[kickstand]

ok, so true DH bikes are fairly new to me, i;ve asked a lot of questions and gotten some good responses around here.

I started on a Kona Coiler 2-3 years ago. That was my first "longer" travel bike. It served me pretty well.

A little over a year ago I purchased a used Big Hit 3 off craigslist locally. It's a 2009, I replaced the domain with a fox 40 over the winter, it currently services me well, but I have to think with the improvement I noticed over the coiler one of the three bikes listed above could be a big improvement over the big hit.

A little about me, I used to be an XC downhiller, I would pick my way down the hill as if I was still on a hardtail with an 80mm fork, then as I gained confidence I started to become more of a plower (notice I didn't say I got a ton faster ). Now, after gaining more confidence and experience I am plowing a little less and "doubling" or "skipping" as I call it, over roots, rocks, etc. a little more. I wouldn't consider myself a full on stylish skipping world cup kinda guy, but I'm plowing a little less.

I like to race, I may be slow, and I may suck at not getting too amped up at the start gate and flying off course, but I have a ball racing.

My big hit is a bit "sluggish" on the pedaling side, and never feels extremely "poppy", it (I?) also don't seem to be the most fantastic bike/rider in the corners.

I rode my buddies 951, it was certainly a bit stiff for me as he is much faster, and also weighs about 20 lbs more than me, so I am assuming part of the poppiness came from that, but it felt poppier, it seemed to want to rail corners a bit better, and it also just felt snappy overall, pedaled better, felt stiffer, etc. I realize a lot of this could be due to set up.

I have narrowed it down to a few bikes that I think will work for me. The 951, the m9, and the tr450.

The tr450 advantages are a fairly simple/durable design, I like that. It also seems to have that "pop" that my current bike doesn't.

The 951 seems like a pretty good choice all around.

The M9 seems like a bit more of a plower's bike, which may suit me well, but after reading all 600 pages of the m9 thread i'm not so sold on some of the "chip", "linkage" and other issues I read about. I don't mind doing a little tinkering, but it seems to be a bit higher maintenance then I am after?

I am looking to purchase new, so cost although an issue, is "fairly" close acrossed the board.

I ride a fair amount at snowshoe, seven springs is close to home (6 hours is close?), raced at massanutten in april, and ride a lot here on the home sand dunes. I have a tentative trip to Highland planned for labor day, plattekil, mountain creek, and a few others are on the to do list for this or next season.

Current rankings based on price, performance, durability, maintainability, etc. (all purely from reading threads on the interwebz)

1. TR450
2. 951/m9 (m9 performance is better but needs more upkeep and small issues mentioned in m9 thread keep it from being clear cut #2).

I am also open to suggestions on other bikes that may suit my needs. I considered a demo, a session, a v10, yeti?

Thanks

 

[DirtMcGirk]

I love my TR450. It set up stiffer than I thought it would. Should have listened to the spring rate calculator.
Poppy, lively, and tracks well. Mind you I have exactly 9 runs on it now, but I am taking it to Tahoe for a week next weekend.

You're not going to be getting a new yeti 303 anytime soon. The V10 carbon is a lot more cash-e-money, but you will notice it when you ride.

 

[Wa-Aw]

M9. I've tried plenty of bikes but the M9 is just a on another level of performance and lack of compromise. Those little issues have pretty much all been sorted. Lower box link on new ones is fine. The only negative I can think of is that it makes a lot of your normal trails boring. I don't know if it is just particularly suited to my riding style but that bike gave me confidence like nothing else.

Only real negative I can think of is that it's difficult to clean. A bit on the flexy side.

I think it's a pretty big misconception that it rides heavy and sticks to the ground. That was the M6. With the bikes supposed floaty bikes I've tried, you needed to float to maintain decent speed. With the M9, you just don't have to, but you can if you want to. It floats fine, and it handles square edged stuff so well you can make just any old random rock your kicker. It also pedals surprisingly well. Rarely strikes pedals despite being very very low. The way I always described it was like riding a 7" bike until you hit something big and square. It stays up in it's travel extremely well.

 

[SCARY]

X2 on the m9.You can setup an m9 to ride like a 951 but you can't set up a 951 to ride like a m9.I found myself constantly whacking mypedals on the 951.I don't find the m9 flexy at all and dont tinker with it anymore than any other bike.

 

[Kanye West]

You stand a much better chance of getting a straight frame with a TR450. And hardware that could probably be sourced easier too.

 

[SthFRider]

I love my TR450. It set up stiffer than I thought it would. Should have listened to the spring rate calculator.
Poppy, lively, and tracks well. Mind you I have exactly 9 runs on it now, but I am taking it to Tahoe for a week next weekend.

X2. I've had mine for over 2 years now. Its a super fun bike. Rails corners, takes the rough stuff with ease. Its tough as nails. Easy to adjust compared to other bikes. Its design is simple but efficient. Can go wrong with the 450.

 

[kickstand]

3 lean towards the transition, 2 leaning towards the m9.

I imagine that both are going to feel like great bikes underneath me, and I like what both have to offer.

Is the chances of getting a messed up intense that bad? I've read their QC isn't the greatest, but i thought that was behind them?

 

[chillindrdude]

+1 on the M9. the VPP suspension is legit for downhill applications. I've got a V10C, so i'm extrapolating to the M9. i set mine up to destroy everything in its path. sticks like glue to the ground. just feels like bottomless travel, no wallowing, or harsh ramp up.

 

[IH8Rice]

if youve read the M9 thread then you should have read that the new frames dont have issues like earlier ones and that earlier customers were treated to great CS and have had all issues resolved...except pspec .
+4 for the M9.

 

[kickstand]

well, I didn't read it post for post, it's a long thread, but I did see that pspec was bitching, but hadn't called or emailed intense himself :lol:

 

[Da Peach]

Tr450.

 

[SCARY]

I've thought about the v10 c for maybe my next bike cuz I like the VPP so much.Its a litte different for about 30 mins,then you realize how much traction you get and still can launch it

Do it.....Do it

 

[Capricorn]

M9: as ploughing or poppy as you want. Great adjustability to suit all riding styles. Stiffness if very confidence inspiring. I still have the original lower box link with it's unscrewing issue, but it's truly minor to begin with and never made me doubt my purchase. Best money spent.
Since you have no baseline, you'll be happy with anything you choose, but my vote goes to the M9. Anyday. Any track, Every time.

ps: say M9 fast enough and you'll end up making the right choice

 

[UncleHowie]

I love my M9.
With the new link you shouldn't have any problems. I'm a lazy guy when it comes to maintenance and it makes some noise while riding but everything still works fine. It's poppy and still has a lot of traction I rode it in the swiss alps and in whistler, it works on every type of trail!

 

[kickstand]

Tr450.

why come?

I'm reading that the m9 will straight up go fast as hell, I'm a bit turned off by the box link issues, the talk of a lack of total quality, and I think I recall a crash replacement for the rear triangle being big bucks ($900?). It sounds like the m9 is a damn nice bike and will be very comfortable to ride.

BUT for some reason I keep coming back to the simplicity of the 450's design, but will it hug the ground like the m9? will it help me corner a bit better? I can't seem to find as much info on how it rides in comparison, and quite likely I won't have a chance to ride the two bikes side by side for a comparison, so I'm trying to find more info on how it rides.

 

[ianjenn]

why come?

I'm reading that the m9 will straight up go fast as hell, I'm a bit turned off by the box link issues, the talk of a lack of total quality, and I think I recall a crash replacement for the rear triangle being big bucks ($900?). It sounds like the m9 is a damn nice bike and will be very comfortable to ride.

BUT for some reason I keep coming back to the simplicity of the 450's design, but will it hug the ground like the m9? will it help me corner a bit better? I can't seem to find as much info on how it rides in comparison, and quite likely I won't have a chance to ride the two bikes side by side for a comparison, so I'm trying to find more info on how it rides.

Okay the TR450 compared to a 2010 V-10. The V-10 was a little less playful but also felt a little less stable going fast over rough stuff or down steep terrain. The TR was more nimble, very easy to flick around the trails and swap lines. If you want a playful DH bike on the cheap it would be the one to get!

 

[Da Peach]

Okay the TR450 compared to a 2010 V-10. The V-10 was a little less playful but also felt a little less stable going fast over rough stuff or down steep terrain. The TR was more nimble, very easy to flick around the trails and swap lines. If you want a playful DH bike on the cheap it would be the one to get!

Yeah. That. I guess.

Plus it looks cooler.

 

[daisycutter]

Rode a 450 once. It's a nice solid frame but I would not put it in the m9s class. Still a nice bike bike.

 

[DirtMcGirk]

Are you gonna race it or do you want something you can ride until the wheels come off?

I'm over my racer boi fantasy, too old, too fat, too out of shape and I lack the skill. That being said, I love, love, love to ride my bikes. I rode the M9, rode the 450, rode the V10, just about anything I could get my hands on. I picked the 450 for my bike because it felt really sturdy and it was mechanically not complex. I like being able to do all of my own work on my bike. The 303DH I had was a much more complex machine.

I'd still point you towards the 450 unless you're chasing your Sam Hill fantasy...

 

[SCARY]

.....Or,if you want to hang with the cool people.

 

[kickstand]

Are you gonna race it or do you want something you can ride until the wheels come off?

I'm over my racer boi fantasy, too old, too fat, too out of shape and I lack the skill. That being said, I love, love, love to ride my bikes. I rode the M9, rode the 450, rode the V10, just about anything I could get my hands on. I picked the 450 for my bike because it felt really sturdy and it was mechanically not complex. I like being able to do all of my own work on my bike. The 303DH I had was a much more complex machine.

I'd still point you towards the 450 unless you're chasing your Sam Hill fantasy...

I have no confusion about who I am on a bike. I'm a cat2/3 rider who spends most of his time running off course or missing a turn, I'm in my 30's, and I have a blast riding my bike with my son, my girl, and my friends.....I love to race, but I have no confused illusions of becoming anything more than I am at this point...the podium is not likely in my future.

I love riding, I need to learn to corner better, and I'd like a bike that inspires a bit more confidence over jumps and in the rough. I am "ok" at letting the brakes go and running through rough/technical stuff. I'd like to get better at jumping, cornering, and plowing less....

 

[Da Peach]

Aren't the M9 and the V10 way more expensive?

Are you buying complete? If money is no object, then get the one you'll feel like the biggest bauss riding.

One on my riding buddies went from a session 88 to a TR450, to a v10.

He has confided in me that he preferred the feeling of the 450.

The V10 is certainly more "baller", but apparently less "fun".

The M9 looks like Frankensteins monster IMO, but I'm sure that you'd enjoy riding it.

These choices are so subjective... These bikes cost a fortune, so I get why us mid-30s weekend warrior pleasure riders obsess over which to dump that load is cash upon, but we all know that the "my bike is nicer that yours" factor is likely just as important as the "progressiveness of your leverage ratio".

You'll adapt your riding to your bike, and it will all work out.

Go spend some money. Post pics. Let us all know how much it weighs to the nearest pound.

Job done.

 

[Kntr]

Why does everyone say the 450 is cheap? The 1 build is $5700.

 

[Da Peach]

Why does everyone say the 450 is cheap? The 1 build is $5700.

None of them are cheap. Pretty sure it's the least expensive of the 3 for an equivalent build.

 

[Lelandjt]

Usually if someone is considering the M9 I'd point them toward the V10 for lighter weight at a similar price, though lacking adjustments. However, there's some crazy good deals on the M9 available that put it in a much lower price bracket. aCOS is selling well specced M9s for barely more than a V10 frame costs.

 

[kickstand]

Aren't the M9 and the V10 way more expensive?

According to the transition and intense websites the M9 is cheaper, but I did not closely compare build specs yet. I really haven't gotten into the pricing much yet, but I fully expect to spend $5000 or more, that typically comes with the territory.

Are you buying complete? If money is no object, then get the one you'll feel like the biggest bauss riding.

Money is an object, but I wasn't going to let the price of the bike determine which bike I bought, I want to buy the bike that will help me ride better. The bike I would enjoy riding the most. Etc.

One on my riding buddies went from a session 88 to a TR450, to a v10.

He has confided in me that he preferred the feeling of the 450. ]

Fun factor is important, I am leaning towards the 450 for some of this reason.

The V10 is certainly more "baller", but apparently less "fun".

I don't really care about being "baller", I do however want to have fun. TR450 comments typically revolve around this sentiment.

The M9 looks like Frankensteins monster IMO, but I'm sure that you'd enjoy riding it.

These choices are so subjective...

very, and unfortunately they are not like new cars where it is easy to just go for a test ride. These bikes cost a fortune, so I get why us mid-30s weekend warrior pleasure riders obsess over which to dump that load is cash upon, but we all know that the "my bike is nicer that yours" factor is likely just as important as the "progressiveness of your leverage ratio".

Luckily I am a bit suspension and tech talk dumb, I'm a set it and forget it kind of rider, I like the adjustability so I can initially find the setting I like, but then after that I will not likely make a lot of changes. It's nice to have a nice bike, but I don't much care if mine is nicer than yours.

You'll adapt your riding to your bike, and it will all work out.

Likely very true

Go spend some money. Post pics. Let us all know how much it weighs to the nearest pound.

Job done.

I've never weighed a bike, will my bathroom scale work? lol

 

[kickstand]

Usually if someone is considering the M9 I'd point them toward the V10 for lighter weight at a similar price, though lacking adjustments. However, there's some crazy good deals on the M9 available that put it in a much lower price bracket. aCOS is selling well specced M9s for barely more than a V10 frame costs.

what is aCOS?

 

[Kanye West]

if youve read the M9 thread then you should have read that the new frames dont have issues like earlier ones

That's what Intense has told people for the last decade. And been wrong.

 

[Udi]

 

[tabletop84]

You stand a much better chance of getting a straight frame with a TR450.

Wut? Tell me more.

 

[StunZeeD]

what is aCOS?

aCos = a culture of speed

I dont race..I ride a M9.. Had a 951 and 303 before that..m9 has made me a better rider

Why..it has inspired more confidence and has kept the wheels on the ground a couple times I should have had some carnage.

I run it on the heavier side of a spring with 9" mode in the middle and it's tits

Hard to clean? Not seeing it.

You can get m9 frames cheaper then tr450

 

[SCARY]

Yeah,the m9 does cover for alot of sh!t that should send you OTB .I shoulda mentioned that.Ive been racing /riding for 14 years.Its the only bike I've had where I'm not better than it is.Its made me faster with less effort.If you're all about poppy and fun don't get an m9.If you want to go faster,easier,more safely then pick an m9.Ive had a cannondale superv DH,m1,Foes mono,Orange224,951 and an m9 for reference.

 

[Bikael Molton]

I like how in one thread the TR450 is for plowing, and in the next it is poppy and fun.

Philosophical question: can a downhill mountain bike frame be both baller and fun?

 

[Mo(n)arch]

Speed is fun is baller. So I say yes it can.

 

[captainspauldin]

M9. I've tried plenty of bikes but the M9 is just a on another level of performance and lack of compromise. Those little issues have pretty much all been sorted. Lower box link on new ones is fine. The only negative I can think of is that it makes a lot of your normal trails boring. I don't know if it is just particularly suited to my riding style but that bike gave me confidence like nothing else.

Only real negative I can think of is that it's difficult to clean. A bit on the flexy side.

I think it's a pretty big misconception that it rides heavy and sticks to the ground. That was the M6. With the bikes supposed floaty bikes I've tried, you needed to float to maintain decent speed. With the M9, you just don't have to, but you can if you want to. It floats fine, and it handles square edged stuff so well you can make just any old random rock your kicker. It also pedals surprisingly well. Rarely strikes pedals despite being very very low. The way I always described it was like riding a 7" bike until you hit something big and square. It stays up in it's travel extremely well.

I was concerned coming from my Cove Shocker that the M9 was going to be a monster truck and not have the poppy-ness I loved about the Shocker(but still handle the rough). I haven't had a whole lot of seat time(maybe 8-9 days), but I'm happy to report it def. isn't the monster truck I thought it was gonna be, I can still pop off the rocks/roots I used to on my shocker and it's jumps just as good if not better than my shocker. Wa-Aw's description is spot on, it doesn't feel like 9" travel dh bike on the smoother/fun trails, it only really feels like a 9" dh bike when you want it to.. I've kept mine in the middle travel/progressive setting, I'm curious to see how it feels in the more progressive and less travel mode.

 

[Da Peach]

M9 it is then.

Bargunz!

 

[Kanye West]

Wut? Tell me more.

It's not Intenses fault really. It's just that trying to get a front triangle made of two half-shells welded and aligned dead on straight so the swingarm lines up in line with it is REALLY damn hard to do. Any tiny bit that the two sides of each of those front triangle pivots aren't lined up is amplified at the rear wheel. Makes for a pretty bike, but that's about it really.

 

[SCARY]

Dude,your so full of ****.Enough already.

 

[Kanye West]

If I'm so full of it, then why does the problem persist? Can't handle it if someone doesn't fawn over your asspensive pedal bike?

 

[Inclag]

it's not intenses fault really. It's just that trying to get a front triangle made of two half-shells welded and aligned dead on straight so the swingarm lines up in line with it is really damn hard to do. Any tiny bit that the two sides of each of those front triangle pivots aren't lined up is amplified at the rear wheel. Makes for a pretty bike, but that's about it really.

qft..