[dexterq20]

...to get rid of my Hayes brakes. (I can just see Brian and ViolentVolante grinning in ecstacy.) I have had so many little problems with my HFX-9 brakes that I'm finally calling it quits. Had to get a whole new lever and master cylinder assembly at Sea Otter, the reach adjustment screws never stay where I set them, and now my front brake has straight-up stopped working. And the brakes are only 11 months old. Jeebus.

So, for my dj/slalom hardtail, do I get Hope Mono Minis or Mono M4s? If I get Minis, I'll get 160mm rotors front and rear; if I get M4s, I'll get a 180mm rotor in front and a 160mm rotor in the rear. Should I save weight and money and go with the Minis, or go all-out and buy the M4s? (Just be aware that I'm not riding a ton of DH on this bike, and I also do not have a thru-axle fork.) Right now I'm leaning towards the Minis, but I wanna hear what everyone else thinks.

 

[dropmachine]

Mine rear, M4 front. Can't lose with that. =)

 

[dexterq20]

Originally posted by dropmachine.com
Mine rear, M4 front. Can't lose with that. =)

Ummmm.... was that sarcastic or serious? Cuz that doesn't sound like a real great idea.

 

[Dirty]

why not?

 

[dexterq20]

Originally posted by Dirty
why not?

Well.... front brake is already stronger than rear. With a bigger rotor in front, it's even more powerful. With an extra pair of pistons in front in addition to a bigger rotor, don't you think that would feel a little unbalanced compared to a smaller rotor and fewer pistons in the rear?

 

[DßR]

OK, the 9s are total crap obviously - but you could save yourself a HUGE chunk of change (and a lot of hassle) if you just got a set of Hayes Mag levers/master cylinders. You'll get actual quality Hayes stuff instead of this "new crap" they're foisting on everybody, and if you ever change forks you won't need to buy a whole new caliper..... just something to think about.

Hayes makes absolute top quality stuff - just not in the hfx9.

 

[Spunger]

Dex...I picked up a OEM set from pricepoint as a backup for $100. Wasn't bad for a HFX-Mag brake with 8" rotor. I couldn't pass as trying to buy replacement parts for things can get expensive. I figured for $100 I have a working brake that if I bust a master cylinder or screw up a caliper I have a working part in my hands.

I have HFX-Mag's on both my bikes. Not one single problem. I had bleeding issues but I got it strightened out. It was MY fault, not the brakes fault.

I agree, Hayes brakes are great performers. You can find their parts almost anywhere. Here in Santa Barbara there's a few different shops that have odd-ball parts. Good luck finding Hope spare parts. Hayes come stock on just about every brand (either that or Avid mechanicals or Shimano hydro's).

I am not to say that Hope's aren't good but think about it before you drop like $350 on new brakes. You need spare parts sooner or later. Hayes HFX-Mag's are probably the most used brake out there, plenty of support and spare parts.

HFX-9's are crap. You hear nothing but problems with that model but HFX-Mag's there's almost none. They have their problems but just about all are easy to fix.

Just given ya some more info there about Hayes, I agree though go HFX-Mag's and you're set.

 

[dexterq20]

DßR and Spunger- you guys rule. That is an awesome idea. I think I'll just buy a set of the HFX-Mag master cylinder/levers and install those on my system. The HFX-9 calipers are the same as the new HFX-Mag calipers, aren't they? Thanks for the idea, cuz that's a helluva lot cheaper than buying a whole new set of imported brakes.

 

[jmvar]

TESTIMONIAL

disclaimer: don't go out and do this...............last year I bought a bike used that came with hayes mag brakes, jaguar stainless lines, and razor rock levers. I had the bike in my garage upside down so it was resting on the handlebars and the seat. There was another car in the garage so I thought my dad would not be stubborn enough to try and squeeze his big arsed volvo 940 into that tight spot. well he did, in the process he parked his rear wheel perfectly on the brake lever of my bike and partially on the master cylinder. the lever sat compressed completely to the handle bar for atleast 30 hours.

when I noticed I drove the car off my lever and pumped the brake a couple of times to get the feeling back. the brakes where fine!!!!!!!!!! I changed the handle bar on the bike for good measure and to this day I am still riding those same brakes.

granted the hayes stock levers would have pretzled completely but I think any other master cylinder would have exploded and/or deformed. the alloy of the master cylinder was just fine, these things are so strong!!!!!!!!

These are the old school alloy MCs....

 

[profro]

I have a set of Mags that have seen service since 1998, I think. I got them from a friend that got them from another friend and they have been bomb proof. I love Mags.

 

[mental]

I'll chime in here with my own thoughts on brakes.

Let me preface it by saying, in all my years of riding, I've never seen a place that tests brakes like Golden BC - more specifically Mount 7. Over 4500 feet of sphincter clenching descents that will easily burn a set of the best brake pads in 2 weekends or less. This "testing" is further exacerbated by the fact most of us who ride Mt 7 are mere mortals who use their brakes a whole lot more than your "average" World Cup racer. Add to that many of us also weigh well over 200lbs, you've got a pretty good idea of what works and what doesn't.

Of all the brakes I've seen (this includes Hope, Magura, Alligator, Formula and Hayes) none come close to Hayes in terms of performance, durability and parts availability. Granted, the Hope M4's modulate better and the Magura Gustavs had gobs of power, but none (did I mention none?) come close when you factor in long term durability. As a general rule, the only time Hayes stop working is after the hose has somehow been ripped off/punctured or the master cylinder was smashed into pieces by close encounters with some immovable object. That was usually fixed up by a quick trip to the bike shop. Try finding parts for your blinging new 6-pots (which I'll admit I lust after) in Butt-fack Idaho or Hempstar BC. In Western Canada at least, Hayes parts are far easier to find than the competition. Oh yeah, I've got more than a few friends (one who weighs well over 260lbs) still using their 4 year old Hayes without a worry.

I hate road trips cut short because you couldn't find parts in that sweet little riding town and you'd already used your spares the previous weekend.

That being said, when I refer to Hayes, I'm speaking of course about the HFX-Mags, not the inferior HFX-9's.

 

[Fulton]

Originally posted by dexterq20
With an extra pair of pistons in front in addition to a bigger rotor, don't you think that would feel a little unbalanced compared to a smaller rotor and fewer pistons in the rear?

extra pistons don't add strength, they increase modulation. I haven't ridden the new mono series brakes, but I couldn't really tell the difference between my m4's, and my buddy mini's. If I was gonna build a race bike, I'd go for mono mini's with a big ass rotor.

 

[MikeD]

If you want Hopes, get the Minis for that bike. If you want to stick with Hayes, do as they've been saying. Both systems work well. However, there's a case for sticking with what you know and what you might have spare parts for as well. There's also joy in buying new bling-bling CNC'd brakes.

However, the "Hayes parts availability factor" part of the argument is bunk. NO bike shop in bum-fack ANYWHERE will carry disc brake parts or pads for any brand, and even big shops here in So Cal typically carry pads (edit: and brakelines in some shops) only and need to order any replacement parts. Parts are readily available from Hope USA by mail and they often UPS them on the day you order them.

You just need to bring some extra parts along wherever you go...and this goes for Hayes as well. It's a fact of using hydros. If you want easy replacement of brakelines in backwoods Idaho, you'd better run cable discs (and if you break a caliper, you're still screwed.)

MD

 

[mental]

MikeD:

Hate to break it to you, but here in Western Canada, Hayes parts (damn near all of them with the exception of perhaps master cylinders) are available in every bike shop where there's riding to be found.

Golden - check
Revelstoke - check
Williams Lake - check
Fernie - check
Nelson - check
Rossland - check
Squamish - check

Many of these towns have populations that float between 2000 and 10000 people and Hayes parts are easily found locally. That can't be said for Hope (which I too lust after and ride on my hardtail) Magura et al.

My Hayes have never left me stranded, I can't say that for any other brand! It should be said here I have no big descent experience with Avid's Juicy 7's - they may just rule for all I know.

 

[Spunger]

I only speak to help Dex because we are from the same city. I know one worker at Bike Bob's in Goleta that runs Hope and swears by them. That is it though. I don't know anyone else in the town that runs Hope. Most bikes again will have Avid, Shimano, or Hayes brakes on their bikes. I know the shops here have small parts etc.....but I've made it a job for myself to pick up a spare hose, compression ferrele etc....so I have them incase the shops dont. I have no doubts I could find a hayes part here in town.

Hope.........the ONLY place I've seen Hope brakes for sale and pads/line for was at Supergo Ventura. The Mono6's look sooooooooooooooo sweet. Jesus they just look great and I bet they preform the same, but like everyone is saying for the price of 1 Hope brake you could get front + rear setup in the HFX-Mags. Look around though because Hayes parts can be a pain.

Here's a good example. Balleracing.com which has loads of small parts for a decent price wants $90 for a complete lever/master cylinder assembly. That is just the going rate. A caliper is $65 I think. At either point you are better off just buying a $109 HFX-Mag from a internet mail order. I figure the time it takes to make the new one work is not a big deal. Might have to cut the line to shorten, bleed, done.

 

[Jeremy R]

Another vote for just upgrading to the Mag levers/MC.
I just put a new set of Hayes Mags on my DH bike, and it is amazing how well they work. I had the old ones on there, and Hayes really did improve the lever feel. (I don't know what model year that they did this, but my '04 feels great.

 

[dexterq20]

Originally posted by Spunger
I know one worker at Bike Bob's in Goleta that runs Hope and swears by them. That is it though. I don't know anyone else in the town that runs Hope.

Are you talking about Phil? Cuz now he's using XT hydro discs on his hardtail (since he sold his DH bike). Li'l Dave runs Hopes on his Orange 222, so Phil isn't the only one in Santa Barbara.

I'm just gonna go the Hayes Mag route though. So much less expensive than a whole new Hope setup. Thanks for the help, guys.

 

[MikeD]

Well, I've unfortunately never been to Canada, eastern or western...but I know our shops here don't carry squat for spare parts, and neither do shops anywhere else I've been in the US (also unfortunately).

And since most of us don't live in BC, and/or we have to travel to ride, often to remote places, I don't think it's wise to go anywhere without a stock of at least a few common spare parts of whatever brand in the toolbox...

In any case, I like to fix my brakes when I get back to the shuttle truck, and not end the ride to drive to a shop to buy parts.

MD

 

[mental]

I couldn't agree more Mike. In addition to a toolbox full of spares, I always bring aloing a spare bike just in case something goes awry.

Not everyone has that luxury and it's nice to know you've got a fighting chance of finding what you need at the LBS.

I'm certainly not bagging on Hope, like I said before, they're great brakes that modulate well and are second to none in the "bling department". I just find it difficult to recommend something that not only costs more but doesn't work as well for nearly as long.

 

[MikeD]

And you'll never find me bagging on Hayes [Mags], either. They're a solid product.

(Well, except for the first time I set them up...had me a little frustrated for a minute learning the syringe bleed process...but I'm over that now. In fact, I love the syringe bleed...)

 

[mental]

Ah yes, the syringe bleed. Now there's a tool that always travels with me!

Too many close encounters with those damn immovable objects.

 

[Echo]

Originally posted by dexterq20
the reach adjustment screws never stay where I set them

Just last night I finally realized those f*cking things must be moving by themselves. For the longest time I thought one of my riding group was messing with them

 

[MMcG]

Originally posted by Echo
Just last night I finally realized those f*cking things must be moving by themselves. For the longest time I thought one of my riding group was messing with them

My friggin rear screw never stays put.......focking annoying as schit!

 

[Brian HCM#1]

I love hearing news like this, If its for some DH, go with the Minis 180 front 160 rear.

 

[dexterq20]

Originally posted by Brian HCM#1
I love hearing news like this

Sorry to break it to ya Brian, but DßR and Spunger's logic makes too much sense in this situation. Looks like I'll just be exchanging the HFX-9 levers/master cylinders for the HFX-Mag parts. Much less expensive than buying a new Hope setup.

Now I need to put something relating to Hayes in my signature...

 

[greenreese]

Originally posted by Echo
Just last night I finally realized those f*cking things must be moving by themselves. For the longest time I thought one of my riding group was messing with them

Mine did that. Pull it apart and put some loc-tite on the screw. Just make sure you don't get any on the little pivot.

-dAn

 

[Brian HCM#1]

Originally posted by dexterq20
Sorry to break it to ya Brian, but DßR and Spunger's logic makes too much sense in this situation. Looks like I'll just be exchanging the HFX-9 levers/master cylinders for the HFX-Mag parts. Much less expensive than buying a new Hope setup.

Now I need to put something relating to Hayes in my signature...

How about..................... I know Hayes sucks but DßR and Spunger's logic makes too much sense in this situation

 

[Curb Hucker]

Originally posted by Brian HCM#1
How about..................... I know Hayes sucks but DßR and Spunger's logic makes too much sense in this situation that im not going to conform to their logic, and buy hopes