Holy S**T! SEC is talking about banning ALL short Sales
- Thread starter stoney
- Start date
Yeah, how many people in this administration believe they are above the law?
When you are asking for a $700B favor, you should be a little more gracious.
Yep. Totally right on.
This crisis was entirely manufactured by the govt (lax lending standards), and the big investment banks.
This guy, Patrick Byrne (www.deepcapture.com), Bill Casey (the casey report), etc are completely right. The market needs to be allowed to fall naturally, or it will be far, far worse.
This bailout will destroy the US.
Dear Mods; I really hope this thread doesn't get moved.
Anyone concerned, I urge you to take a few minutes and make your voice heard.
http://congressorg.capwiz.com/congressorg/home/
Thanks.
Anyone concerned, I urge you to take a few minutes and make your voice heard.
http://congressorg.capwiz.com/congressorg/home/
Thanks.
my favorite piece of this folly is that Paulson used to run one of the large investment banks so he's in some part responsible for the mess.
and now he wants a $700billion dollar credit card and no oversight on how he uses it.
And with Barney Frank at the head of the House of Representatives committee that is responsible for getting a bill out there to "save us all" i'm guessing we're all fooooooked.
and now he wants a $700billion dollar credit card and no oversight on how he uses it.
And with Barney Frank at the head of the House of Representatives committee that is responsible for getting a bill out there to "save us all" i'm guessing we're all fooooooked.
My Letter:
Dear Senator,
Thank you for realizing that Paulson's plan is overtly vague and dangerous. His colleague's and counterparts at Goldman, Lehman, Morgan Stanley, etc. Have created the situation that we are currently in. Their intense greed and willingness to forsake common sense for profits is not our (US tax payers) problem.
Although I do understand that there are many Americas suffering because they have mortgages they can not afford, what about the rest of us that used the good judgment and restrained from over extending ourselves in bad loans and credit?
Why do we have to pay for the excesses of others?
Please look at the long-term effects of any bailout and the costs to future generations. A bailout will only prolong the pain. Let the market settle on it's own.
Enforce the current regulations relating to naked short selling and the failure to deliver shares permeating the markets. This alone will slow much of the market's collapse.
But on to Paulson's plan to rape the American tax payer...
--Sec. 6. Maximum Amount of Authorized Purchases.
The Secretarys authority to purchase mortgage-related assets under this Act shall be limited to $700,000,000,000 outstanding at any one time--
Does this mean that he can bailout ALL of the banks, because the "outstanding at any one time" part leads one to believe that it is not a set dollar amount, but a blank check that allows for up to $700billion.
---Sec. 8. Review.
Decisions by the Secretary pursuant to the authority of this Act are non-reviewable and committed to agency discretion, and may not be reviewed by any court of law or any administrative agency.---
Really? Is this administration above the law? Start getting rid of these criminals.
Please look to have SEC Chairman Cox removed. His complacency has led us to this cliff by not constraining rampant speculation and greed in the markets. Try Patrick Byrne, he has a sole goal and has for years of preventing this financial crisis for consuming the US.
Please look outside of Wall St. and Washington for answers. Delay will lead to the collapse of the US economy.
Thank you,
Dear Senator,
Thank you for realizing that Paulson's plan is overtly vague and dangerous. His colleague's and counterparts at Goldman, Lehman, Morgan Stanley, etc. Have created the situation that we are currently in. Their intense greed and willingness to forsake common sense for profits is not our (US tax payers) problem.
Although I do understand that there are many Americas suffering because they have mortgages they can not afford, what about the rest of us that used the good judgment and restrained from over extending ourselves in bad loans and credit?
Why do we have to pay for the excesses of others?
Please look at the long-term effects of any bailout and the costs to future generations. A bailout will only prolong the pain. Let the market settle on it's own.
Enforce the current regulations relating to naked short selling and the failure to deliver shares permeating the markets. This alone will slow much of the market's collapse.
But on to Paulson's plan to rape the American tax payer...
--Sec. 6. Maximum Amount of Authorized Purchases.
The Secretarys authority to purchase mortgage-related assets under this Act shall be limited to $700,000,000,000 outstanding at any one time--
Does this mean that he can bailout ALL of the banks, because the "outstanding at any one time" part leads one to believe that it is not a set dollar amount, but a blank check that allows for up to $700billion.
---Sec. 8. Review.
Decisions by the Secretary pursuant to the authority of this Act are non-reviewable and committed to agency discretion, and may not be reviewed by any court of law or any administrative agency.---
Really? Is this administration above the law? Start getting rid of these criminals.
Please look to have SEC Chairman Cox removed. His complacency has led us to this cliff by not constraining rampant speculation and greed in the markets. Try Patrick Byrne, he has a sole goal and has for years of preventing this financial crisis for consuming the US.
Please look outside of Wall St. and Washington for answers. Delay will lead to the collapse of the US economy.
Thank you,
Yeah, that Blatantly violates the separation of powers provided by the constitution, but since were going to incur $2500+ of debt for every man woman and child in America to bail out bad decisions by people with 6,7,8 and 9 figure salaries why not throw it in anyway.
When you vote, consider if your congressman/senator/presidental candidate has been pushing for DEREGULATION of the industry for the last decade. Many of the people spouting off about increasing regulation NOW, are the same ones who wanted to deregulate it for the last ten plus years.
Seriously our government has been asleep at the wheel and pushing for more regulation of personal behavior, while turning a blind eye to corporate bad behavior.
Quick question, why do you think this ban will slow or create a bottom, isnt it the liquidity from the short selling that can really drive the market?
Before I decide against this... is there any chance I get another stimulus check?
CALL THEM! A phone call is far more effective than an email... If the office looks at their inbox and has 50 messages (or however) that's easily ignored. If they get in in the morning and have 50 voice mail messages, that's a little harder to ignore.
edit: So there's apparently been wrangling (no pun intended...
) going on behind the scenes about this, with Congress and the Administration in heated debates. My question is, why is there even a debate? If all of congress can get behind something, what's Bush going to do, veto it? No, it's not going to be a blank check with no oversight handed to Paulson. Too bad, get over it. If Wall Street wants to get bailed out to the tune of $700b worth of taxpayer funds, they're going to have to accept some things that they may not like...
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The ban will create an artificial bottom as there is no "counter" to positive news. Although I do not feel there is really an need for short sales, as it artificially adds supply. The price spike shows this.
Also, short selling does not create liquidity. In a balanced market, there is no need for liquidity. Think about it, if a stock is hard to buy the price increases for a reason. Short selling allows people who do not own shares, to sell them in the open market adding extra shares to the market, dropping prices. Short selling on a large scale is a self-fulfiling property.
The threats that the removal of short selling will limit liquidity is BS. Australia banned shorting years ago and it has not negatively effected their market.
Also, short selling does not create liquidity. In a balanced market, there is no need for liquidity. Think about it, if a stock is hard to buy the price increases for a reason. Short selling allows people who do not own shares, to sell them in the open market adding extra shares to the market, dropping prices. Short selling on a large scale is a self-fulfiling property.
The threats that the removal of short selling will limit liquidity is BS. Australia banned shorting years ago and it has not negatively effected their market.
I agree with this. They need to let the fallout... well... fall out.
This is nonsense, Chicken Little.
$700bil revolving line of credit... There is currently and outstanding debt of under funded promises to the tune of $475,000 per US citizen. What do you think the $700b addition is going to do?
Alleviating debt, with more debt is not the answer. For this debt to "disolve", these companies need to fail and take their debt with them.
Private profits, private losses.
Alleviating debt, with more debt is not the answer. For this debt to "disolve", these companies need to fail and take their debt with them.
Private profits, private losses.
I can GUARAN-FOKKIN-TEE it won't "destroy the US."
yup, the more I hear about this program, the more I think it's something along the lines of tossing a pebble (a very, very VERY expensive pebble) into the Mississippi and hoping that it stops the flow of water. I'm guessing that even if something passes, after the celebratory bump in the market there'll be a moment of clarification where the street says "wait, there's how much bad debt out there?" At the end of the day, there is not a liquidity crisis going on here. The government has been freely giving out short-term loans to keep all of this going to the tune of hundreds of billions of dollars.
The problem is that some of these banks are probably upside down with regards to (worthless) assets vs liabilities, and probably should just go out of business. The famous scenario I've heard from pundits is that if an institution has $600b in illiquid assets (street value) and $580b in liabilities, the company is still "worth" $20b, but it's in trouble because the $600b in assets is hard to move, as no one wants to buy it. So they want the fed to come in and buy those assets, so they get $600b in cash, can pay off their $580b in liabilities, and keep on existing. The fed can therefore sit on their $600b in assets and slowly sell them into the market at a profit.
However. What if the bank's "assets" are only worth $500b (or less)? If the Treasury pays market rate, the bank goes under anyway. The only "solution" is to have the Treasury overpay (pays $600b for something that's only worth $500b) and have the taxpayer cough up the extra dough. So the Treasury does that 7 times for the major banks, rescues the stockholders and banks that *should* have gone underwater, and we're left with a massive, MASSIVE debt problem. It's no wonder Paulson wanted zero oversight from legislative OR LEGAL! He could've handed $700b to his buddies at Goldman, and walked off the stage, and there wouldn't have been anything anyone could've done about it.
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I must have missed "US Economy and market"I can GUARAN-FOKKIN-TEE it won't "destroy the US."
I've been watching the hearings and Paulson isn't fairing well under questioning.
Bernanke had a shaky upper lip as he spoke.
Yea, totally inspiring confidence in me. They can't even fake their own belief in their plan.
Bernanke had a shaky upper lip as he spoke.
Yea, totally inspiring confidence in me.
They can't even fake their own belief in their plan.
... so what about stimulus checks though?
Joker, et. al.
Ive read the following article 3 times and am messing my pants over it... thinking about taking out all my cash to buy gold/silver lol...
Plese read and let us know what you think of this next nightmare...
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2084907/posts
Ive read the following article 3 times and am messing my pants over it... thinking about taking out all my cash to buy gold/silver lol...
Plese read and let us know what you think of this next nightmare...
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2084907/posts
Is anyone shocked by this?
I mean - smart people have been talking about how bad the credit-driven binge of the last 20 years was going to be when it came due.
It's come due.
I mean - smart people have been talking about how bad the credit-driven binge of the last 20 years was going to be when it came due.
It's come due.
i'm gonna buy cases of 1982 first growths and Misfit 7" singles...
poached from another board:
I'll look at it tonight. As for markets... I'm not even sure what is safe right now. I was looking into the double-leverage short indices (make 2x the loss of underlying index), but with the new govt ban, they have an uncertain future.
I'm thinking about going back into Gold, but it's not really a true counter to inflation... Then again, it isn't that bad.