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Hope Pro II hub's luv or hate ?

keen

Monkey
Mar 30, 2003
356
0
Went into my LBS today and asked about Hope Pro II's for a custom wheelset. LBS tech. started ranting how poorly they were designed. I thought I said Wallmart hub @ first. Anyways, his first complaint was the alum. freehub body (he made a butter referance here), next he went to the pawl springs, then to the engagement, flanges... I stopped him here. He pushed King... I don't have the $$$ and don't care to add money for a 10mm axle kit etc. Was the LBS tech. going overboard ? I did a search and the most common gripe was the 24p engagement or past flange breakage ? What's the real deal ? Can't ride DH all the time so this is for my trail bike. Thanx
 

Transcend

My Nuts Are Flat
Apr 18, 2002
18,045
0
Towing the party line.
I've used the same rear hope pro 2 (150mm x 12mm) for 3 seasons now without a single problem. They are one of the most highly regarded rear hubs out there.

Your LBS guy is a tool. Does he work on commission by any chance?
 

Banshee Rider

Turbo Monkey
Jul 31, 2003
1,456
10
Your LBS tech was likely extremely biased. I work with a guy who refuses to sell anything but fox forks and shimano components. Next time you go in, tell him this is what your ordering, here is your money, and if he doesn't like it, then you'll gladly order it off the internet.
 

jvnixon

Turbo Monkey
May 14, 2006
2,325
0
SickLines.com
Haha, King also is aluminum freehub body unless you opt for the heavy duty one. You can also get the Hope Pro II rear hub in a steel freehub body.
 

dropmachine

Turbo Monkey
Sep 7, 2001
2,923
10
Your face.
Industry Nine is also aluminum. That said, Aluminum done right is bloody impressive. No experience (yet) on the Hope stuff, but the i9 stuff is remarkably durable.
 

ZHendo

Turbo Monkey
Oct 29, 2006
1,619
96
PNW
i like my pro 2 a lot, the only complaint i have is that it doesn't have a very high number of engagements, but for the weight, price and reliability it offers i can't complain.
 

Udi

RM Chief Ornithologist: “I Brake for Birds”
Mar 14, 2005
4,837
1,028
<3

I run four of them on two bikes.
 

snowskilz

xblue attacked piggy won
May 15, 2004
615
0
rado
i've got at least 5 pro 2 hubs and every one is awesome! your lbs tech needs to get off the chris king bandwagon
 

WBC

Monkey
Aug 8, 2003
578
0
PNW
Your mechanic doesn't at all rally his equipment. Kings require more maintenance than anything else out there - but Hadley is a close second. My King hubs that I had required so much work and so many replacement parts (Axle, ring drive x2, lockring and then another new axle) that I pitched em after 3 months. Hadleys lasted about six months.

ProII hubs last longer than anything but DTs in my experience. I've been wrenching upwards of seven years. I know just about every hub inside and out. Hopes are absolutely bulletproof, relatively cheap, and are a breeze to rebuild.
 

keen

Monkey
Mar 30, 2003
356
0
Good to know Hope's are durable. I had a new King a while ago - had quite a bit of seal drag and was told for a full overhaul special tools were needed. On the 24p engagement - seems like trials riders or serious climbers might benfit but for others it just seems like a number's game.
 
I personally run them on two of my bikes for the past two years(I'm 235lbs btw) and have been building wheels for customers with the PRO II hubs for many years, I'd venture about 80 rear wheels worth, and have only had two ever had issues. Both of which were handled by Hope promptly.

Love Them. Kings are overpriced in my opinion.
 

sanjuro

Tube Smuggler
Sep 13, 2004
17,411
0
SF
I know this is a little different, but I got a front Pro II from BrianHCM, and I have never had a problem.
 

big-ted

Danced with A, attacked by C, fired by D.
Sep 27, 2005
1,403
46
Vancouver, BC
My pro 2 is ok I guess. There's a few things I don't like about it. Alu freehub body does get a bit chewed up. Not enough to cause problems getting the cassette on and off, but it's annoying to see everytime you do remove the cassette.

I really don't understand the point of the third bearing in the freehub body. It adds extra weight and drag (the latter of which is quite noticeable on the pro 2) and, from an engineering perspective, I would have thought it makes no sense as, presumably, an axle can only be supported at two point along its length anyways?

That said, it has required ZERO maintenance in 18 months, has solid engagement, and doesn't cost the Earth, so I'm happy. And I can't think of another hub I'd rather run at any price point. I guess I just preferred the old bulb.
 

- seb

Turbo Monkey
Apr 10, 2002
2,924
0
UK
I've just bought a pair of Hope Pro 2s, they were the lightest hubs in 20mm/150x12mm configurations apart from Tunes which are about three times the cost!

Not built them up yet, but I'm intrigued what he said about flanges? I noticed something odd on my hubs - the diameter of the metal is exactly the same on both sides of the hub, but the spoke holes on the disc side of both hubs are 1mm further out than on the non-disc side.

I don't have a problem with that, I just don't understand it? In my mind it means there's either wasted weight on the non-disc side flange, or the disc-side flange is unnecessarily weakened by this shift?
 

- seb

Turbo Monkey
Apr 10, 2002
2,924
0
UK
Also my only real gripe based on what I know of the hubs is their poor engagement, that did have me looking at burgtecs, kings & tunes.

It seems so easy in my head to have two sets of pawls, one set offet by half a ratchet tooth from the others so turning a ratchet with 24teeth into a 48engagement hub, so I wonder why they don't do it?

The aluminium freehub doesn't bother me, I couldn't give a stuff whether it starts to look "tatty", so long as it still does it's job. Does anyone know how to remove the freehub body? On my old bulb they just pulled off but this one doesn't seem to budge, do I just need to pull harder?
 

-C-

Monkey
May 27, 2007
296
9
They are cheap & cheerfull, Do everything alright, but will never set the world on fire.

24pt engagement is woefully poor, freehub body is made of cheese. Yes others use alloy too, but it must be a different grade, because the Hope's get eaten alive. Even if you use one of the recommended high end cassettes with an alu carrier.

150mm hub is rubbish! Its exactly the same as the 135, same spoke flange gap, just with a whacking great big spacer between the disk side spoke flange & disk mount. I thought part of the point of a 150mm hub was zero dish, and wider flanges = stronger wheel. Other than the fact it looks rediculous.

It seems so easy in my head to have two sets of pawls, one set offet by half a ratchet tooth from the others so turning a ratchet with 24teeth into a 48engagement hub, so I wonder why they don't do it?
One reason. Cheap.

I've run some Pro 2's for about 2 years now, as I wanted a reasonable cost spare set of wheels. They eat bearings like they are going out of fashion, i'm on my second freehub body and the ratchet mechanism died on me. By comparison, my 'boutique' wheelset (which cost twice as much to buy in the first place) has required zero maintenance over the same time, and now owes me less in cost, and has had more miles put on it.

I would only bother with a Pro 2 front now. Rear there are plenty of far better options.
 

daisycutter

Turbo Monkey
Apr 8, 2006
1,523
44
New York City
There is no way a DT hub is more reliable then a Hadley. I broken two DT's hubs fail and one was a 440 which cracked. (To there credit DT replaced the hub) I have never had a Hadley have any issues more then a bit of grease.
 

- seb

Turbo Monkey
Apr 10, 2002
2,924
0
UK
I thought part of the point of a 150mm hub was zero dish
Which is exactly what you get with a Hope Pro II (unless you have an offset rear end on your bike).

As for hopes being 24pt versus 48pt for cheapness, the sort of thing I'm suggesting would require a couple of extra pawls and a fractional extra bit of machining. It would add almost zero cost to the hub.
 

Sir_Crackien

Turbo Monkey
Feb 7, 2004
2,052
0
alex. va. usa.
i have 3 sets of hopes myself and and have not had a single problem with one! on the xc bike the allmountain/light fr bike and a trials bike. they all have been great to me. personnally i think they are way better than king in the fact that they are simpler, stronger (i have seen many kings break), light (as a set alteast), and WAY less expensive.

i work at a shop myself so kings are not far out of reach for me and i still to date have not owned one. thought about it before i got the pro2's but not since. honestly they are the best hubs i have ever had.
 

Sir_Crackien

Turbo Monkey
Feb 7, 2004
2,052
0
alex. va. usa.
also the reason they don't have 48pt is that the alloy freehub body could be hurt if they didn't use all 4 (large) paws to engage the ring. on the trials/ss hub they use a steel freehub body (btw its a tank) and they do offset the paws to get 48pt. in all honesty you really don't need more than 16pt for mountain riding expecally(sp?) dh.

as for the 150mm hub having the same flange spacing that is BS! they 150mm hub uses the same hub body has the ss hub and the flange distance is much wider, don't know how much but it is.
 

keen

Monkey
Mar 30, 2003
356
0
They are cheap & cheerfull, Do everything alright, but will never set the world on fire.

24pt engagement is woefully poor, freehub body is made of cheese. Yes others use alloy too, but it must be a different grade, because the Hope's get eaten alive. Even if you use one of the recommended high end cassettes with an alu carrier.

150mm hub is rubbish! Its exactly the same as the 135, same spoke flange gap, just with a whacking great big spacer between the disk side spoke flange & disk mount. I thought part of the point of a 150mm hub was zero dish, and wider flanges = stronger wheel. Other than the fact it looks rediculous.



One reason. Cheap.

I've run some Pro 2's for about 2 years now, as I wanted a reasonable cost spare set of wheels. They eat bearings like they are going out of fashion, i'm on my second freehub body and the ratchet mechanism died on me. By comparison, my 'boutique' wheelset (which cost twice as much to buy in the first place) has required zero maintenance over the same time, and now owes me less in cost, and has had more miles put on it.

I would only bother with a Pro 2 front now. Rear there are plenty of far better options.

This guy must work @ my LBS... just kidding. I read all the favorable reviews and this sticks in my head, I must be pesemistic. I don't have $$$ for a wheelset so the Hope's look like a viable alternative.
 

- seb

Turbo Monkey
Apr 10, 2002
2,924
0
UK
as for the 150mm hub having the same flange spacing that is BS! they 150mm hub uses the same hub body has the ss hub and the flange distance is much wider, don't know how much but it is.
They may be a few mm wider apart than on a 135mm hub, but certainly not as wide apart as they COULD be, there's a LOT more space between the disc-side flance and the disc mounts on the rear 150mm hub than there is on the front 20mm hub, for example. I suspect this is to build a dishless wheel.

I believe generally a dishless wheel is stronger than a wider-flanged-but-dished wheel.

On the other note, if you're right and they are 24pt engagement because of the alloy freehub I for one would happily buy a 48pt titanium freehub if they produced one (I know they can make ti freehubs as my old bulb had one). I might even be tempted by a heavy steel one if that's retrofittable to my pro2, despite the weight. I'll wait till I've built the wheel up and see if it bothers me.
 

-C-

Monkey
May 27, 2007
296
9
This guy must work @ my LBS... just kidding. I read all the favorable reviews and this sticks in my head, I must be pesemistic. I don't have $$$ for a wheelset so the Hope's look like a viable alternative.
My opinion is based on actual experience. I'm not going to dress something up that its not. If you don't like it, tough. Like I said, front hubs are fine, rear, you can do better.

as for the 150mm hub having the same flange spacing that is BS! they 150mm hub uses the same hub body has the ss hub and the flange distance is much wider, don't know how much but it is.
Sure?



Putting a 135 & 150 together, they are pretty damn close. WHich would account for the HUGE spacer on the left...
 

Cant Climb

Turbo Monkey
May 9, 2004
2,687
10
My opinion is based on actual experience. I'm not going to dress something up that its not. If you don't like it, tough. Like I said, front hubs are fine, rear, you can do better.
How would you rate the drag in the Hope Pro II compared to some other hubs.....?........i hate drag more than anything....
 

banrider

Monkey
Nov 24, 2004
303
11
I've owned 2 wheelsets with Hope Pro II...one of them is nice and works perfect...the other one has got lots of drags in the freehub...after changing bearings, I realized one of the springs was broken..I emailed Hope Uk and in one week I had a new set of springs & pawls for free...I then replaced the broken spring assuming this would end the drag but I was wrong...the drag was still there...after checking all again and no finding anything wrong in the freehub I emailed again Hope Uk and now they are sending me a new freehub for free as well! so Hope Pro hubs are not only good value for money but also very easy to service and Hope customer service is awesome!
 

-C-

Monkey
May 27, 2007
296
9
How would you rate the drag in the Hope Pro II compared to some other hubs.....?........i hate drag more than anything....
I would rate it worse than most I have tried (CK, Hadley, Tune & Burgtec), thats a fairly common theme with them. But a lot of people drop a couple of pawls out of the freehub, and run them with oil, rather than packed with grease, which apparently makes all the difference :)
 

brungeman

I give a shirt
Jan 17, 2006
5,173
0
da Burgh
I don't have first hand experience (on my own bike) with the Pro-2, I can say that working in the shop we have had great luck with them! Yes the engagement isn't as instant as Kings, but for the most part it is very solid!

I will say that the folks at Hope also take care of issues that do arise as quick as any I have seen in the industry!

I had a friend that on the first ride split his Pro-2 rear in half. Don goes about 240#'s and is a pretty tough rider. Hope's response was to instantly send him a new hub, no more questions asked! They said this was an uncommon claim, yet they did explain some changes in the construction of their hubs that makes this occurance a thing of the distant past. This is a big thumbs up for the company and how they handled this issue! They back their product PERIOD!


here is a pic of the split... as I said they took care of it! so :thumb:


My next rear hub will most likely be a Pro-2!
 

Attachments

Mike B.

Turbo Monkey
Oct 5, 2001
1,522
0
State College, PA
We built somewhere in the neighborhood of 175 sets of Pro II hubs last year I had one reported issue. Nothing major and Hope resolved it quickly. Many of our builds are in the xc or all mountain category but some of those are seeing a lot of miles.

As for engagement, the 4 pawls engaging every 15 degrees is not that unusual or bad. The DT 240/440 for instance is 18 simultaneous points allowing for 20 degrees of free rotation between.

The 150mm version could stand to have the non-drive flange pushed out a bit as the non-drive side will actually be at a higher tension than the drive side on a properly built wheel. The regular 135 rear balances tension left to right better than King, Hadley, or DT 240/440.
 

- seb

Turbo Monkey
Apr 10, 2002
2,924
0
UK
The 150mm version could stand to have the non-drive flange pushed out a bit as the non-drive side will actually be at a higher tension than the drive side on a properly built wheel. The regular 135 rear balances tension left to right better than King, Hadley, or DT 240/440.
Why? I can't see why anything other than dishless is ideal?

I have a hoep pro2 150 in front of me right now, and a tape measure, and can tell you that the flanges are equally spaced from the centre of the hub, which will give a dishless build. Please explain why you think a wheel dished over to the disc side is better?
 

Urinal Mint

Monkey
Oct 10, 2003
193
0
Washington
Why? I can't see why anything other than dishless is ideal?

I have a hoep pro2 150 in front of me right now, and a tape measure, and can tell you that the flanges are equally spaced from the centre of the hub, which will give a dishless build. Please explain why you think a wheel dished over to the disc side is better?
I believe that is incorrect. C-F left is 24mm and C-F right is 28mm. I just built up a pro II set with a 150mm rear.
 

- seb

Turbo Monkey
Apr 10, 2002
2,924
0
UK
I believe that is incorrect. C-F left is 24mm and C-F right is 28mm. I just built up a pro II set with a 150mm rear.
Well I'm afriad wherever you got that info from is wrong, but in choosing correct spoke lengths it makes very negligible difference so you would have been none the wiser.

I've just measured mine and each flange is 47mm from the end, so C-F left = C-F right = 28mm.
 

Urinal Mint

Monkey
Oct 10, 2003
193
0
Washington
Well I'm afriad wherever you got that info from is wrong, but in choosing correct spoke lengths it makes very negligible difference so you would have been none the wiser.

I've just measured mine and each flange is 47mm from the end, so C-F left = C-F right = 28mm.
Well, I can't measure it now since I already built the wheel. I got the info off the BTI site which definitely could have been incorrect. I didn't bother to measure it myself, but it built up perfect.
 

- seb

Turbo Monkey
Apr 10, 2002
2,924
0
UK
DTswiss have it "wrong" at 24/28 as well.

Full set of measurements from my hub:

End to drive flange: 46mm
Drive flange width: 3mm
Between flanges: 52mm
Disc flange width: 3mm
End to disc flange: 46mm