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Karpiel Army ??'S: Help B!

#1: What chain guide for it?
#2: How do I remove the mounts in the rear swing arm and the rest of the frame to have it powder coated?
#3: I have an 8.75 X 2.75 avy for it, what travel will the bike have.
#4: what weight spring?(I weigh 195-205)

I lucked out and the TI spring that was on the fox was too big for the kit and noticed it touching the resevoir. I took it off and it slid right on to the avy, Perfect fit...

Here's the build:
Dee max/king hubs
king headset
thomson x.4 stem
protaper 31.8 bars
hope m4 brakes
rf N.shore cranks
xpedo mag pedals
x.9 shift/der
odi lock ons
avy dhs 2.75
chain guide? I have e-13 and mrp's
Fork: I have s8 (8" inverted) and boxxer wc conversion (7")
 

Thrillkil

Monkey
May 25, 2005
595
0
Isla Vista, CA
bullcrew said:
#1: What chain guide for it?
#2: How do I remove the mounts in the rear swing arm and the rest of the frame to have it powder coated?
#3: I have an 8.75 X 2.75 avy for it, what travel will the bike have.
#4: what weight spring?(I weigh 195-205)
1: The MRP System 1 is the ideal guide for a Karpiel, though you can make an E13 work, with some modifications, I think

2. Assuming you mean the posts that the linkages attach to, yes they need to be removed. you gotta pull 'em out with a c-clamp.

3. well, considering the usual shock is a 9X3 avalanche, you're looking at about 3/4-1 inch of travel loss. The bike will ride lower too.

4. on my Disco, which has a similar leverage rate, I weigh 150 and run a 550-lb spring. I would recommend you a spring in the 700lb range
 

vitox

Turbo Monkey
Sep 23, 2001
2,939
1
Santiago du Chili
bullcrew said:
#1: What chain guide for it?
#2: How do I remove the mounts in the rear swing arm and the rest of the frame to have it powder coated?
#3: I have an 8.75 X 2.75 avy for it, what travel will the bike have.
#4: what weight spring?(I weigh 195-205)

1: e13 SRS, id recommend a 42t chainring and bash combo.
use a 118mm BB or diabolus/saint/xt for correct chainline

2: undo the chainring bolts on te pivots. then remove the links. then you have the choice of either leaving the axles and bushings in and covering them with powdercoating specific masking tape (good option) or pressing the axles out, and then carefully removing the plastic bushings.

3: i would suggest sending it back to craig to have the travel limiting shaft spacer removed, thus making it a 9/3 shock. if you use it as it is now, youll have approx 9 inches of travel, put the shock bolt in a 7 o clock position when looking at it from the driveside.

4: for the lowest leverage mode you could be ok with a 550lbs but maybe you could try with 600 too
 

Pau11y

Turbo Monkey
bullcrew said:
#1: What chain guide for it?
#2: How do I remove the mounts in the rear swing arm and the rest of the frame to have it powder coated?
#3: I have an 8.75 X 2.75 avy for it, what travel will the bike have.
#4: what weight spring?(I weigh 195-205)
1st, on my 2000/2001, my guide was a slightly mod'd World Cup II MRP w/ a 42 Race Face DH ring. 2nd, what mounts are you referring to. 3rd for my shock, I had a 8 7/8" Fox Vanilla TC (the old Twin Click) w/ 2 7/8" travel. I used a 650 x 2 7/8" spring from Mountain Speed. It was soft for my 190#/~200# gear'd up. Towards the end, I was looking for a 750# spring. If your Avy isn't custom valved for the Army, I'd have Craig redo this shock specifically for the Army as I believe the leverage ratio is well above 3:1.
Travel: the bike was designed for rear travel from 9 - 11", but I think that was meant for a 9x3" shock. With the slightly shorter Fox, it was comfortably in the 8" or 8.5" area in the shortest travel. I think I had mine set somewhere in the 9.5 area when I was running it. For damping, I pretty much didn't use any compression and only a slight bit of rebound (just enough to not kick me over the bars when the spring extended from compression).

Edit: why not just ano the frame vs. powdercoat if you have access to ano-ing equipement?
 

seismic

Turbo Monkey
Dec 22, 2003
3,254
0
South East Asia
I use an E13 and there is a mod guide on the E13 webpage for the Karp.

Have the shock changed to a 9x3 - with the current shock I think your BB will be quite low considering the bike often runs a lot of sag.

The spring you need will be a 550 or 600.
 

vitox

Turbo Monkey
Sep 23, 2001
2,939
1
Santiago du Chili
Thrillkil said:
1: The MRP System 1 is the ideal guide for a Karpiel, though you can make an E13 work, with some modifications, I think

2. Assuming you mean the posts that the linkages attach to, yes they need to be removed. you gotta pull 'em out with a c-clamp.

3. well, considering the usual shock is a 9X3 avalanche, you're looking at about 3/4-1 inch of travel loss. The bike will ride lower too.

4. on my Disco, which has a similar leverage rate, I weigh 150 and run a 550-lb spring. I would recommend you a spring in the 700lb range


1: no mods needed to a SRS other than installing the iscg adapter cupping outwards so that it clears the lower linkage (going from memory here but im 100% certain no mods needed)

2: you dont need to remove the axles nor the bushings for repaint, if your going to send it to heat treat then yes, but the plastic bushing stands way more than 190ºc without getting damaged. this way you dont risk destroying the bushings when removing and reinstalling them, it happens a lot and ive done that a LOT of times on a lot of frames. just get a masking tape thats meant for powdercoat temperature and cover it all up nicely youll be fine.

3: exactly

4: the army has a lower leverage than the disco when put in the rider side forward upper eccentric and rider side rear on the lower eccentric, i think with an avy and the lowest possible travel he`ll be ok with 550 or 600. 700 not needed unless you want over 10" travel.
 

seismic

Turbo Monkey
Dec 22, 2003
3,254
0
South East Asia
When installing the E13 SRS with Saint cranks I was not able to mount the iscg adapter opposite and therefore the recommended install guide at E13`s HP.
 

Brian HCM#1

MMMMMMMMM BEER!!!!!!!!!!
Sep 7, 2001
31,568
48
Bay Area, California
vitox said:
1: no mods needed to a SRS other than installing the iscg adapter cupping outwards so that it clears the lower linkage (going from memory here but im 100% certain no mods needed)
Yes mods are needed, the newer version of the SRS works well, older version doesn't as far as chainline goes. The newer e13's you can use a 118mm BB, the older ones a 122mm and the chainline is way off.

2: you dont need to remove the axles nor the bushings for repaint, if your going to send it to heat treat then yes, but the plastic bushing stands way more than 190ºc without getting damaged. this way you dont risk destroying the bushings when removing and reinstalling them, it happens a lot and ive done that a LOT of times on a lot of frames. just get a masking tape thats meant for powdercoat temperature and cover it all up nicely youll be fine.
I would remeove the axles to refinish, takes some time to remove, but worth it.

4: the army has a lower leverage than the disco when put in the rider side forward upper eccentric and rider side rear on the lower eccentric, i think with an avy and the lowest possible travel he`ll be ok with 550 or 600. 700 not needed unless you want over 10" travel.
He shouldn't have a problem getting 10"-10 1/2" with a 550-600lb spring. I'm 200lb and have never had a problem with it.
 
Cool this gives me some direction, I appreciate it.
I'm going to have it built by the weekend and ready. I'll take pics.
As far as anoing it, I'll do it for paying and trading but it's way too much work for myself. I've done 2 of my own bikes and countless parts of my own. I just take it to a buddy and he does all the work per stripping and PWDRCTNG. He owes me a favor.
I'll do it in the spring time, for now just a nice finish is fine.
I have a whole scheme worked out for it but don't have the time to do it right now. I will definently post when it's ano'd It will be the longest and most tedious work with detail to design and graphics.