Hang out for a bit. There are a few select morons who like to prostelitize this idea. whoa dude, lets get baked and ride our bikes down a hil!stiksandstones said:
justin havahardtimespellin on IH/madcatz?
- Thread starter c2001
- Start date
I know I'm jumpin' in this thread a little late....As for the IH/Madcatz Justin signing I have mixed feelings about that. I heard that they are going to play on his dual citizenship for the us nationals, which I and I'm sure a lot of other people aren't to happy about. I think he should pick a country and race for them, not race for Australia at worlds and then show up at the us nationals....I dunno maybe he's pushing the us guys, but I think it's pretty $hitty....please add to this I want to know if I'm the only one on these boards that feels this way.
Nate, glad you got the thread back on track...
Yeah, I hear from a few people they are irritated that Justin does the dual citizen thing, but at the end of the day, no one cares.
As I have said to all the USA DHers over the years "quit your bitchin' and just pick up the pace and smoke a foreigner" We (USA) have figured it out in 4X (Lopes, Carter and King) so lets figure it out in the DH then you wont care what country someone is from, you will just be racing for the win!
Yeah, I hear from a few people they are irritated that Justin does the dual citizen thing, but at the end of the day, no one cares.
As I have said to all the USA DHers over the years "quit your bitchin' and just pick up the pace and smoke a foreigner" We (USA) have figured it out in 4X (Lopes, Carter and King) so lets figure it out in the DH then you wont care what country someone is from, you will just be racing for the win!
Some programs can only afford so much, not everyone was fortunate enough to have one of the largest bike companies as a sponsor. When you figure in all of the costs it does get expensive. And whats wrong with justin using his dual citizenship? Do you really want a national champion thats fast but not fast enough to compete with the big boys?
as a matter of fact I do. See pro skiing. THey kept dumping tons of money into the US Ski program and on pro ski racers and now we have Bodie Miller. We got our huevos fried for several years there, but had the ski industry taken the approach that you suggest, there would be no opportunity for Bodie. If you invest, time, effort and focus, you can develop a top talent. The problem is that the companies aren't signing US talent to extended contracts that allow them to work within a certain framework for a signifigant framework before making substantial gains. Free agency in cycling I feel has a negative impact on a racer's development. Changes in structure of your support group every 1-2 seasons are drastic and consistency is a big key.
Gracia made his most dramatic impact on the circuit in his 3rd year with Cannondale. Peat skills began to peak in his 3rd year with GT and he's followed a similar trend on Orange. Even Rennie emerged fully in his final year with Yeti.
It's not a given formula for success, but my argument has valid merits. I think if Rennie had stuck with IH/Mad Catz for a 3rd year, he would have had the most monstrous year imaginable.
Gracia made his most dramatic impact on the circuit in his 3rd year with Cannondale. Peat skills began to peak in his 3rd year with GT and he's followed a similar trend on Orange. Even Rennie emerged fully in his final year with Yeti.
It's not a given formula for success, but my argument has valid merits. I think if Rennie had stuck with IH/Mad Catz for a 3rd year, he would have had the most monstrous year imaginable.
the consistency thing is super intriguing bizutch...i know it's not a blanket statement, but very interesting to think about.
thanks bro. I would write a book about it but as soon as somebody saw my name on it, it would just get tossed in the can next to the Shimano owner's manuals.©2001 said:
That is an interesting argument for sure. I agree with many points of it. But there are some pretty big flaws in it. Especially comparing it with skiing. Unfortunately the way that biking is set up at this point there is no way to realistically compare the two. The way that the US Ski team is set up is pretty damn complicated but because of the way it changed 6-7 years ago is the sole reason for the current success in US Skiing. It all comes down to the development programs and the top regional and local ski clubs to make the kids good at a young age. If anyone wants to hear more about it I would be happy to write some more in depth information.
I do tend to agree with you on the comfort thing, with being on the same bike, same program for several consecutive years deffinately would help. Its not a how it happens all the time but it does show a pretty good trend that shows it certainly helps.
I do tend to agree with you on the comfort thing, with being on the same bike, same program for several consecutive years deffinately would help. Its not a how it happens all the time but it does show a pretty good trend that shows it certainly helps.
well that someone was me.stiksandstones said:
i have my personal opinion about you as well craig. you're a tool.
i still can't comprehend how COOL people think they are for dissing smokers. it's a personal choice,so stay out of their lives. you almost seem as cool as people who brag about how much they DO smoke!
sure,i agree partly with you on the fact that MTBing would be light years ahead without it,but it would have taken a little while longer to at least originate was it not for marijuana.
Yeah great, another stikman is a tool quote-so fresh-so new-so original and with the usual validity as well...Beat it.Racer-X said:
I dont care that you or anyone smokes weed or think it's cool...party on, just don't tell me the sport would be in a worse place without pot, that's assanine! And that, my lame friend, is all I said.
Man, Justin havinahardtimespellin is getting major miles here...IH/MC is already getting their mileage from him and the season has not even begun!
Bizutch, I have thought the same before as well, but my theory always gets punished when someone gets on a new team and has a better year...sounds like you are saying the consistency of a program works too, I know our old mongoose program with Lopes and Donovan 95-98 worked well, even though they never rode the same bike season after season-the program was the same (same staff=me, same jersey name).
Recent disputes to the consistency theory are Minnaar on Honda, When Nico went to his own program, Anne Caro riding for commencal (she still is the fastest chick), Lopes when he left Cdale for GT...but those are just a few, we can name more people to ride well after being on a team for a while....
anyway, just chatter
Recent disputes to the consistency theory are Minnaar on Honda, When Nico went to his own program, Anne Caro riding for commencal (she still is the fastest chick), Lopes when he left Cdale for GT...but those are just a few, we can name more people to ride well after being on a team for a while....
anyway, just chatter
sorry to burst your bubble,but i won't be going anywhere until the RM mods kick me off.stiksandstones said:
i am actually (or was) a very up-to-date reader of your website,i found it very full or information being the pro- and bike-whore i am.
i definitely don't consider myself lame,in fact i consider myself pretty mature and well-rounded (ESPECIALLY compared to the other readers of this site that are my age) and if we met,i doubt you would either.calling you a tool was my reaction from your previous statement,not a judgement of your personality.
when you show me where i stated that "the sport would be a WORSE place without pot",i will agree with you.until then,i suggest you retract that.
in closing,i'd like you to know that i do have respect for you and what you do,not to mention envy,and i have gained a good bit of knowledge from reading your site and writings in magazines.i'm not saying this because i'm cowering from this argument either,to let you know.i am simply letting you know the full truth.
don't mistake my kindness for weakness. truce?
"not to hijack this thread again,but mountain biking as a general whole wouldn't be where it was if it wasn't for marijuana."
Is what you said...statement like that just leads me to beleive what I typed earlier-sorry if I was confused.
Anyway, its all good...
In other Justin news (and a shameless self promotion) did I tell you I gave him $100 at mammoth out of my pocket for being the first guy to NOT make the podium-and when I did do that I summoned the announcer to ask the 50 or so fans at the finish to donate some more coin for the prize-purse-less race...not ONE person came forward to donate some money...atleast now Justin wont be struggling to get to a race!
Now, about this Bryn news...a little bird told me that he is riding for .....................
Is what you said...statement like that just leads me to beleive what I typed earlier-sorry if I was confused.
Anyway, its all good...
In other Justin news (and a shameless self promotion) did I tell you I gave him $100 at mammoth out of my pocket for being the first guy to NOT make the podium-and when I did do that I summoned the announcer to ask the 50 or so fans at the finish to donate some more coin for the prize-purse-less race...not ONE person came forward to donate some money...atleast now Justin wont be struggling to get to a race!
Now, about this Bryn news...a little bird told me that he is riding for .....................
actually, rather than giving me exceptions to the rule, you gave me a list of some more really good examples of my theory.stiksandstones said:
Minnaar came to prominance courtesy of a strong, coordinated and well structured Global Racing system and by the end of his tenure with them, he was starting to really peak and his progression while there was tremendous. If anything, he went from a developmental program into the ULTIMATE winning machine known as Honda. (They're famous for turning mediocre pro motocrossers into dominant monsters...i.e. the term Big Red Machine). Had he not had the opportunity with Global , we might never have heard of him.
Nico and Anne Caro are evidence of the same. Nico developed in the GT program and blossomed, struggled a little with injury when he jumped to Sunn, but once in their system dominated again. When he left SUNN, not much about the structure around him changed. He took his mechanic, frame designer and personal trainer and coach with him. However, with these two I credit the discipline and consistent backing of the French cycling federation more so than GT or Sunn.
In terms of Lopes and Leigh, they were perfect examples. The longer they were together with you, the more dominant they became. In regards to Lopes upon leaving Cannondale, even you've said before that his equipment...or lack thereof...at Cannondale had an effect on his performance more than the people or the organization.
I seem to recall lots of issues with having to be a guinea pig for crappy, exploding forks, ridiculously designed frames, crappy Continental tires not intended for the type of riding, stupid Coda brakes that didn't work that even magazine editors slammed, and being handed a bike he'd never ridden 3-4 weeks before the start of the DH season. I can't help but blame Cannondale for Lopes dropping out of DH racing. I know he's been quoted as saying that he's not willing to take the risks to win in DH now that the margin of error is so slim now, but I honestly can't help but think it's something else. Like he has nightmares of grabbing a set of Coda brakes at 30+mph and feeling them fade...then watching his fork barf on the rotor for good measure[cut to scene of Lopes waking up in cold sweat]
Not saying he's scared of DH...saying that Cannondale's have scarred him for life. 
neaky:
I got a madcatz steering wheel for GT3, it was a POS and I took it back.Full Trucker said:
Not to mention the structure of Team Honda was put together by the same person as the Global Team. Those two teams showed many similarities. He even brought his mechanic from Global and previous years back with him. But he did have alot of succes (winning the World Championships) with his one year on Haro.bizutch said:
Hey Bizutch, yeah, my post was in a haze-just got back from a ride and I am so UNFIT I was screwed.
Anyway...In regards to lopes, he said in a MBA interview that cannondale is a huge reason for his DH demise, in fact, the former manager sat him down and told him to "STOP RACING DH...you are never gonna win on this product, just focus on slalom/4x/dual domination" which he did-and then some. He still loves to ride and race DH, but I think if you miss a beat with intl. DH comp for a year, let alone a few years there is a slim chance of being a winner again, in a world cup anyway. He is still so very fast on a DH bike, but its more of a fun fast, if that makes any sense...when you got mad skills like that they just dont disappear, but the desire to pin it and win it is always possible. My wife is a perfect example of skills, when she won that sea otter overall she had not ridden her bike in 6 months, no lie. (alright, I will stop with the lopes/donovan talk....cant get it out of my blood, haha)
Sam Hill must know this consistency thing too, when I tried to get him on GT last year, he was real stoked to be offered, and wanted to come aboard, but he said he liked his bike and his program and didnt wanna change things up just yet...said he fealt like the underdog and that being on GT might change that. He made a smart move.
I was more thinking we were talkin about bikes per say, but I now realize we are talking about consistency of program which is agreed.
Anyway...In regards to lopes, he said in a MBA interview that cannondale is a huge reason for his DH demise, in fact, the former manager sat him down and told him to "STOP RACING DH...you are never gonna win on this product, just focus on slalom/4x/dual domination" which he did-and then some. He still loves to ride and race DH, but I think if you miss a beat with intl. DH comp for a year, let alone a few years there is a slim chance of being a winner again, in a world cup anyway. He is still so very fast on a DH bike, but its more of a fun fast, if that makes any sense...when you got mad skills like that they just dont disappear, but the desire to pin it and win it is always possible. My wife is a perfect example of skills, when she won that sea otter overall she had not ridden her bike in 6 months, no lie. (alright, I will stop with the lopes/donovan talk....cant get it out of my blood, haha)
Sam Hill must know this consistency thing too, when I tried to get him on GT last year, he was real stoked to be offered, and wanted to come aboard, but he said he liked his bike and his program and didnt wanna change things up just yet...said he fealt like the underdog and that being on GT might change that. He made a smart move.
I was more thinking we were talkin about bikes per say, but I now realize we are talking about consistency of program which is agreed.
Cannondale has made some strange business decission over the years. Its impressive that they are still a big company.
I think that would be a pretty major factor in why they went from being arguably one of the biggest bicycle manufacturers in the world to going bankrupt in just a few short years of those strange bussiness decisions.CBJ said:
heikkihall said:
Actually the Bicycle division was turning a profit when they went backrupt, it was the motor side of the company that killed them.
C-dale has always liked being different. On some things it's worked on others it hasen't. Most of the really silly stuff luckily they only burdened the race team with and didn't sell.