[bjanga]

Amen. Bring forth the brotherhood of hardtail disciples.

 

[BurlyShirley]

Now Im thinking about buying a Cove Hanjob

 

[Bicyclist]

Just buy a handjob instead.

 

[bjanga]

Just buy a handjob instead.

steel corrodes anyways

 

[Dirtbike]

The "bite point" knob (as I like to call it) rotates the piston assembly inside the lever which moves in and out of the lever. It turns the reach adjustment screw at the same time, but the reach does not change because the travel at which the piston assembly moves at the same rate as the threads on the reach adjustment.

 

[maxyedor]

You're an idiot. Don't post BS if you don't know what you're talking about.

Both have a reach adjuster (even a walmart bike has that), but the red knob is a contact point. Pull the lever back, and when you want it to contact the brakes, thats where it starts to resist. You can move that in and out.

Again, you're full of crap. On a long descent, when you're constantly on the brakes, both systems will wear and not always automatically return itself. Sure, it will contact, but where? Again, if you DH (perhaps you don't), moving that contact point around is key.... better than pumping a system that may result in a crash.

Why thank you for the wonderfull compliment!


What you are essentially saying is that they do self adjust(as I stated) until they get hot and start to fade. At wich point on most brakes you give them a quick couple of pumps and keep riding. If I understand you correctly with the J7s you dial that red knob(the one that usually breaks in a crash, yes I used to be a shop wrench and had to replace countless red knobs) and get the same result as when you pump them? I do DH, not alot but I do, and I would much rather give my brakes a quick pump, than take my hand off the bar to fiddle with a knob. That sounds unsafe! I also try not to drag my brakes as that creats extr heat, as oposed to simply aplying them a little harder when you really need them, and allowing them to cool inbetween aplicatios. Less heat= less fade. Personally I feel a better option is to get a brake that is designed to take the heat of DH runs. This involves mineral oil, for it's better heat transfer ability than DOT, larger resivoir, caliper design to optimize airflow, larger rotor to increase cooling and braking power, and pad material plays a huge role. Prime examples of this are the Shimano and Magura brakes for the mineral oil, Hope m4s and m6s along with Magura Louise FRs and Gustaves for their large high volume resivoirs and great caliper design. Avid uses a high friction high heat pad compound that stops well, but also gets very hot. They formulated this pad when they only made mech. discs and heat wasn't an issue, the EBC pads will make your Avid's run cooler and still stop just as well.

If you switch wheels and get some rotor rub it is becasue the caliper is off center. If you move the pads out so it doesn't rub, you haven't solved anything, you still end up bending the rotor sidways under braking and causing a squeal. Also because you adjusted the pads out to prevent rotor rub there is a bigger gap and thus there technicaly should be a longer lever throw, unless the J7s can alter the laws of hydraulic engineering and I don't know about it.

I also never said that the J5s didn't have a reach adjuster, nor did I ever say that the red knob was the reach adjuster on the J7

I think this adressed all the reasons that you called me an idiot for. If you have any other complaints about my OPINION, that I gave when asked please feel free to ask nicly and I'll explain myself. If you run the J7 and like that knob, woohoo for you, all I'm saying is that in my experience it seems rather pointless. Also you don't mention what brakes you have tried besides the J7, no mention of ever directly comparing them to the J5 or Hope, Shimano, Magura, Hayes, or Formula. Not sure why your so pissy about my opinion, but if I offended you in any way I'm sorry. Also why are the J5s "Bogus" as you put it, you didn't atempt to explain that coment, or were you just posting BS?

FYI I ride Magura Louise FRs on my DH bike and Louise XCs on my xc bike. They stop just as well as Avids do and have never faded on me. I also have never used more than 1 finger to brake with. They are mineral oil based, and being a non toxic fluid is a big plus for me. Also it doesn't strip paint like DOT fluid can. I have also riden, on a trail not a parking lot, every brake I've mentioned in this post. As always this is my opinion and I still think BS would do better with J5s and $80 in his pocket, but the best advice is to ride both, and then make up your mind.

 

[OGRipper]

Maxydor, calling you an idiot was uncalled for, but you were also not being very helpful when you said "as far as I can tell" the red knob does nothing. That statement shows a lack of understanding and riding (not wrenching) experience with these brakes.

The contact point is a real feature, different from reach adjustment, and I like it. For years people complained that hydro brakes lack adjustment. Avid delivered something not offered by anyone else (until, I guess, the El Camino), and then people say it's pointless.

Is a DHX 5 worth the extra money over a 3? Is a 5th element worth more than one without the adjustments? Is four way adjustable fork worth more than one that comes with factory settings only? It is up to the buyer to decide, but personally I like being able to adjust the stuff on my bike.

The horse is dead. Long live the horse!!

 

[BurlyShirley]

Avid delivered something not offered by anyone else (until, I guess, the El Camino), and then people say it's pointless.

Wait, so its the same stupid thing as teh el caming "power" knob?

The first day I had those brakes I just turned it to full power and left it there. Why would I want less power?

 

[OGRipper]

Wait, so its the same stupid thing as teh el caming "power" knob?

The first day I had those brakes I just turned it to full power and left it there. Why would I want less power?

I've never used the El Camino but no, I don't think it's the same, I was just using it as an example of how brake makers are offering more adjustability.

For the last time: The reach adjustment lets you set the starting point of the lever throw. The red knob lets you set how much throw you have from that starting point to the point when the pads hit the rotor.

If you are familiar with avid cable brakes, it may help to think of the red knob as doing what the red dials do on avid cable brake calipers - they adjust the pad location, without changing the reach - except on the hydros the reb knob adjusts both pads at once.

I am done with this. Hope you like your brakes, whatever you get.

 

[Nick]

BS:
I've ridden on Shimano XT 4-piston brakes for years. They are the only hydraulic brake I've ever owned. 110% loved them, never a problem, aint' broke don't fix 'em brake set.

For no good reason at all I tried Juicy 5s ... and love them more. I have a set on my f/s bike and just ordered another set for my hardtail. A riding bud has the 7s and I had an opportunity to twiddle with the contact knob and decided that it just wasn't for me. Avid seems to have come in with a perfect combo of modulation and power.

FWIW, my L/R levers feel virtually identical. Also, I got both pairs on eBay damn cheap. 1 set was an OE takeoff, the set coming is boxed. Averaged price = BTI catalog cost.

Cheers.

 

[maxyedor]

you were also not being very helpful when you said "as far as I can tell" the red knob does nothing. That statement shows a lack of understanding and riding (not wrenching) experience with these brakes.

Sorry perhaps I should have explained why I did not see the exact purpose of the red knob. I have riden the J7s quite a bit and honestly can't tell the difference, from one extreem to another with that knob.

 

[brungeman]

I call BS here. Either you don't or haven't put long rides heading in the down hill position. The red knob is key, and the 5's are bogus. Get the 7's.

To begin with, you can always adjust the lever to exactly where you need contact. As pads wear, you can adjust the contact point. During long DH's, you will find that the levers will start to engage closer to the bars... turn the knob, and you're free.

Switch to a new wheel set... adjust the knob for new discs, and you're off.

Don't think that contact point is key? well, you're probably using two fingers for breaking... if thats the case, steet straight to the hospital. contact points closer to the handle bar means more control, one finger breaking means even MORE control.

The avid Juicy 7's are simply the best on the market... unless you don't take riding seriously.

Yep I am probably feeding Burly a line of BS...

IN MY EXPERIENCE with the TWO OF THEM I noticed no difference in braking and feel. THEY BOTH WORK GREAT... I rode the 7's for 3-4 months a total of maybe 300 miles in ugly winter conditions, but if you are trying to call me out on riding... yes we probably don't have 3mile "downhills" like you in CO.

We have very technical riding, and as far as bar control and how many fingers on the levers..... it all depends on how much arm pump I am feeling! if I need to drop to 2 fingers on the levers, I know I should probably start taking it easy.

BUT I REITERATE....... I LIKE THE 5's on my 575 as much as I liked the 7's!

and your right I probably don't take riding seriously! after all I am not getting paid to ride, I am just out having fun like the majority of the other folks on the monkey

 

[Changleen]

Get XTs or Saints for that sort of bike anyway Shirl, trust me. As good or better and way less hassle. And you know exactly what all the bits do

 

[ecbmxer]

I know this is an old thread. But does anybody know if you can manually adjust the pad contact point on the Juicy 5's? My front brake hits way sooner than the rear and its just kinda annoying.

 

[Dirtbike]

Take out the front wheel and push the pistons in a little bit.

 

[OGRipper]

I know this is an old thread. But does anybody know if you can manually adjust the pad contact point on the Juicy 5's? My front brake hits way sooner than the rear and its just kinda annoying.

No you can't...that's what the red knob is for on the 7's.

But check your reach adjustments and maybe bleed your rear brake. "Way sooner" makes it sound like something is off.

 

[Dirtbike]

Alot of people are under the impression that the red knob actually moves the pads. It doesnt. The knob adjusts the amount of "dead space" the lever travels before it starts to push fluid.

 

[narlus]

since getting the 'bite' point of Hayes is a pain in the butt (mainly trial and error), and extremely important to me, i think juicy 7s are in my future.