Quantcast

irony robbed at gunpoint

$tinkle

Expert on blowing
Feb 12, 2003
14,591
5
Illinois Lawmaker Robbed of $7
EAST ST. LOUIS, Ill. (AP) — A 77-year-old Illinois state representative is happy to be alive after a man with a gun pushed his way into her home and robbed her of $7.

Younge, a Democrat, said she didn't recognize the man, who wore a red hat and red jacket and dark pants. She said she's going to pray for him.

"This robbery and what's happening to this community is the result of a lack of a supportive system for our youth. We need jobs," she said. "This happened in broad daylight at noon. We need a mental health support system. This is further evidence of that."
y'know, since she's a law maker, why not sponsor a bill which could make illinois the 49th state to permit concealed carry?

just a thought.

of course, having been to east st. louis twice - and living to tell about it - the residents there aren't too concerned with the letter of the law
 

syadasti

i heart mac
Apr 15, 2002
12,701
290
VT
So worth it get in a gun fight over $7 :rolleyes:

So you support the right of kids to go on rampages at school taking out their classmates for stealing their lunch money and what not then?
 

$tinkle

Expert on blowing
Feb 12, 2003
14,591
5
So you support the right of kids to go on rampages at school taking out their classmates for stealing their lunch money and what not then?
to the best of my knowledge, this isn't currently a right.

if you mean "do you support the drafting of legislation to lift/repeal restrictions on school campuses?", then no.

i would, however, support the use of self-defense. don't you think the right to self-defend should itself be defended?
 

JohnE

filthy rascist
May 13, 2005
12,646
664
Front Range, dude...
You cant prove that, any more then the super NRA folks can prove that it will drive crime down. The only way to prove either viewpoint is to go to the left or right extreme.

If all gun owners were well trained and responsible, then maybe national concealed carry would work. But thats a hell of a big maybe...
 

Silver

find me a tampon
Jul 20, 2002
10,846
0
Orange County, CA
You cant prove that, any more then the super NRA folks can prove that it will drive crime down. The only way to prove either viewpoint is to go to the left or right extreme.

If all gun owners were well trained and responsible, then maybe national concealed carry would work. But thats a hell of a big maybe...
Didn't I just see a thread in the lounge where the notable gentleman and scholar TheMontashu picked up an M1?
 

MikeD

Leader and Demogogue of the Ridemonkey Satinists
Oct 26, 2001
10,360
400
chez moi
Civilian gun defense causes more problems than it solves
Until your ass is on the line

Both sides of this argument have stats to show how great or how deplorable gun ownership is. Neither side can really prove a damned thing.

But when someone busts into my house, I want a gun as an option. He could have wanted a lot more than $7, and there's no telling except in hindsight.

Stinkle, since this jackass busted into the lady's house, CCW isn't even an issue--she should (and I think the Supreme Court is about to uphold) have the right to have one or many in her own hom
 

syadasti

i heart mac
Apr 15, 2002
12,701
290
VT
If all gun owners were well trained and responsible, then maybe national concealed carry would work. But thats a hell of a big maybe...
That is why I said civilian gun ownership. Most people are neither well trained or responsible. I completely agree with you statement.
 

$tinkle

Expert on blowing
Feb 12, 2003
14,591
5
Didn't I just see a thread in the lounge where the notable gentleman and scholar TheMontashu picked up an M1?
mossberg 500?
MikeD said:
Stinkle, since this jackass busted into the lady's house, CCW isn't even an issue--she should (and I think the Supreme Court is about to uphold) have the right to have one or many in her own hom
typically, these types of strongarm crimes are rarer in states w/ ccw (ownership is higher)

and it's unlikely he targeted her b/c she was an old lady, as a gun would be overkill. of course, i'm fallaciously applying logic to a resident of east st louis
 

JohnE

filthy rascist
May 13, 2005
12,646
664
Front Range, dude...
My ?? is was that a-hole willing to kill over $7? No hometraining.

Stuff like this is why I have dogs...and guns. And a phone. "Hello, 911? My dog is eating a guy who broke into my place. I am the guy with the billion watt flashlight. And btw, I am armed. Please let the patrol know that"
 

dante

Unabomber
Feb 13, 2004
8,814
8
looking for classic NE singletrack
Illinois Lawmaker Robbed of $7y'know, since she's a law maker, why not sponsor a bill which could make illinois the 49th state to permit concealed carry?

just a thought.
after a man with a gun pushed his way into her home and robbed her of $7
last I checked, granny was fully in her right to carry any type of legal firearm in her house, so why would she need a concealed carry permit? she could've been sitting in her rocker with a 12-gauge and blown the guy to kingdom come, and been fully within her rights to do it. :plthumbsdown:


edit: at least you could've pushed for legalization of this:
 

$tinkle

Expert on blowing
Feb 12, 2003
14,591
5
last I checked, granny was fully in her right to carry any type of legal firearm in her house, so why would she need a concealed carry permit? she could've been sitting in her rocker with a 12-gauge and blown the guy to kingdom come, and been fully within her rights to do it. :plthumbsdown:
http://www.ridemonkey.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2881320&postcount=10

addressed previously.

legality of carry translates to easier access for granny to purchase both the weapon & the ammo (without which its effectiveness precipitously reduced), as there would be more local stores which see the viability in selling. also, buying & then transporting across state lines may be legally cumbersome, but less so for shotguns.

are n8 & i the only ones to see this?
 

dante

Unabomber
Feb 13, 2004
8,814
8
looking for classic NE singletrack
are n8 & i the only ones to see this?
Yup.

I live in WI, "one of only two states that completely prohibits anyone but police officers and sheriffs' deputies from carrying concealed weapons for self defense." However, there's a gun shop right down the street from the office (coincidently, right across from the taco place, mmmmmmm) that I drive past every day to and from work, and the lack of a concealed carry law does absolutely nothing to prevent me from walking in and picking up any type of legal firearm I want. In the area around my house (within a half-hour drive), there's 27 gun shops listed by anywho.com, including 4 in the town itself.

Sorry, you have to come up with something better if you're going to keep trying to tie a home invasion with the inability to carry a gun into your local supermarket, mall, etc. :plthumbsdown:
 

$tinkle

Expert on blowing
Feb 12, 2003
14,591
5
it's like this: states where there are concealed carry laws are also states with a higher saturation of gun stores or sporting goods stores which sell guns. in no small measure, this is significant to the expected increase of a legally armed public, which translates to less gun crimes of this nature.

can't speak to tweaker-on-tweaker violence, just the strong-armed variety of tweaker-on-random-resident violence.

since we passed a make my day law here in colorado, historical data can be used to demonstrate a correlation that burglars have been safer through deterrence. (i.e., they take up another profession)

previously they were safer and active. (i.e., they were "gainfully employed")
 

dante

Unabomber
Feb 13, 2004
8,814
8
looking for classic NE singletrack
it's like this: states where there are concealed carry laws are also states with a higher saturation of gun stores or sporting goods stores which sell guns. in no small measure, this is significant to the expected increase of a legally armed public, which translates to less gun crimes of this nature.

can't speak to tweaker-on-tweaker violence, just the strong-armed variety of tweaker-on-random-resident violence.

since we passed a make my day law here in colorado, historical data can be used to demonstrate a correlation that burglars have been safer through deterrence. (i.e., they take up another profession)

previously they were safer and active. (i.e., they were "gainfully employed")
ok, I'll bite.

1) you don't post *any* links to back up any of that.
2) "states where there are concealed carry laws are also states with a higher saturation of gun stores or sporting goods stores which sell guns." cause and effect, which came first? show me information that there are now a greater number of gun stores in places like CO *after* they instituted a CC law.
3) there's no evidence that granny was inhibited from buying a gun due to the lack of gun shops in the area.
4) again, link? info? remember, robberies does not equal burglaries. just because violent crimes are down, property crimes and burglary could very well be up (as was the case in CO). (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Concealed_carry)

so yes, granny *might* not have been able find a local gun store, and she *might* have decided that if she could carry the gun outside her house she might as well pack heat inside as well, and the local assailant *might* have traded in his no-good-stealin'-ways for a job at Mickey-Ds, and the ubiquitous "reduction in crime" *might* have somehow applied to this case...
 

$tinkle

Expert on blowing
Feb 12, 2003
14,591
5
in order to buy into your skepticism, we'd have to imagine the free market somehow doesn't affect gun ownership. that is, name for me another product of non-trivial cost which is legal to purchase & own, its intended use extremely restricted, yet sales are as high as though restrictions were not in place.

as for cause & effect, legality of gun ownership/use/carry has always occurred first. (or at least i'm unaware of any of our 50 states being ratified w/ the proviso of gun restrictions) it's only been roughly a century that ownership/use/carry has been put before the courts.

and yes, robberies != burglaries; for clarification, i'm speaking of armed home invasion, which has elements of both, and is relevant to this thread. sorry if you allowed for a fundamental change in theory based upon a difference with barely a distinction.

of course, if we were serious about reducing gun crime, we would mandate # of people / sq mile.
 

$tinkle

Expert on blowing
Feb 12, 2003
14,591
5
ok, i'll try another approach:

tweaker A plans on breaking into a house & score some cash for his next fix (we'll make the reasonable assumption this is just that case in this thread's story). tweaker A lives in a state which does not have ccw, which translates to fewer guns owned (less incentive to own if you can't carry)

tweaker B plans on breaking into a house & score some cash for his next fix. tweaker B lives in a state which does have ccw, which translates to more guns owned.

do you believe the chance for a home invasion is a coinflip, or does one tweaker have an obvious (to him) edge, & therefore is more inclined to invade?

do you believe that gun ownership is influenced by ccw laws?
do you believe this in turn correlates one way or another to home invasion crimes?
 

MikeD

Leader and Demogogue of the Ridemonkey Satinists
Oct 26, 2001
10,360
400
chez moi
I think people who would CCW, but can't, already own guns at home

Those who don't own guns when a CCW law is past aren't likely to rush out and buy one ASAP.

Don't get me wrong--I think CCW right-to-carry laws are almost a farce, considering we have a constitutional right to bear arms, but I also do think it's prudent to ensure someone's competence before they bring a ranged weapon into the public sector. I think the US should let more people carry, more of the time, but have far stricter requirements, proficiency-wise. I think most LEO shooting standards should be higher, too...but I don't think most LEO organizations can afford the ammo, training time, or facilities this would require.
 

manimal

Ociffer Tackleberry
Feb 27, 2002
7,214
14
Blindly running into cactus
So worth it get in a gun fight over $7 :rolleyes:

So you support the right of kids to go on rampages at school taking out their classmates for stealing their lunch money and what not then?
yeah, 'cause gun laws work so well to keep people who are willing to commit a robbery from getting guns.
evidence: palm beach FL; the city manager and sheriff denied that there is gang activity so they hire a local producer to film and edit the "community policing" strategy that proves there are no gangs.
this is part of the 2nd video in his installment which he has now sold a massive amount of copies. the first video was sent to city hall and showed the tourist area of the city being taken over with a mob fighting anyone and everyone. but the retarded sheriff made a public statement that they weren't a serious group because there was no gun play so they must be "just kids." this vid is the follow up to the sheriff's request :rolleyes:

yup, these folks will quiver in their shoes when we ban guns :rolleyes: hell, they're better armed than most of the cops.
 

syadasti

i heart mac
Apr 15, 2002
12,701
290
VT
holy crap dude.
there are people in our country who just need killing.
i'm not just stirring up ****: these people worship death, so put 'em on the altar.

just damn.
You have to be an equally opportunity paranoid gun nut. You are forgetting equally reprehensible or worse group besides gangs: KKK, Skinheads, Westboro Baptist Church, various rightwing extremist groups, corrupt LEOs, cults, mentally ill, mobs, etc. The walls are closing in on you, quick buy everyone a gun:shocked: