[MtnBikerChk]

I have a friend who has absolutely NO clue about computers. She knows she has one at home, with a cable modem. She has a software firewall - Norton's, I think.

Anyway, her daughter just got a computer and she knows LESS about computers/networking but they know they want both computers on the Internet. Oh yeah, and they are cheap LOL.

So, I was thinking I could just get a 4 port hub for $20 and be done with it. All I can find are USB hubs (not ethernet) or switches for like $30.

Thoughts?

 

[binary visions]

You need to spend a couple more bucks and buy a router.

Switches/hubs work for internal networks, but the cable ISP isn't going to allow two computers connecting on the same connection unless it's through a router.

Picture it this way:

A switch is like a traffic cop. He just takes all the computer packets and says "hold on, you go now... okay now it's your turn... etc." That means that each computer is trying to establish their own network (internet) connection and get their own IP address. That's a no-no for internet service providers: one home, one bill, one IP address.

A router is more like a taxi service. All the computer packets (cars) go into the router, and the router loads each of them on the one taxi and sends them out under one network connection. That's not a perfect analogy, but you get the idea. That appears to the cable provider to be a single network connection since all the taxis look the same.

If you want wireless options, I like the Linksys WRT54G. I'd probably recommend going with that option since it allows them to use wireless in the future if they ever need it.

If they're certain they never need wireless, you'll need a broadband router. I have no experience with the particular broadband router models so I can't really recommend a reliable one.. but for simple usage, it shouldn't matter too much.

 

[MtnBikerChk]

You need to spend a couple more bucks and buy a router.

Switches/hubs work for internal networks, but the cable ISP isn't going to allow two computers connecting on the same connection unless it's through a router.

Picture it this way:

A switch is like a traffic cop. He just takes all the computer packets and says "hold on, you go now... okay now it's your turn... etc." That means that each computer is trying to establish their own network (internet) connection and get their own IP address. That's a no-no for internet service providers: one home, one bill, one IP address.

A router is more like a taxi service. All the computer packets (cars) go into the router, and the router loads each of them on the one taxi and sends them out under one network connection. That's not a perfect analogy, but you get the idea. That appears to the cable provider to be a single network connection since all the taxis look the same.

If you want wireless options, I like the Linksys WRT54G. I'd probably recommend going with that option since it allows them to use wireless in the future if they ever need it.

If they're certain they never need wireless, you'll need a broadband router. I have no experience with the particular broadband router models so I can't really recommend a reliable one.. but for simple usage, it shouldn't matter too much.

She won't spend the money on a router - I've already been there with her. What are my other options?

 

[splat]

Then tell her she can't do it unless she gets a router , the cable cOmpany will not allow 2 on at the same time

 

[MtnBikerChk]

Switches/hubs work for internal networks, but the cable ISP isn't going to allow two computers connecting on the same connection unless it's through a router.

I totally didn't think this one through. I would have figured it out real fast when I went to plug it in.

 

[binary visions]

She won't spend the money on a router - I've already been there with her. What are my other options?

Um...

This guy is only $39.99 after rebate.

If she wants to share her connection via software, she's going to need to buy a switch, and buy a piece of software to run as a proxy/NAT on her main machine - which will then require some setup on her part. There may be free pieces around, but I haven't used any since the mid 90's so I wouldn't feel comfortable recommending one. It may turn into a nightmare.

She's going to buy a $20+ switch anyway, then have to buy or locate a piece of software, then configure the software, and her computer will always have to be on in order for the connection to function. If she reboots, her daughter is cut off. If it goes down due to a virus or something, her daughter is cut off.

You can't convince her that the extra $20 is worth the headache and hassle?

 

[Mike B.]

I use a Netgear WGR614 router at home which should be less than $40 online or in the 40-50 neighborhood at Circuit City, etc. Works well, gives you the wireless option, and it's a decent price. It's no Linksys but I have no complaints in 2+ years.

 

[binary visions]

I totally didn't think this one through. I would have figured it out real fast when I went to plug it in.

I wish I could say I didn't do the exact same thing when I first got my cable connection. Only I didn't actually buy my switch, I already had it.

 

[MtnBikerChk]

You can't convince her that the extra $20 is worth the headache and hassle?

I'll try - but you know some people

 

[Kornphlake]

You could get an A/B switch and manually change the connection from one computer to the other, assuming such a switch exists for ethernet. Then both computers would be able to use the internet, but not at the same time, you'd get one or the other.

If they don't need wireless you should be able to find a used broadband router on craigslist or if you can wait a few days ebay might save even more.

 

[maxyedor]

I don't know what your local eceltronics stores have to offer but I was at Fry's the other day and they had a NetGear wireless B router for $16.99. Granted it isn't a fast router, nor do you need wireless in this situation, but you could hardwire up to 4 computers to it from the back-panel. But depending on how big a house she has, the ethernet cables to conect it up may cost more than cheap wireless cards.

 

[Pau11y]

You can try some fancy schmancy deal w/ dual NICs and ICS, but it's a HUGE pain in the ass! Plus, most routers now have built-in firewalls which you can config so tight that dogs and cats howl when it farts, to completely open. By putting the firewalling task on a dedicated device, it'll free up your CPU and possibly speed up the 'puter. Personal opinion is that window based software firewalls are pigs and it's a good thing to stay away from if at all possible.
I bought a D-Link Ethernet only router back in the day and it was like $39.00. I'm sure by now, it's prob only like $15.00 (forgot the model, but it's one that doesn't have any WiFi features).

 

[binary visions]

Heyy... It just occured to me... check your PMs.

 

[Trigger]

hmmm....so, is this a thing in the US - that your ISP only allows you one IP at home?

In Norway, when getting cable or xDSL, we usually get a small router at home. This router runs a DHCP service, locked to either 5, 10 or a similar small number - but still it'll give you a little net at home.

This is not common over there?

What if you have a laptop from work, a pc at home and a xbox...this would force you to buy a extra router?

 

[binary visions]

Trigger... Your ISP is only allowing you one IP as well in all likelihood. That's what the router is for - it takes all the internal network traffic, and routes it through one external IP. The DHCP in your router is assigning each internal computer an internal IP address which is only used inside the network to direct traffic.

You can have as many internal IPs as you like and as you have equipment for. Hundreds if you need them. You just need to have everything eventually plugged into your router and the router will take care of moving all the traffic through your single external IP. The router can have as few as four ports, and you can get dozens of ports if you want to spend the money. There's no practical limit to the number of machines you can have in your house, you just need to have enough ports on your router or enough switches behind the router.

I could be wrong, of course, and maybe your service providers really do give you several external IP addresses, but that seems like a waste of resources - 99% of home users would never need more than one external IP.

 

[Trigger]

Trigger... Your ISP is only allowing you one IP as well in all likelihood. That's what the router is for - it takes all the internal network traffic, and routes it through one external IP. The DHCP in your router is assigning each internal computer an internal IP address which is only used inside the network to direct traffic.

You can have as many internal IPs as you like and as you have equipment for. Hundreds if you need them. You just need to have everything eventually plugged into your router and the router will take care of moving all the traffic through your single external IP. The router can have as few as four ports, and you can get dozens of ports if you want to spend the money. There's no practical limit to the number of machines you can have in your house, you just need to have enough ports on your router or enough switches behind the router.

I could be wrong, of course, and maybe your service providers really do give you several external IP addresses, but that seems like a waste of resources - 99% of home users would never need more than one external IP.

I know that my ISP only gives me one public IP , but they by default give all their users a router that enables them to set up a homenetwork with privat IP's as well. That's my point.

From what I read here, it sounds like ISP's in the US let their users find out stuff like that themselves?

 

[binary visions]

Ohh, I misunderstood.

Many ISPs will help you set up an internal network. You can usually buy this equipment directly from them or lease it. I'm sure some even offer it free if you sign a contract, and typically tech support will troubleshoot if you have problems.

I haven't seen one that just hands out free routers, though.

There's not a whole lot to it anymore, since most routers work have DHCP servers and obtain their IP addresses automatically (either via cable's DHCP server or via the DSL modem's PPoE). You just plug in the uplink cable, plug in your computers, and go.