (dealing with them as an illegal commodity, not just any commodity...)

MD

 

[reflux]

More turd fiesta from N8.

Thanks!

 

[Silver]

Still, I don't get how the Federal laws trump state laws when it comes to a commodity produced and consumed entirely within a given state's borders. Then again, I'm not a supreme court justice... and federal drug laws DO apply within all the states (dealing with them as an illegal commodity, not just any commodity...)

MD

The molecules of air that a marijuana plant being grown in California uses has at some point probably been in another state, therefore it happens to be interstate commerce.

 

[N8 v2.0]

You stoners can thank your 'recreational' use of the drug for the court's ruling. Everytime you toke, you take away some cancer patient's hope of pain relief.

Actually, it is illeagal to grow dope in your yard reguardless of its purpose. This is what the court ruled against, not access to MJ for the truely sick.



http://wid.ap.org/documents/scotus/050606raich.pdf

 

[N8 v2.0]

Like we all are in Canada.... good thinkin'!!

HAHA! True dat.

 

[N8 v2.0]

I'm just screwing with you stoners on here actually. I could care of less if you toke on your own time or not although you'd better not be on the road with a CDL or flying any plane that I'm on. Other than that... toke up!

:evil:


..and remember... there is no way to enforce a law everyone ignores anyway.

 

[clancy98]

Hmm. Who will benefit from that?

Gee I'm not sure, but I bet I can guess....

 

[N8 v2.0]

Gee I'm not sure, but I bet I can guess....

The people who will benift are the dudes who sell the chit illeagally and those who launder the $ from it.

 

[clancy98]

I was gonna say George W. Bush. But thats just cause I know Changleen's opinion (as do we all) all too well.

 

[jacksonpt]

Can someone explain to me why pot is a better alternative to other pain meds? I mean for actual pain relief - or is this all a crock to make smoking legal?

 

[N8 v2.0]

The fascists are coming! Bet you hippies are gonna start giving a **** who Bush puts on the supreme court now!

http://www.cbc.ca/story/world/national/2005/06/06/us-pot050606.html

What a bunch of crap. All this will do is force more people to use more expensive prescription drugs for their problems. Hmm. Who will benefit from that?

Whatever....

 

[scurban]

I'm just going to be pissed when the Fed gov't starts wasting valuable tax dollors to procecute people who have been granted the right by both the state they live in, and their doctor they see to smoke. Come on this is the real issue here.

You work hard, probably pay more then you want out of your paycheck to the federal government, now its going to be wasted investigating, and criminalizing people who have put a lot of time and effort into making something they believe in legal.

Weither you smoke pot or not, you should still be pissed that tax dollors are going to be wasted on this issue, rather then spent wisely on improving health care in America, or possibley education. Or better yet, a way to become less dependent on foreign oil sources.

The amount of money spent on on prosecuting Medical Marajuana will probably be peanuts in the whole scheme of things, however it will still be too much if you ask me.

 

[Andyman_1970]

Can someone explain to me why pot is a better alternative to other pain meds? I mean for actual pain relief - or is this all a crock to make smoking legal?

Last night on the news one doctor was saying there was a "mountain of anecdotal evidence" (with the attitude of "come on you stupid judges get with the program").........since when do Dr's and scienctists anaylize the effectiveness of a medication based on anecdotal evidence. If weed is such an effective medication for pain, why is the AMA on the fence on the matter, why are there no conclusive scientific studies on the issue?

 

[N8 v2.0]

I'm just going to be pissed when the Fed gov't starts wasting valuable tax dollors to procecute people who have been granted the right by both the state they live in, and their doctor they see to smoke. Come on this is the real issue here.

You work hard, probably pay more then you want out of your paycheck to the federal government, now its going to be wasted investigating, and criminalizing people who have put a lot of time and effort into making something they believe in legal.

Weither you smoke pot or not, you should still be pissed that tax dollors are going to be wasted on this issue, rather then spent wisely on improving health care in America, or possibley education. Or better yet, a way to become less dependent on foreign oil sources.

The amount of money spent on on prosecuting Medical Marajuana will probably be peanuts in the whole scheme of things, however it will still be too much if you ask me.

Whatever....

 

[clancy98]

it helps me with the crushing emotional pain of dealing with the douchebags on teh monkey

 

[golgiaparatus]

America F*** Yeah

Comin To Save The World Again Yeah

America F*** Yeah

Alcohol Is The Only Way Yeah

Marijuana Your Game Is Through Cuz Now Youve Got To Answer To

America F*** Yeah!!!!

 

[Damn True]

Last night on the news one doctor was saying there was a "mountain of anecdotal evidence" (with the attitude of "come on you stupid judges get with the program").........since when do Dr's and scienctists anaylize the effectiveness of a medication based on anecdotal evidence. If weed is such an effective medication for pain, why is the AMA on the fence on the matter, why are there no conclusive scientific studies on the issue?

A comment and a question:

I was listening to a local news radio station this morning and they were interviewing the Sheriff of Santa Clara County who said that one of the largest problems with the medical MJ thing is people using the scrip to buy weed then reselling it to buy actual medications. Hmmm, if weed works why buy vicodin?

Second, they said that there is no actual scientific peer reviewed study to show that weed is more effective than current pharmacuticals. I don't know if that is the case or not. Is it?

 

[Ciaran]

Can someone explain to me why pot is a better alternative to other pain meds? I mean for actual pain relief - or is this all a crock to make smoking legal?

Personally, I have never found it to be an effective pain relief medication. What I have found through extensive testing both on the road and while I am flying planes is that it is highly effective in relieving NAUSEA. For cancer patients it means that they can have some pot before or after chemo when the nausea hits them bad and be able to eat. People with sensitive stomachs or people like me who take medication daily that upsets the stomach can have something that relieves nausea. The other thing I know is that it is highly effective in lessening the symptoms of Autonomic Dysreflexia. AD is something that happens to paralyzed people, especially quadriplegics. At one point in my life I was a live in aide to a quad. The guy would some out in full AD... sweating, spasms, nausea, just feeling awful. One hit off his bong and it all went away within seconds. (Literally). Pain relief? Maybe. Nausea releif? Most defenitely. N8 relief? Yeah but you have to smoke alot.

 

[Silver]

Last night on the news one doctor was saying there was a "mountain of anecdotal evidence" (with the attitude of "come on you stupid judges get with the program").........since when do Dr's and scienctists anaylize the effectiveness of a medication based on anecdotal evidence. If weed is such an effective medication for pain, why is the AMA on the fence on the matter, why are there no conclusive scientific studies on the issue?

It's a schedule 1 drug. I'd guess you can't do double blind studies on the effectiveness because by doing so you'd be in possession of marijuana, and therefore be breaking federal law. Plus, by giving it to a patient, that would probably put the researcher up on distribution charges.

 

[H8R]

Second, they said that there is no actual scientific peer reviewed study to show that weed is more effective than current pharmacuticals. I don't know if that is the case or not. Is it?

My wife went through one very painful diagnostic procedure and one surgery for a torn disc. (discogram and IDET).

Weed was the only thing that would relieve the pain long term. A little a day kept the pain to a level where she could function enough to go to work. Other heavy pain meds were too harsh. Nobody can take vicodin for more than a few days with out wanting to hang themselves.

I don't think weed is for everyone, just like some people shouldn't drink. She could function very well with weed, if anything it made her hyper and even MORE productive.

I never smoke it, it puts me to bed immediately. Like I said, not for everyone.

It grows in the ground, it's an excellent renewable resource and it relieves pain and nausea. It's less harmfull than tobacco or alcohol - but we throw people in jail for it. Brilliant.

 

[Andyman_1970]

It's a schedule 1 drug. I'd guess you can't do double blind studies on the effectiveness because by doing so you'd be in possession of marijuana, and therefore be breaking federal law. Plus, by giving it to a patient, that would probably put the researcher up on distribution charges.

Is morphine classified the same as marijuana (at least in it's illegal non-prescribed sense)? I have a hard time believing that because it's an illegal drug there is not some official legal way to conduct a study on it's effectiveness rather than rely on dubious anecdotal evidence.

 

[Damn True]

Personally, I have never found it to be an effective pain relief medication. What I have found through extensive testing both on the road and while I am flying planes is that it is highly effective in relieving NAUSEA. For cancer patients it means that they can have some pot before or after chemo when the nausea hits them bad and be able to eat. People with sensitive stomachs or people like me who take medication daily that upsets the stomach can have something that relieves nausea. The other thing I know is that it is highly effective in lessening the symptoms of Autonomic Dysreflexia. AD is something that happens to paralyzed people, especially quadriplegics. At one point in my life I was a live in aide to a quad. The guy would some out in full AD... sweating, spasms, nausea, just feeling awful. One hit off his bong and it all went away within seconds. (Literally). Pain relief? Maybe. Nausea releif? Most defenitely. N8 relief? Yeah but you have to smoke alot.

Interesting. But I wonder if there arent other things available either herbal or pharmacological that would offer the same benefit?

Hypothetically speaking, if immodium (or something similar) controls nausea and dosent cause any other ill effects why use weed?

 

[Andyman_1970]

It grows in the ground, it's an excellent renewable resource and it relieves pain and nausea.

Hemlock grows in the ground also but that doesn't mean it's good for you........

 

[Zark]

Is morphine classified the same as marijuana (at least in it's illegal non-prescribed sense)? I have a hard time believing that because it's an illegal drug there is not some official legal way to conduct a study on it's effectiveness rather than rely on dubious anecdotal evidence.

No, heroin is schedule 1 though. I'm not sure what class morphine falls into, but doctors would have no access at all if it were schedule 1. Schedule 1 basically proclaims this drug has no medical benifits what so ever. So you have a catch 22 with marijuana where you can't prove medical benifits since politics has already decided the matter for researchers.

 

[Damn True]

My wife went through one very painful diagnostic procedure and one surgery for a torn disc. (discogram and IDET).

Weed was the only thing that would relieve the pain long term. A little a day kept the pain to a level where she could function enough to go to work. Other heavy pain meds were too harsh. Nobody can take vicodin for more than a few days with out wanting to hang themselves.

I don't think weed is for everyone, just like some people shouldn't drink. She could function very well with weed, if anything it made her hyper and even MORE productive.

I never smoke it, it puts me to bed immediately. Like I said, not for everyone.

It grows in the ground, it's an excellent renewable resource and it relieves pain and nausea. It's less harmfull than tobacco or alcohol - but we throw people in jail for it. Brilliant.

Well my father has had two pairs of vertabrae fused in two seperate procedures. He did have to try a number of different meds before he and his Dr. found one that didn't make him loopy, nauseous or an a-hole. His Dr. (the same guy that did Joe Montana's back surgeries) never suggested weed.

Your final comments are unproven, untested and highly debateable. If the pro-weed folks sober up and actually perform studies and prove it, I'll support it 100%, but anecdotal "evidence" will never get the stuff legalized for medical use.

 

[Westy]

Interesting. But I wonder if there arent other things available either herbal or pharmacological that would offer the same benefit?

Hypothetically speaking, if immodium (or something similar) controls nausea and dosent cause any other ill effects why use weed?

When my mother was fighting cancer the nausea medication seemed to do little. The Docs seemed to be able to control all the other side affects except for the nausea. Spending the last weeks of your life puking your brains out is not a fun thing to do. If weed could actually control this (I don't know how affective it is) lawmakers are being irresponsible not making it prescribable because of stereotypes and a culture of fear based on stereotypes.