Kramer needed a new 15 minutes
- Thread starter DRB
- Start date
That *was* funny. But I'd attribute it to your superior sense of timing. 
I wish Sam Kinison was still around. There was a guy who knew how to scream. I bet he'd have something to say about this.
Such outbursts should now be referred to as "Kramering." Ukjason can teach us all proper technique.
Before I start, I fully understand that you have made-up your mind on the issue and that no matter what I say you will not agree, but I do not feel that I am in any way a clueless person.You are so clueless
A. The intent behind the word is absolute. If a black person calls another black person a nigger, but does it with malice, don't you think the sh!ts gonna hit the fan?
2. Chris Rock = the funny. Richards is not.
I think you missed my point. Granted context is part of conotation, but if he would have singled the same people out and called them assholes, or dipsh1ts would anybody really care? I am not condoning what Richards said, I'm just saying that I think the double standard here is retarded. Chris Rock has a stand-up routine where he talks about the difference between black people and niggers. He says essentially that a black person is a succesful useful member of society and that a nigger is a lowlife peice of sh1t. I would say that his intentions in using the term nigger are pretty absolute. Wich meens that either there is a predjudice in who we as a society allow to speak a certain way, or that like I said, if people laugh it's O.K. and if they don't it's not. I've heard many different white comedians use the word and get laughs, and the news didn't report that. If a word is truly offensive stop using it amongst yourselfs first before calling out others for using it. Most of my family is Jewish, and I hang out with and work with several Jews as well, yet I never hear them calling eachother a kike, why because it's offensive and they do not want other people of different backgrounds calling them kikes either. I do not like double standards, or hypocrits, I beleive that in order to have equality we must be equal, so if the majority of any minority feels that it's O.K. to adress each other by what used to be a derogitory term, I am of a mind that that term has now lost it's original meening and taken on new meening. Wich brings me back to my point again, it is either offensive no matter who says it, or no offensive no matter who says it.
Don't kid yourself, racism is still very previlent in our society. Both with white people descriminating against black people, Asians, Hispanics ect. and the other way around. I have never been asked to leave an establishment because I was white, but I have been given slow service, and been otherwise made to feel unwelcome. At the highschool I went to the vast majority of people automaticly assumed that if you were white you were rich and if you were hispanic you were poor, if you drove a decent car you were obviously a spoiled brat, and if you drove a beet-up car you must work hard and have a job.
There was plenty of anger behind what Richards said, but wether or not he said the word nigger has nothing to do with his hate. His crack about the "good old days" was tastless and uncalled for, but that fact that he used the term nigger is a nonstory as far as I'm concerned. He was at the laugh factory, people heckle and talk there, I'm sure white people were heckling too. He singled out a few members of the audience who were black and took his frustration out on them, he also said he wished there were still slavery, he is a racist. It's the voodoo around the word nigger that gets me.
I'm done ranting.
Nope, nope, I understood what you meant and mean... still clueless
You're trying to equate one insult that's vague and non-specific (eg. asshole) with another that has a long history of hate surrounding it.
apples and oranges.
I don't know anyone who finds that offensive.
agree with maxyedor. and i think sanjuro should get a (i will ban you with my all mighty mediator powers if you assault people like that on here again) hate pm that i got. i guess we are not allowed to voice our freedom of speech on RM
Damn, I was going to use it on you after I got bored of the soap jokes.
Freedom of speech on here isn't really a right. Technically you're posting on to a private server, not a public forum funded by the state or your local government or whatever, so you're at the whim of the management and what they find acceptable.
You typed in all that stuff to get to this premise?
Holy crap man, there's no mystic voodoo here, except i wanna know what kind of zombie juice you drinking that keeps you from figuring that out...
To simplify Kramers rant was downright disrespectful, and you and Zed know full well why it is. The arguments you bring up have no validity to this instance. You both admit that but still babble on about Orwell....
Stop focusing on your ideal and get with what the reality is.
This rant was such a no-brainer case of disrespect i just don't know why you wish to attempt to minimize it by citing the fact that black people call each other slurs.
Perhaps you feel you want some control in how black people should relate to each other?
It's just not fair that "they" get to use the word, and "we" can't? Is that it?
Pretty easy philosophy, and whatever route you get to the point of being respectful is a good way to go in my book.
Trying to justify the use of the N word by looking at it upside down and sideways is fine if you got spare time. But the reality is apparent that the word is what it is, and we are not so enlightened that it's changed in this instance, or many a common circumstance, where many of us would attempt to exploit it.
Kike man that word got me in trouble!!
In HS a friend of mine nickname was Kike. I had no clue what that meant at the time so I threw that word out everywhere. I was at some big even can't remember now, and I yelled that out across the crowd to get his attention. WOW!! I think I got everyone's attention. My friend that was with me said, "WTF are you doing, do you know what that means?" Meanwhile everyone in the place was staring at me. Then I had an old lady give me the smack talk!! It was pretty embarrassing.
Then I got arrested later that year for supposed Terriost Threats!! They said I called someone a Sand N*gger and kicked the $hit out of someone, witch I did NOT!!!! (It was all BIG Mistake/Mixed up my car with someone else)
So Yah I had my fare share of bad moments with words!!! No of them being used it a racist fashion but people def. took it that way.
How could they charge me with Terriost threats when it was just TWO words??? And not try to charge me with assualt?? (And if you didn't read my post I never said it so STFU)
There is a certain zen in not letting words mean anything other than a collection of letters. I choose not to see them as offensive, regardless of what the word means. I do understand what it means, and refrain from speaking it and other offenses out of respect for people.
It's tough to actually come to the point of not letting such things bother you, but it is possible.
It's tough to actually come to the point of not letting such things bother you, but it is possible.
I just read a book about Bill Hicks, who many accuse Denis Leary of stealing his entire act, and was a contemporary of Kinison.
There was one chapter about Hicks dealing an annoying woman in the audience. He was so funny and on such a tear, comedians performing at other clubs rushed down to see him.
He went on for 2 hours after this woman set him off, and she even stayed.
Was Hicks vulgar? Yes, but he was funny too. That's the difference to me.
robert d rayford actually.
typical.
someone gives a thought or opinion, and if you don't agree with it you start namecalling and labeling.
seeing as how you have no f'in idea about me.
what gives you the holier than thou right to start labeling ?
you may be a lord.
but it's in your mind only.
take a hike.
Well, that is the hardest thing about comedy and offensiveness, there is a fine line between the two.so if someone found kramer's rant funny.........it's ok?
Take Chris Rock's very famous routinue, "Black People vs. the N*ggers". I am sure many have heard it before, but at the end of his comedy album with this routinue, there is a short skit of an Italian guy who agrees with this a little too much, and then Rock and his crew beat the sh*t out of this guy because they think he is racist.
From an objective point of view, it might be difficult to explain the nuiances this skit, but from a real-life perspective, everyone should know that blacks can make n*gger jokes, whites cannot, and if you are not sure about the difference, then don't open your mouth.
i wonder what the hecklers said to kramer in the first place. who knows, could have been something very derogatory that set him off in the first place.
another thing people don't consider is that derrogatory statements are completely subjective. someone can get highly offended by a comment about their physical appearance, moreso than a statement about someone else's race. that is why i never understood why racist statements automatically became the almighty form of insult. if someone makes a racist joke, are they automatically a racist? you may argue yes.......however, does someone that makes a joke that is derrogative towards women a sexist? i guarentee most would say not. i know plenty of people that joke about their race/religion, and others that lash out if you so much as take a jab at their personal appearance. both are equally as offensive in my opinion, depending on who is on the receiving end.
EDIT - and before someone argues that kramer's rant wasnt "funny" and was just lashing out, i heard plenty of people laughing in that video, so it must have been funny. maybe not to you, but to some people. again, it's all subjective.
EDIT - and before someone argues that kramer's rant wasnt "funny" and was just lashing out, i heard plenty of people laughing in that video, so it must have been funny. maybe not to you, but to some people. again, it's all subjective.
hey joe, you're fat...
i know, luckily i have a very good sense of humor and it doesnt bother me.
however, make fun of tim for his height...........
heh, tiny tim...however, make fun of tim for his height...........
Also keep in mind that almost everyone on this board is male and white.
Most jokes about women are sexist, but your buddies are not going to be offended.
Agreed, wow look at all the perfect i have never made a mistake/sin RM members in here, cast the first stone people! hes human just like you, impure at times and imperfect. He made an apology let it be, go ride your bike.
What about yard ape, lil black sambo, darkie, spic, wetback, iceback, haole, beaner, poi pounder, honkey, casper, kike, kraut, Alabama blue gums, chink, coon, thicklips, spook, raghead, towelhead, sand n*gger, niglet, oreo, gook, flip, monkey, jigaboo, gator bait, and last but not least cracker.
Sorry if I offended anyone...Actually, I find all these terms funny and if I get called one....oh well!
Sorry if I offended anyone...Actually, I find all these terms funny and if I get called one....oh well!
Sweet, I was waiting for the catch-all RM comeback: "Go ride your bike." Excellent.Agreed, wow look at all the perfect i have never made a mistake/sin RM members in here, cast the first stone people! hes human just like you, impure at times and imperfect. He made an apology let it be, go ride your bike.
Hate speech is like art or ducks. Hard to define but you know it when you see it.
I hope I live to see a time when words are not as offensive as they are. But we are not there yet, and Kramer knows that. He offered no excuse or apology for it, and admitted it was wrong. Which it was. End of story.
All of this discussion about whether the word SHOULD be offensive is all well and good, but beside the point. To the extent this outburt sparks meaningful dialogue, great - maybe there's a silver lining. But that was not the intent. It was contempt of the worst kind, pure hate from some place deep in his personality. He had no idea what he was saying, absolutely no control. Ya'll don't have to agree but in my opinion he stepped over whatever is left of "the line."
yep, everyone breaks down and looses it at some point in their lives, its just a matter of how, when, and why. Thankfuly we are all different or we all would be running around yelling; forks in your arses.
I think the point is that while you might find it funny, go into a minority neighborhood and try out some of these terms, and see what kind of laughs you get.
Frankly, I use a lot of racist terms as jokes due their verboten nature. But around SF, where there are many minorities, most don't think it is funny, partly due to PC police, but partly that many minorities have suffered thru racism.
Well, I guess its all a part of life and who/what we are...I think it is hilarious to hear these words. But then again, I am not going to be a stupid cracker and go up to a n*gger and call him thicklips....come on...or walk up to a bunch of beaners on the corner selling oranges and call them a beaner or spic or wetback! that is just retarded!
I know he apologized. I meant that he didn't try to justify it or say it was ok, because he knows it's not.
I am not against racist humor. I would be the biggest hypocrite if I did.
I would hope my racist jokes are understood to be making fun of racism, not of other races.
It is a good question now. I don't have any black friends right now, but I have had plenty in the past. I don't know if that gives me permission to make racist jokes though.
And I have heard people say, and not in humor, "Those F*cking Niiiiiii", and stop themselves before the second syllable comes out their lips. That to me is not funny at all.
Racist is a funny accusation to be tossing out. If I make any racist joke, am I racist?
I totally agree, I find racism jokes very funny and people that take it way to serious are just missing out on the fun.
I just call them N's...makes it so much easier! Plus the one black friend I have (just kidding) cant get mad at me for that!
I dont think that you are racist if you make a joke. I make that clear before I attempt to make a joke or call a race a certain name. There is a difference in making a joke and then being a straight up a@@hole!
Um....no, I dont just come out and say "Hey, your a n*gger" Saying this as in jokes, I find to be ok....but if you walk up to a bunch of n's and say this without knowing them, you will probably get jumped! I'm not just going to walk around call every black person I see a N...I dont use the term as a derogatory manner. So, I am not confused.
Frankly, if you were to spend time with many blacks, you might find your sense of humor not so funny. But I appreciate your own frankiness about the subject matter.
I will give you a small example from my own life:
I used to play alot of basketball, mostly with black guys. I was usually the only Asian on the court, and I would be peppered with "Jackie Chan" comments. I had a stock response though, and one time I responded with "who are you, Drunken Monkey?"
That guy, who was black and about 275lbs, was about to throw to me to the ground because all he heard was "Monkey". But he had a sense of humor, and he did realize that it was said in the same context as what he just called me, and I was saved from a massive beating.
The funny part was about a hour later. I was in weight room, and the same guy, who was very boisterous, was talking about eating pvssy, commenting while most black men won't do it, he does it willingly.
Everyone there, who were all black, was giving grief for admitting this, and he yells out across the weight room to me, "Yo, Jackie Chan! You eat pvssy, doncha?"
Everyone, including me, was in stitches laughing.
excuse me sir, please dont take this the wrong way but......ya damn honkey!!!
Um, FRANKLY, I grew up around alot of blacks and have served in the military with many that I would not have second thoughts about trusting in them to have my back during hostile situations while deployed and they felt the same for me. So therefore, I have built strong relationships with numerous of BLACK people that do not find it offensive when we talk trash to each other....