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Karpiel Army barrel problem

seismic

seismic

Turbo Monkey
Dec 22, 2003
3,254
0
South East Asia
After doing some riding the last couple of weeks, the top barrel where the rear shock is mounted has begun to turn when doing drops. I have not had this problem before, - I took it apart, cleaned them 100%, - no grease, - put it together and tightend the bolts quite hard......it worked in the beginning, but now they are beginning to move again.

Any ideas (good ideas) on how to make them sit still, - and still I have to be able to use them for adjustment, so no welding here please. :D
 
ChrisRobin

ChrisRobin

Turbo Monkey
Jan 30, 2002
3,411
212
Vancouver
Lock tite??

I'm sure you already know this, but there was someone who was making a steel linkage to replace the aluminum one. I think he had different holes for the different adjustments.
 
Curb Hucker

Curb Hucker

I am an idiot
Feb 4, 2004
3,661
0
Sleeping in my Kenworth
ChrisRobin said:
Lock tite??

I'm sure you already know this, but there was someone who was making a steel linkage to replace the aluminum one. I think he had different holes for the different adjustments.
Click to expand...
He's talking about the top adjuster in the seattube area, not the link plate.

Seismic, I dont know what to tell ya man, a friend who has an army had this same problem occur, and after countless attempts at a fix he gave up. He used some high strength steel epoxy on the adjuster and loctite on the clamp bolt, it hasnt slipped since, but cant be adjusted
 
seismic

seismic

Turbo Monkey
Dec 22, 2003
3,254
0
South East Asia
Well, - he dosent. Because it is me. The problem is not the lower linkage, but the upper barrels in the frame. But, yes, - locktite might be an idea.....
 
Brian HCM#1

Brian HCM#1

Don’t feed the troll
Sep 7, 2001
32,289
395
Bay Area, California
You can make a soda can shim. Jan started to make a little larger barrels for this reason on the later frames. If you can find who machined them, (Curb hucker or Low_b) may have an idea to who machined them and can make them. Or try emailing Risse, they may be able to machine some new ones. Another option, you can use a 9.5" Avy i-2-i and that rotates the barrel up to the top and will prevent in from moving.
 
seismic

seismic

Turbo Monkey
Dec 22, 2003
3,254
0
South East Asia
Yeah...it would be nice just to have kind of a stop-screw....simple and good solution.

Brian: Yeah...the longer eyetoeye stroke would deal with the problem. Also...bigger barrels...guess it is difficult to get now.....

thanks for the ideas, guys !!
 
Brian HCM#1

Brian HCM#1

Don’t feed the troll
Sep 7, 2001
32,289
395
Bay Area, California
seismic said:
Yeah...it would be nice just to have kind of a stop-screw....simple and good solution.

Brian: Yeah...the longer eyetoeye stroke would deal with the problem. Also...bigger barrels...guess it is difficult to get now.....

thanks for the ideas, guys !!
Click to expand...
Here is a pic of the extended eyelet w/rebound adjuster. It may just be a quick swap from your original one to extend the shock



and a regular one



Craig is close this week, but could be the quick cheap fix.
 
kidwoo

kidwoo

Artisanal Tweet Curator
Aug 25, 2003
42,149
13,358
Squirtin ketchup n' mustard on charred flesh
Try to stick the mounting hole in either the closest or farthest from the the linkage plates. That way the shock is driving at a right angle at the barrel and not putting any rotational force on it. I had a 9.5 romic on mine so it was easy to keep it at the farthest position. Sanding off any paint in the frame helps to get a good interface between the parts if it hasn't already been done.
 
K

Karpieldisco

Chimp
Mar 24, 2002
64
0
Abingdon, MD
seismic said:
After doing some riding the last couple of weeks, the top barrel where the rear shock is mounted has begun to turn when doing drops. I have not had this problem before, - I took it apart, cleaned them 100%, - no grease, - put it together and tightend the bolts quite hard......it worked in the beginning, but now they are beginning to move again.

Any ideas (good ideas) on how to make them sit still, - and still I have to be able to use them for adjustment, so no welding here please. :D
Click to expand...
Just a thought-- I have a Disco- I have not had this problem - yet, but what about swapping the barrels from side to side.. Just a cheap easy thought... Hope you find fix.. when you do please post it.. Thanks
 
DHS

DHS

Friendly Neighborhood Pool Boy
Apr 23, 2002
5,094
0
Sand, CA
seismic said:
After doing some riding the last couple of weeks, the top barrel where the rear shock is mounted has begun to turn when doing drops. I have not had this problem before, - I took it apart, cleaned them 100%, - no grease, - put it together and tightend the bolts quite hard......it worked in the beginning, but now they are beginning to move again.

Any ideas (good ideas) on how to make them sit still, - and still I have to be able to use them for adjustment, so no welding here please. :D
Click to expand...
what year is your Army?
 
DHS

DHS

Friendly Neighborhood Pool Boy
Apr 23, 2002
5,094
0
Sand, CA
gah, it'll be built up tuesday night, and i will be riding it in the snow@!
i dont have a digi camera, but i'll wear my helmet cam when i ride...heh
 
Five

Five

Turbo Monkey
Mar 8, 2003
1,506
0
West Seattle, WA
I had the same problem with my Army too. Tried Loctite but that didn't work, tried cleaning it w/ rubbing alcohol, but that didn't work too. Finally, did the Coke can shim thing that Brian recommended and that's been working so far....Good luck and let me know what you finally end up doing.
 
Kornphlake

Kornphlake

Turbo Monkey
Oct 8, 2002
2,632
1
Portland, OR
You could try to knurl the barrel. Knurling adds a little bit of diameter to undersized parts. It's a hack's way of making stuff fit without shims.
 
dhtahoe

dhtahoe

I LOVE NORBA!!!!
Feb 4, 2002
1,363
0
Flying Low Living Fast
Ok what I used to do when I worked there is take a LITTLE material out of the UPPER adjuster that holds the seat-mast. This will make the UPPER SHOCK mount bite before the upper one(seat) does. This WILL solve the issue.
 
DHS

DHS

Friendly Neighborhood Pool Boy
Apr 23, 2002
5,094
0
Sand, CA
dhtahoe said:
Ok what I used to do when I worked there is take a LITTLE material out of the UPPER adjuster that holds the seat-mast. This will make the UPPER SHOCK mount bite before the upper one(seat) does. This WILL solve the issue.
Click to expand...
not sure what you mean, brian want to jump into photoshop and draw something out for us....
heh
 
seismic

seismic

Turbo Monkey
Dec 22, 2003
3,254
0
South East Asia
dhtahoe said:
Ok what I used to do when I worked there is take a LITTLE material out of the UPPER adjuster that holds the seat-mast. This will make the UPPER SHOCK mount bite before the upper one(seat) does. This WILL solve the issue.
Click to expand...

Sounds like a good idea. So...how did you remove the material? IS it like sand paper the barrel a little all the way around or are we talking heavier tools ?
 
seismic

seismic

Turbo Monkey
Dec 22, 2003
3,254
0
South East Asia
dhtahoe said:
Ok what I used to do when I worked there is take a LITTLE material out of the UPPER adjuster that holds the seat-mast. This will make the UPPER SHOCK mount bite before the upper one(seat) does. This WILL solve the issue.
Click to expand...

I will try that !!! Thanks a lot :) :) :)
 
seismic

seismic

Turbo Monkey
Dec 22, 2003
3,254
0
South East Asia
Yeah....nice !!! Asy, Brian...have you had problems with the minor cracks that sometimes develop in the upper linkage plate, - normally from the small hole which is towards the rear of the bike???
 
leprechaun

leprechaun

Turbo Monkey
Apr 17, 2004
1,009
0
SLC,Ut
I had the same problem when i rode one,
I let the upper barrel settle in that slipped-into position and compensated by turning my lower link barrel upward till i got my BB back up where i wanted it.
So my lower barrel was about straight up pointing at the shock.This may/will affect travel...
I had a couple sets of upper links crack too but the crack would stop after 5 mm or so and stay that way.
 
Brian HCM#1

Brian HCM#1

Don’t feed the troll
Sep 7, 2001
32,289
395
Bay Area, California
seismic said:
Yeah....nice !!! Asy, Brian...have you had problems with the minor cracks that sometimes develop in the upper linkage plate, - normally from the small hole which is towards the rear of the bike???
Click to expand...
No, not yet at least. Are the bolt heads for the bearings/barrel flush with the link or are they raised?
 
Pau11y

Pau11y

Turbo Monkey
Oct 20, 2004
1,968
0
In a web in the corner of your room
Speaking of Karpiels, any news on how he's doing trying to resuscitate his company? I still have that Army I need to have the head tube sawed off and re-attached straight. And no Brian, I haven't contacted a frame building school. At $3k a pop, I don't want 'students' to have a whack on my frame.
 
zedro

zedro

Turbo Monkey
Sep 14, 2001
4,144
1
at the end of the longest line
Pau11y said:
Speaking of Karpiels, any news on how he's doing trying to resuscitate his company? I still have that Army I need to have the head tube sawed off and re-attached straight. And no Brian, I haven't contacted a frame building school. At $3k a pop, I don't want 'students' to have a whack on my frame.
Click to expand...
at 3K a pop, you'd think it would of come proper in the first place. Dont see how things could get worse.

I wouldnt wait on Jan, he's crooked. If you really want to save the frame, look into having a pro do it.
 
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