[Sandwich]

hrug: K. I'm just looking at the relatively accurate charts produced by a bigger suspension geek than I, and the only person that consistently gets a decent rising rate and good anti-squat profile is DW. Others come close, some others don't, but that's my suggestion. I don't ride a DW bike because his idea of geometry is so much different than my own, plus his bikes are perennially in high demand.

but...

there's no reason you and a million others won't enjoy a VPP or what have you. bikes are bikes. If they don't fit you, then don't buy it. I've been riding an ultra simplistic single pivot with a bad shock rate for two years and I've loved every minute of it. If you're shopping used, then get what has a good build with low use and is local.

I'm just saying....need a bike? Got money? Don't care much for research? Walk into a shop and hop on a dw-designed frame, and you'll probably like it. No guarantees.

 

[jimmydean]

Too bad Dave's a total douche (at least he was in my very brief experience with him anyway).

 

[OGRipper]

I don't ride a DW bike because his idea of geometry is so much different than my own, plus his bikes are perennially in high demand.

So the geometry doesn't work for some people, but he "can't go wrong"?

There are pros and cons all around. You've got your reasons for your decisions, and that's fine. Just don't go spouting opinion as fact, that's all.

 

[Sandwich]

Alright dude. You seem really angry about this so you go ahead being angry, but if you talk to anybody who knows anything about suspension, they will tell you that an "n" shaped leverage curve is the opposite from ideal when paired with an air shock. And if you map the leverage curve of most vpp bikes, they have an n shaped curve. That's not an opinion, that causes mid stroke wallow, excessive ramp, and starting stroke stiffness.

And if you actually test ride or look at the numbers, you'll know whether you fit on a dw bike, and that goes for any bike. I wouldn't buy a small bike from any brand, no matter what, because it would be too small. I don't like the geometry on many of dw's sleds because the top tubes/reach are not long enough to run a very short stem, but that's my opinion, not fact. Plenty of people would rather run longer stems for better weight balance, especially for xc.

 

[Da Peach]

What a great thread.

It really depends on where you get your pleasure. Having nice things is fun. But not essential at all,obviously. OR IS IT???

I just sold my Iron Horse MKIII for cheap. She was a fine rig, but a little...dated.

New bikes are slacker, lighter, and pretty much better in every way. You could find a kickass 2 year old bike for around 2k.

Just make sure you don't buy the wrong suspension design or you'll want to have a draino smoothie.

I was worried that 6" of travel would be too much, but it seems you get used to it and adjust your style to cope with the terrain you ride. And more travel and slacker angles make the downhills almost enough to not miss the DH bike.

 

[Nick]

FWIW, a friend is going to be selling his medium SB66, fairly dialed. Could be had for a good fair price.

I like the Yetis, I ride a 5.Spot. I also like the new Giants.

Jeez, do you even enduro bro?

 

[jimmydean]

I was worried that 6" of travel would be too much, but it seems you get used to it and adjust your style to cope with the terrain you ride. And more travel and slacker angles make the downhills almost enough to not miss the DH bike.

My RM7 is a little dated (2001) but I still get a kick out of riding it just about anywhere. It's 42# of awesome and it is a hell of a workout. I would like to put a single crown on the front to make it a little more nimble and the '01 Super T is not as nice as some of the newer forks out there.

The MKIII was a solid bike, though. I always wanted the MTX version of that bike as a play bike.

<edit> I am running a pretty small front single ring so it works as an all-around (sort of) but my lady isn't a serious rider, so it keeps my speed down for her, too.

 

[TN]

interested. got more deets?

 

[jdcamb]

Ibis Mojo HD, Fox Float 34 26 RLX, CCDBAir, Shimano XT everything else. Or a Transition Covert 26 with Shimano XT and a Fox 34 26 Talas....

 

[TN]

this one has caught my eye...
http://lasvegas.craigslist.org/bik/4351430794.html
DH Norco shore 2008 medium

 

[Da Peach]

pedalling that would not be a whole lot of fun. I'm sure it would make for a trusty shuttle steed though.

 

[boostindoubles]

Seems like my friends who are getting new bikes are either buying the Giant Trance or Santa Cruz Solo. I went with the Blur TR cause I like the 26" weeels.

 

[jdcamb]

Seems like my friends who are getting new bikes are either buying the Giant Trance or Santa Cruz Solo. I went with the Blur TR cause I like the 26" weeels.

What are you riding now?

 

[boostindoubles]

This guy... It's an alloy Blur TR with an X fusion Slant

 

[kidwoo]

Except when there is!

I own and like a turner 5 spot but why the fvck do I want any antisquat at all at 4 inches deep into a 5.5 a half inch travel frame? And why would I want the least right at the sag point where I'm doing most of the pedaling? Friggin east coast engineers.

Tuned yes. Logical? Meh The norco and giant make more sense to me based solely on those curves.

 

[kidwoo]

TN:

You ride a gary fischer sugar.

It doesn't matter what you get. Everything, EVERYTHING will be an improvement

 

[Sandwich]

I own and like a turner 5 spot but why the fvck do I want any antisquat at all at 4 inches deep into a 5.5 a half inch travel frame? And why would I want the least right at the sag point where I'm doing most of the pedaling? Friggin east coast engineers.

Tuned yes. Logical? Meh The norco and giant make more sense to me based solely on those curves.

I thought you and DW were like super tight old school homies...

That graph was mostly just to show that there was a difference between dwlink and maestro, even if there are lawsuits flying. I have my own issues with dwlink (why would you want 160% as at top out, unless you like to hear the scuff of the tire when you're trying to climb technical sections, every iteration of the system is different and some dramatically so to the point where they aren't really dw links anymore...) but I still argue that if you want a system that has thought put into both anti-squat performance AND the leverage rate, a surefire bet is something designed by DW. I like split-pivot better than dwl, but that's my preference for active braking performance and robust design over fancy kinematics.

 

[StiHacka]

The Breezer Repack has some sexy curves!
http://linkagedesign.blogspot.com/2013/09/breezer-repack-2014.html

 

[TN]

I know. As soon as I sit on something else I will be wanting to pull the trigger i think.

TN:

You right a gary fischer sugar.

It doesn't matter what you get. Everything, EVERYTHING will be an improvement

 

[TN]

all these graphs and **** are hurting my eyes but I like the looks of that The Breezer Repack.