[Skookum]

One is a truck driver another works on computers.
Economy sucks here, so they figure they'll make a bundle 125K for computer work and 150K driving a truck for contracters in Iraq. Tax free for one year....
I told both of em i thought is was stupid, but i understand why it's so compelling. You can come back and put a down payment on a house and have a nice little nest egg to get ahead for just a year of your life.
My whole point of view on the deal is i keep thinking about a quote from a pal of mine. He came over from Gambia Africa years back and worked on the roof with me for a year or so. He was busy cleaning the grounds when he unearthed a stone and a nest of garter snakes which are completely harmless..... Well to him all snakes have capability of killing you since they have Black Mamba's and such at his homeland. So when he refused to go back down the ladder and clean the grounds he so eloquently stated in a deep African accent.... "I will not die for dollar!". Those words kind of stuck with me over the years, as to the extent of what conditions i would choose to or choose not to work under.

 

[N8 v2.0]

One has a vastly greater chance of getting killed/injured in a car wreck here in the US than getting killed in Iraq as a civilian contractor.

However, I ain't going over there.

 

[jdcamb]

One is a truck driver another works on computers.
Economy sucks here, so they figure they'll make a bundle 125K for computer work and 150K driving a truck for contracters in Iraq. Tax free for one year....
I told both of em i thought is was stupid, but i understand why it's so compelling. You can come back and put a down payment on a house and have a nice little nest egg to get ahead for just a year of your life.
My whole point of view on the deal is i keep thinking about a quote from a pal of mine. He came over from Gambia Africa years back and worked on the roof with me for a year or so. He was busy cleaning the grounds when he unearthed a stone and a nest of garter snakes which are completely harmless..... Well to him all snakes have capability of killing you since they have Black Mamba's and such at his homeland. So when he refused to go back down the ladder and clean the grounds he so eloquently stated in a deep African accent.... "I will not die for dollar!". Those words kind of stuck with me over the years, as to the extent of what conditions i would choose to or choose not to work under.

I have also been contemplating going over too. If they could guarantee my safety I would already be there. The money is still tempting. The recruiter that contacted me knew a lot about me and she kind of scared me is another reason I had second thoughts. The fact that they offer little to no training to the contracters is kind of scary too. I would just literally sign up and be on my way. You have very little knowledge of your assignment either. I just don't feel good about it so I said no. She has since contacted me and upped the offer twice. I couldn't bring my bike either.....jdcamb

 

[Toshi]

to them and anyone else considering going: go by all means and enjoy the money you earn, but realize that the pay is high because it is really dangerous. in other words, don't whine when you get shot at or captured, it's all part of the bargain.

 

[Skookum]

However, I ain't going over there.

"I will not die for dollar!"

 

[thruster]

But I bet you would for 2 dollars.

 

[Dog Welder]

One has a vastly greater chance of getting killed/injured in a car wreck here in the US than getting killed in Iraq as a civilian contractor.

However, I ain't going over there.

YEah but you stand a greater chance of getting your f'ing head cut off over there than here.

 

[fluff]

One has a vastly greater chance of getting killed/injured in a car wreck here in the US than getting killed in Iraq as a civilian contractor.

Really? What are the stats?

 

[fluff]

If they could guarantee my safety I would already be there. The money is still tempting.

Dude, if they could guarantee your safety they wouldn't offer you the money!

I've considered working in Angola and Afghanistan at different times (when neither were safe but very lucrative) and decided I didn't love money enough.

 

[bmxr]

You want to go to Iraq for a couple bucks? If you can watch all of this and still want to go be an unarmed civilian over there, then by all means, go.

 

[pnj]

I've never been motivated by money and I really don't like deserts......

 

[fluff]

I've never been motivated by money and I really don't like desserts......

They do a mean Creme Brulee though..

 

[Skookum]

But I bet you would for 2 dollars.

nope i would think about it if i had a true inkling of how to defend myself. Only combat training i've ever had was paintball..... and still i honestly believe i would fare better than my 2 pals out there..... Nope i'd never get myself into that situation unless i think i could get out of it if the **** hits the fan.
But maybe if you threw in another buck........

 

[llkoolkeg]

They do a mean Creme Brulee though..

Hahahaha! Smartass...

We do contract work over there, as do some of our clients and one of the other guys that works here recruits for work there. I don't. I couldn't.

It's a very uncool thing when one of your contractors dies and I'm not gonna have THAT conversation with someone's widow, kids or parents. You simply could not pay me enough to go there, regardless of the statistical probabilities involved. The rampant barbarism alone is enough to dissuade any consideration of it. Getting killed in a car wreck is one thing- getting kidnapped, terrorized for days and ultimately having your head slowly sawed off to make a terrorist's internet snuff flick(that will be available for all your family and friends to download before you blood is even dry) is quite another.

I would no sooner set foot in the Devil's own drawing room than in that pit of despair we call the Middle East.

 

[MudGrrl]

I am a contractor.

I am also former military Security Forces, which means I have training in M-16's (night fire also), M-9, M-60, M-203, hand grenades, claymores, law rockets....
I have completed Urban Fighting training, and can survive in the wilderness....
I was a guard for Generals and VIPs (secretaries of state, celebs,)....
With my current job I received training in TNT, C4, blasting caps, det cord, shock cord, and many other things.......


There's no way in hell I would volunteer to go over there for the money.

Toshi's got it right. Don't go over there for money, then start crying when you've been captured.

I do agree that it is a sad affair, though.

 

[ALEXIS_DH]

hmm, already some people take way more risks than those for a lot less money. like marines.

so already, cynically, its kinda too much considering the market.

 

[valve bouncer]

Hey Shirley, before you went to college you mentioned you had had offers to go to Iraq in some capacity. Would you still entertain those offers mate? Why or why not?

 

[genpowell71]

Are they contracting for the US government? If so, they get MP and infantry (those are the guys that know how to fight and kick arse) convoy support. Nothing less than Humvees with 50 caliber and othe machine guns on them. You dont hear about alot of truck drivers getting kidnapped and beheaded. Besides, you'll live on the base in whatever town you get to work in. If this isnt a government contract, then dont take it. WHoever wants the info, drop me a line and I'll tell you about it.

 

[Dog Welder]

You dont hear about alot of truck drivers getting kidnapped and beheaded.

Hold on...there was a Turkish truck driver that got captured/beheaded last month. That's why all those Turkish contracts are refusing to drive for the US. Probably why they want drivers.

 

[fluff]

Hold on...there was a Turkish truck driver that got captured/beheaded last month. That's why all those Turkish contracts are refusing to drive for the US. Probably why they want drivers.

Not to mention that hundreds of Iraqis (including truck drivers) have been kidnapped but never mentioned in the Western media. Possibly for the same reason that there is still no official Iraqi civilian death toll. In some ways the media underplays the dangers of kidnapping.

 

[BurlyShirley]

Hey Shirley, before you went to college you mentioned you had had offers to go to Iraq in some capacity. Would you still entertain those offers mate? Why or why not?

I would, if the money was right. You guys are all letting terrorism win IMO, everytime you say you're afraid to do something because of them. Id bet that you have a better chance of being murdered by thugs in NYcity than by terrorists in Iraq if the numbers could really be broken down. But, propaganda works, i see. Now, what would suck about it all is the time away from home in the desert with not alot to do, but the money would be good enough to make up for it, i think. Govt. work is easy and Id bet most of these jobs are in heavily fortified military areas anyway. The dangerous jobs would be truck driver jobs and stuff where you gotta move around alot, but even then, you'd surely have some sort of armed escort.
See, here in Tn. $125k will BUY YOU A HOUSE no problem, probably on some decent land. Id do it.

 

[fluff]

I would, if the money was right. You guys are all letting terrorism win IMO, everytime you say you're afraid to do something because of them. Id bet that you have a better chance of being murdered by thugs in NYcity than by terrorists in Iraq if the numbers could really be broken down. But, propaganda works, i see. Now, what would suck about it all is the time away from home in the desert with not alot to do, but the money would be good enough to make up for it, i think. Govt. work is easy and Id bet most of these jobs are in heavily fortified military areas anyway. The dangerous jobs would be truck driver jobs and stuff where you gotta move around alot, but even then, you'd surely have some sort of armed escort.
See, here in Tn. $125k will BUY YOU A HOUSE no problem, probably on some decent land. Id do it.

So what are you saying? That we're yellow and you're mercenary?

 

[bmxr]

Id bet that you have a better chance of being murdered by thugs in NYcity than by terrorists in Iraq if the numbers could really be broken down.

I'd bet you're wrong. Most violent crime in the US occurs between people that know each other, so your chances of being "murdered by thugs" depends heavily on what you are into. The average "family-guy" like Jack Hensley is statistically very safe in the US.

 

[llkoolkeg]

I'd bet you're wrong. Most violent crime in the US occurs between people that know each other, so your chances of being "murdered by thugs" depends heavily on what you are into. The average "family-guy" like Jack Hensley is statistically very safe in the US.
QUOTE]

Agreed. And even still, shot with crappy .32 auto for not producing your wallet quick enough is AGAIN a far cry from what these contractors and their families are being put through. Most of the people working there as contractors aren't doing so to pad their lavish domestic lifestyles; many have to take contract work as it comes and goes, so that $150K(annualized) they may make for a six-month assignment has to carry their families for much longer than that. I fully understand the "don't let the terrorists win" mindset, but that doesn't justify rationalizing or minimalizing what is happening to these folks simply because of some misguided desire to count yourself a "team player".

 

[BurlyShirley]

Agreed. And even still, shot with crappy .32 auto for not producing your wallet quick enough is AGAIN a far cry from what these contractors and their families are being put through. ".

I disagree. Being put to death is the same in the end IMO. Also, you make it sound as if a significant number of contractors has been put to death this way. How many from the US has it been...5 or so?

 

[golgiaparatus]

One has a vastly greater chance of getting killed/injured in a car wreck here in the US than getting killed in Iraq as a civilian contractor.

However, I ain't going over there.

I find that hard to believe.

Get a ratio of how many people are over there against how many die a day... I'd bet that the ration of deaths is higher than the ratio of americans killed in car wrecks here vs the population.

Maybe I'm wrong but I just find it hard to believe.

 

[valve bouncer]

I would, if the money was right. You guys are all letting terrorism win IMO, everytime you say you're afraid to do something because of them.

Interesting logic Shirley, but I've come to expect that from you. Just one thing mate- Where do you keep your bike?

 

[BurlyShirley]

Interesting logic Shirley, but I've come to expect that from you. Just one thing mate- Where do you keep your bike?

Well G-zus, of course I dont leave it on the sidewalk to get stolen, but dont be retarded. There is a GOOD chance that if i leave my bike out overnight, it wont be there in the morning. Theres also a GOOD chance you'll be coming back alive from Iraq.

 

[valve bouncer]

Well G-zus, of course I dont leave it on the sidewalk to get stolen, but dont be retarded. There is a GOOD chance that if i leave my bike out overnight, it wont be there in the morning. Theres also a GOOD chance you'll be coming back alive from Iraq.

The point wasn't about the risks of both behaviours but the fact that we all need to take precautions in many aspects of our lives. Choosing not to go to Iraq doesn't pander to terrorists anymore than locking your bike up means the bike thieves have won. Iraq is by any stretch of the imagination a dangerous place, I mean imagine not wanting to go to a dangerous place.

 

[llkoolkeg]

I disagree. Being put to death is the same in the end IMO. Also, you make it sound as if a significant number of contractors has been put to death this way. How many from the US has it been...5 or so?

The ends are the same; the means and the associated emotional trauma to surviving family members(and the psyche of our nation's citizens)??? Not even close. Saying that it's not a big deal does not make it so, bro...

 

[bmxr]

I disagree. Being put to death is the same in the end IMO. Also, you make it sound as if a significant number of contractors has been put to death this way. How many from the US has it been...5 or so?

Well, technically we all end up dead so why does anything matter? IMHO, that's a dumbass argument, and one that doesn't lend any value to the emotional trauma of the victim, nor the physical pain and suffering pre-execution of same. It also totally discounts the implications any of it has on others, most importantly the family and friends of the victim, but also notably, everyone else in the world who witnesses it.

I, for one, feel like a changed person since I saw the clip of the butchering of Mr. Hensley and Mr. Berg. I am not making any political statements based on my feelings, just suggesting that what was done to those two guys vastly different than a mugging, or a car accident, or most any other incident that claims one's life.

 

[BurlyShirley]

I, for one, feel like a changed person since I saw the clip of the butchering of Mr. Hensley and Mr. Berg. I am not making any political statements based on my feelings, just suggesting that what was done to those two guys vastly different than a mugging, or a car accident, or most any other incident that claims one's life.

I dont see how being butchered by those thugs is any different than being butchered by thieves or getting killed by a DUI driver. They have a political goal, and the fact that "your life changed" makes you a perfect target for that kind of advertising. I bet you inadvertinly shout "Im lovin' it" every time you drive by McDonald's too.
Perhaps Im just emotionally disconnected, but really, having my head cut off by terrorists or smashed off in a car wreck makes no difference to ME. Now, others, yes it may, but then again its the same "others" who would be watching whichever contractor is currently being beheaded. It doesnt matter who it is.

 

[Toshi]

I dont see how being butchered by those thugs is any different than being butchered by thieves or getting killed by a DUI driver. They have a political goal, and the fact that "your life changed" makes you a perfect target for that kind of advertising. I bet you inadvertinly shout "Im lovin' it" every time you drive by McDonald's too.
Perhaps Im just emotionally disconnected, but really, having my head cut off by terrorists or smashed off in a car wreck makes no difference to ME. Now, others, yes it may, but then again its the same "others" who would be watching whichever contractor is currently being beheaded. It doesnt matter who it is.

i agree with BS here. btw that mickey d's line is great / .

 

[Silver]

I agree with BS as well.

Terrorism isn't something that the average American needs to worry about that much.

You want to be scared to death? Ride a motorcycle, or get into a car with a teenage driver. Then the stats are really stacked against you.

 

[fluff]

Lots of people are talking about statistics here, but I've yet to see anyone post any.

Does anyone actually have any?

 

[MudGrrl]

I agree with BS up to a certain point. While I believe that a lot of Americans have put their life on hold because they are buying into the "other people want to kill you because you are an American " terrorism media blitz (it's the new buzzword, like millenium used to be), I firmly believe that taking certain risks may result in bad situations (no kidding, right?).

I am not one of those people who cancelled my plans to fly to Florida because I am fearful that terrorists are going to blow up the plane. I lived in Europe during 9/11, travelled to Romania, France, Austria, England, the Netherlands..... had a great time, never met a terrorist, actually wasn't too worried about the very slight chance that there just might be an encounter.

I think going to Iraq for contracting work is a little bit like parachuting. Most often, the jump is a good jump, nothing happens. You always have to be aware that your chute might not open and you will die. It's a risk.

Anybody that I know that has seriously talked about going to Iraq hasn't had outstanding financial problems. They just want the $150k to spend on a bigger house, or boat, or something of that nature. So, the terrorism buzzword gets pushed aside ( "whenever it's my time to go", and "the rates of beheadings is far less than getting killed in a DUI accident") for the materialism concept.

I feel horrible about the victims and their families, but I can't believe that they didn't know the risks involved.

 

[bmxr]

I dont see how being butchered by those thugs is any different than being butchered by thieves or getting killed by a DUI driver....
...but really, having my head cut off by terrorists or smashed off in a car wreck makes no difference to ME.

I explained that in very simple terms. It affects other people. Stop thinking about "you" for a second and just read what I wrote.

They have a political goal, and the fact that "your life changed" makes you a perfect target for that kind of advertising. I bet you inadvertinly shout "Im lovin' it" every time you drive by McDonald's too.

Actually, I don't consider myself affected by advertising much. I tune it out. We are talking about something a little different than just "advertising". I know you don't see it that way in the pseudo-intllectual world you live in, but I don't think it's the same as a commercial for a Big Mac.

Perhaps Im just emotionally disconnected,

Perhaps?

...Now, others, yes it may, but then again its the same "others" who would be watching whichever contractor is currently being beheaded. It doesnt matter who it is.

Never mind. This is pointless.