[boogenman]

Do you think that's the case because bicycling is usually thought of as more of a hobby, rather than as something serious? So it's "no big deal" when stuff doesn't run smoothly?
I just can't imagine these types of consistent lapses being the norm in more serious industries. I hope that as cycling gets more popular and people begin to rely on them more in the future, we'll see some more competence.
Or are you just saying it's impossible for a business to carry a reasonable amount of stuff? Cause I don't think I buy that.
I mean, I can go to autozone and say I need an alternator for a 1994 Ford Ranger, and unless someone just bought a couple, it will be in my hand in a few minutes. I could also do the same thing with my last 2 jeeps, and every other car I've owned. And vehicles have many more parts, with many more standards, which are larger and cost more, and they somehow manage to have the stuff on hand.
I understand there are exceptions of course, you aren't going to get replacement Lamoborghini seats there. But as a bicycle shop, you should at the very minimum have a full stock of replacement and upgrade parts for the line of bicycles you carry.
Well, they don't have to... I mean obviously they are staying in business without doing this, but if they want to satisfy customers it seems like a pretty reasonable thing to do.

Also, as for me not working in a bike shop any longer. There's just not enough money for one thing. Plus it gets real old putting together POS Haro BMXs and $300 MTBs because that's basically all people buy. That or they come in and ask you to figure up the price for a dozen different high-end components and then say "thanks" and dont buy anything, because costs are exorbitant, but only after you spent half an hour totaling the stuff up. The job's not for me.

I can go into ANY bike shop and say I need a 26" wheel, 7 spd freewheel, 26"tire and 26" tube for my Huffy I got in 1998 and they will hand it over to me, just like a 1994 ranger alternator. It is a part that a lot of people need. How many rangers and explorers did ford build that use that specific part? 800,000? probably more.

The exception is the Lambo parts, that is the high end cyclist. If I snap the lowers on my 2008 Fox Float RLC I am probably going to want to try out a Rock Shox fork, maybe a 2010 Float with a FIT and 15mm upgrade. Bikes have way to many plug and play parts for there to be a profitable demand to stock these items.

 

[BurlyShirley]

I can go into ANY bike shop and say I need a 26" wheel, 7 spd freewheel, 26"tire and 26" tube for my Huffy I got in 1998 and they will hand it over to me, just like a 1994 ranger alternator. It is a part that a lot of people need. How many rangers and explorers did ford build that use that specific part? 800,000? probably more.

The exception is the Lambo parts, that is the high end cyclist. If I snap the lowers on my 2008 Fox Float RLC I am probably going to want to try out a Rock Shox fork, maybe a 2010 Float with a FIT and 15mm upgrade. Bikes have way to many plug and play parts for there to be a profitable demand to stock these items.

Perhaps reading my post in its entirety before drumming up knee-jerk response would be more helpful.
Nobody is saying shops need to carry everything in the world. Just replacement parts for the bicycles they sell or have sold, and some upgrades.
You can just ignore everyone's posts about needing to order simple things like chainrings and brakelines all day, but it won't earn an LBS any more business.

 

[boogenman]

I would like to see all the LBS haters make an attempt to run a LBS for a year.

I'm with loco gringo, I was at a very very successful store that has a loyal customer base because we did things the right way.

I agree that many shops are run by morons, I have worked at a few of them in the bike and ski industry. Just don't throw us all in that pool, there are good shops around.

 

[vtjim]

I would like to see all the LBS haters make an attempt to run a LBS for a year.

I'm with loco gringo, I was at a very very successful store that has a loyal customer base because we did things the right way.

I agree that many shops are run by morons, I have worked at a few of them in the bike and ski industry. Just don't throw us all in that pool, there are good shops around.

I don't think anyone on here said that there is no such thing as a good shop, just that they're few and far between.

 

[Westy]

I would like to see all the LBS haters make an attempt to run a LBS for a year.

I'm with loco gringo, I was at a very very successful store that has a loyal customer base because we did things the right way.

I agree that many shops are run by morons, I have worked at a few of them in the bike and ski industry. Just don't throw us all in that pool, there are good shops around.

There can be a million amazing bike shops out there. The reality is they don't matter unless you live near them. A great shop 100 miles away is of even less use than an LBS or mail order place. If your LBS sucks you have every right to be an LBS hater.

 

[sanjuro]

Well, there are still some things only a LBS can supply:

Complicated repairs on the whole bike (forks and wheels can be serviced online)
Bike fitting

As long your shop can do that, then it will stay open.

 

[jimmydean]

I would like to see all the LBS haters make an attempt to run a LBS for a year.

I'm with loco gringo, I was at a very very successful store that has a loyal customer base because we did things the right way.

I agree that many shops are run by morons, I have worked at a few of them in the bike and ski industry. Just don't throw us all in that pool, there are good shops around.

Obviously you didn't read my post. I miss Trailhead Cycles, it was an awesome shop and I spent a lot of money there. I live too far from Santiam to give them my business, or else I would. The other shops here suck. I would be awful as an LBS owner.

I don't recall tossing anyone into the pool.

 

[Da Peach]

This was a pretty funny thread over at nsmb.

"Here I am with a pile of money, sell me a bike"
funny...

 

[jonKranked]

dear lord will the debate never end?!?!?

 

[sanjuro]

I would like to see all the LBS haters make an attempt to run a LBS for a year.

I'm with loco gringo, I was at a very very successful store that has a loyal customer base because we did things the right way.

I agree that many shops are run by morons, I have worked at a few of them in the bike and ski industry. Just don't throw us all in that pool, there are good shops around.

I don't blame anyone for complaining about bad service or poor selection at the LBS.

I bought some camping equipment at REI last week. If there such a thing as a LCS any more, you think I want to go there on a Friday for a 5 gallon water container and a skillet and be told, "I don't have it but I can order it. You can pick it up after your camping trip"?

My only criticism is when people think shops should be able to do a complete overhaul on a Friday evening or stock 18 types of brake pads. That's when working in a shop is insightful.

 

[golgiaparatus]

I would like to see all the LBS haters make an attempt to run a LBS for a year.

I'm with loco gringo, I was at a very very successful store that has a loyal customer base because we did things the right way.

I agree that many shops are run by morons, I have worked at a few of them in the bike and ski industry. Just don't throw us all in that pool, there are good shops around.

The point of this thread was not to say all LBSs suck... it was to say that from now on I wont shy away from telling any of the LBS's in town that my bike was 100% built from parts ordered online. Why... because when I do try to keep my business local not a single shop is prepared to give me the service I need.

 

[MMike]

I would like to see all the LBS haters make an attempt to run a LBS for a year.
d.

I'd take that bet....however, in exchange the LBS owner who have to try to keep himself afloat working in the aircraft industry...or christ... ANY other.."real" industry.

 

[OGRipper]

There can be a million amazing bike shops out there. The reality is they don't matter unless you live near them. A great shop 100 miles away is of even less use than an LBS or mail order place. If your LBS sucks you have every right to be an LBS hater.

I agree with this, but I disagree that it makes sense to hate all bike shops because the one closest to you happens to suck balls.

 

[Serial Midget]

Does anyone wonder why specialty bikes parts are so expensive and hard to find? Low demand specialty products really should be marketed on line where the seller has access to a much wider market area. Not many people want or need high end replacement hydro brakes consistently enough for a small LBS to stock them.

I don't think its reasonable for me to walk into any bike ship and a find a Campy 10speed cogset for $200.00 just waiting for me to purchase it, nor do I think its reasonable to expect a shop owner to strip a bike to satisfy my needs.

Successful LBS stock those items that are most likely to sell profitably to their most loyal customers. If you need something out of the ordinary it will most likely have to be special ordered and this is nothing new. I been involved with bikes since the late 1970s - anything of exceptional quality has always had to be special ordered.

Expecting hydro brake sets to be stocked in a LBS is like expecting steak and lobster from McDonalds. They haven't offered it before, they don't offer it now and will not be offering it in the future...

Unreasonable expectations are bound to be met with disappointment.

 

[MMike]

I agree that the volume is low so stock is also low. But that fact has therefore rendered the lbs far less useful. The middle man is not required. So if a traditional lbs is not creative enough to keep himself relevant, well too bad for him

 

[jimmydean]

Expecting hydro brake sets to be stocked in a LBS is like expecting steak and lobster from McDonalds. They haven't offered it before, they don't offer it now and will not be offering it in the future...

Unreasonable expectations are bound to be met with disappointment.

At Santiam, there is a box in the back with every part for every set of hydros they sell, they have a variety of hose lengths, and at least one complete set of each set they offer.

If I blow out a banjo, they have it. They have a few, actually. Something like that I actually do expect any good shop to carry. Spare parts that fail are cheap to stock. Do I expect them to have 2 complete group sets of XTR? No, but a right crank arm would be nice.

Maybe I'm spoiled.

 

[CrabJoe StretchPants]

I went to my LBS today during my lunch break for a chainring and a bottom bracket. 0 for 2.

Universal Cycles, here I come!

 

[Leethal]

i Agree That The Volume Is Low So Stock Is Also Low. But That Fact Has Therefore Rendered The Lbs Far Less Useful. The Middle Man Is Not Required. So If A Traditional Lbs Is Not Creative Enough To Keep Himself Relevant, Well Too Bad For Him

Bingo!

 

[Leethal]

Or they can continue to fight with Wal-mart for the low end customer and hope they land some middle line sales occasionally.

 

[Serial Midget]

Exactly - everyone knows they can get high end bits cheaper and faster off the net - the problem is we all want everything right now!!!

I agree that the volume is low so stock is also low. But that fact has therefore rendered the lbs far less useful. The middle man is not required. So if a traditional lbs is not creative enough to keep himself relevant, well too bad for him

 

[jimmydean]

Universal Cycles, here I come!

Here is an interesting case. I can drive to Universal Cycles (They are right by the airport) and not be able to buy many of the parts I need because they stock mostly wheels and wheel parts.

They can order me something, but it would be FASTER (and they will even tell you that) if I order it from the site and have it drop shipped to my house.

/thread

 

[CrabJoe StretchPants]

Here is an interesting case. I can drive to Universal Cycles (They are right by the airport) and not be able to buy many of the parts I need because they stock mostly wheels and wheel parts.

They can order me something, but it would be FASTER (and they will even tell you that) if I order it from the site and have it drop shipped to my house.

/thread

Nice. They seem like cool folks there, never had any issues with them in the 30 or so orders I've placed with them over the past 5-6 years.


That last order (for a BB and chainring) ended up being a tad under $700.






Gotta love bikes.

 

[demo 9]

The shop i work at does not stock that much but has orders coming in every monday and thursday. In general customers seem to be happy-i dont buy much from them because they dont really give me any discount but the shipping times are faster than off the net i would think?

 

[jimmydean]

Nice. They seem like cool folks there, never had any issues with them in the 30 or so orders I've placed with them over the past 5-6 years.

As a side note, they have some of the best prices on hand built wheels. They are well know around here for solid and cheap wheels.

 

[-dustin]

The shop i work at does not stock that much but has orders coming in every monday and thursday.

This is a rather important point...the 2 shops that I've worked at order from multiple distributors on different days, but stay on a schedule. Meaning - parts come in every Wed, Thurs, and Fri. I try to tell customers what our schedule is so that whenever they're considering ordering something, they don't come up to me on Thursday needing something for Saturday...getting pissed when I can't get it.

Before I worked in a shop, my favorite LBS was one that had almost nothing in stock. But I knew when his orders went out, so as long as I got my want list to him by X, I knew I'd have my parts by Y. If I missed X, I knew it'd be another week.

 

[nelsonjm]

What I never got is why more local bike shops don't sell online. It fixes the problem of not being able to move parts and also expands your customer base to make the business more stable.

Any lbs employees/owners care to comment on this?

Quoting myself because I am still interested to hear from lbs workers and owners responses.

 

[loco-gringo]

Quoting myself because I am still interested to hear from lbs workers and owners responses.

It's labor intensive, low margins and a distraction from my in store customers that deserve the attention.

 

[Polandspring88]

Nice. They seem like cool folks there, never had any issues with them in the 30 or so orders I've placed with them over the past 5-6 years.

That last order (for a BB and chainring) ended up being a tad under $700.

Gotta love bikes.

Did you finally get a real handlebar for the Burner?

 

[jimmydean]

It's labor intensive, low margins and a distraction from my in store customers that deserve the attention.

One of the ways Bernie was able to survive and grow was to have an ebay store to sell old stock and takeoff parts. It was a near full time gig, but it made more than what it cost to run, so it made sense.

I think many more shops will move in that direction because it is truly a global market.

 

[CrabJoe StretchPants]

Did you finally get a real handlebar for the Burner?

Nope. 25" Flat carbon bars are all the rage, everyone knows that.

New D2 Carbon
OCT Holzfellers for the RFX
Egg Beaters, Smarties and Mallets
3 New sets of grips

Ride sometime?

 

[loco-gringo]

One of the ways Bernie was able to survive and grow was to have an ebay store to sell old stock and takeoff parts. It was a near full time gig, but it made more than what it cost to run, so it made sense.

I think many more shops will move in that direction because it is truly a global market.

I'd LOVE to deplete old inventory as well. That said, my service would suffer with our current model, so it's not worth it. The only reason to do it is to have a larger audience. I don't need one right now.

 

[nelsonjm]

It's labor intensive, low margins and a distraction from my in store customers that deserve the attention.

In Blacksburg VA at hokie spokes they just hire someone for minimum wage to list stuff for them. Any trained monkey can snap a photo and find specs page to sell off old inventory... It seemed to work for them, and for the person jimmydean is talking about.

Why wouldn't that work for someone like you? It wouldn't be labor intensive since you aren't doing the work. You wouldn't be distracted since it's hired help, and margins wouldn't matter that much since the main purpose is to get rid of old inventory, right?

If it is a volume problem or if you don't want to hire somone, you could band up with other bike shops and find someone to do it for you. Just have them swing by, pick up stuff that isn't selling and tell them they will get x% of each sale they make online.


What do you think of that business plan? I don't want to come off as attempting to challenge anybody by the way, I'm just curious.

 

[Da Peach]

Aren't clearance sales for getting rid of "the dogs"? Sunny day, hot dogs, demos, and cheap stuff. And balloons for the kids!

 

[jimmydean]

I'd LOVE to deplete old inventory as well. That said, my service would suffer with our current model, so it's not worth it. The only reason to do it is to have a larger audience. I don't need one right now.

Bernie was using the latest version of Quickbooks that allowed him to maintain a current inventory. He could have an online store, ebay, and the retail store all linked to the same database.

If a bottom bracket sold online, it was removed from inventory so they knew it was no longer available. That way if I went to the ebay store, only things that were actually in stock were listed.

It took some upfront overhead, but once the pictures are taken and specs listed, it auto updates and you might have to review it once a month.

 

[CBJ]

I have always found the LBS that worked best for me where I lived and tried to give them as much business as possible. It has always worked out really good and money wise it has not cost me more money.

 

[MMike]

Like it or not, internet is here. I predict the following fate for those who don't adapt.

Swiss Watch Industry
If you asked the question in 1968: What nation will dominate the world of watch
making? The answer would have been Switzerland
• Swiss had dominated the industry for past 60 years
• Swiss were constantly improving their product
• They had a Natl’ research center that many of their manufacturers participated in
• They controlled 65% of world sales and as much as 90% of world watch profits
• There was no one even in a close second place
• However in 1980 market share collapsed to less than 10% and profits under 20%
• By 1979 50 thousand of the 62 thousand watch makers lost their jobs and resulted
in a Swiss crisis
What happened?
• Paradigm shift happened in terms of how watches were to be made from
mechanical to electronic quartz technology
• Japan went from less than 1% market share to 33%
• Irony of it all Swiss had invented the electronic quartz watch but is manufactures
rejected it and Seiko took the idea to Japan
The Swiss did not learn to anticipate the future. You can and should shape your own
future. Because if you do not someone else surely will.

 

[loco-gringo]

In Blacksburg VA at hokie spokes they just hire someone for minimum wage to list stuff for them. Any trained monkey can snap a photo and find specs page to sell off old inventory... It seemed to work for them, and for the person jimmydean is talking about.

Why wouldn't that work for someone like you? It wouldn't be labor intensive since you aren't doing the work. You wouldn't be distracted since it's hired help, and margins wouldn't matter that much since the main purpose is to get rid of old inventory, right?

If it is a volume problem or if you don't want to hire somone, you could band up with other bike shops and find someone to do it for you. Just have them swing by, pick up stuff that isn't selling and tell them they will get x% of each sale they make online.


What do you think of that business plan? I don't want to come off as attempting to challenge anybody by the way, I'm just curious.

Your plan may just get some play.

 

[boogenman]

Quoting myself because I am still interested to hear from lbs workers and owners responses.

Marketing your store online is a fulltime gig. selling on ebay is one thing but that is time consuming as well.

I think the other major set back is that many shop owners are already busy with running a business and taking care of foot traffic.

 

[-BB-]

You have to understand there is a huge disconnect between road and mountain in the LBS.

Most shops are owned by a cycling enthusiast of some type, usually road because of the relative short lifespan of mountain bikers.

LOL... this too.

 

[Inclag]

Funny thing is that an LBS might not stock certain parts, but they more than likely should be able to pull the parts off a bike on the sales floor and replace said parts in a very short period of time. Yet none of them ever do it.

I needed a heavier shock spring in a pinch. I walk into a shop that had bikes with the spring I need. We're talking about FR and DH bikes at a shop in Belmont/Somerville MA that will not sell in 2-3 days. I ask if they have a 450 or 500x2.8 spring available, and I get the standard, "I don't think we have anything, but we can order one for you". Honestly, if these Einsteins can't even think about doing something like pulling a part off a showroom bike, they ain't getting my business.

And all I hear about from some of these shops is how they can't afford to stock exotic parts, when in reality they have a plethora hanging on bikes on their sales floor. When I was a kid I worked in a shop and I knew what the markups were on parts and complete bikes. A sale is a sale is a sale. Sell those brakes off that Trek, or that fork of the Jamis. Offer the customer full warranty assistance since it is OEM equipment, and then replace those parts from a distributor which should take no more than a few days.

And the thing is I don't expect the bmx loving kid cleaning bikes, the kid who reads MTBAction all day and is awkward on the sales floor, the scruffy crazy mechanic, the tight jean cig smoking hipster salemen, or the too good for anyone roadie that works at the shop to get it, because alot of time they don't. What blows my mind is these shop owners who are substandard to mediocre businessmen at best. They somehow continue getting loans to open up these businesses (which if they are lucky, they don't run into the ground, and if they do they repeat the cycle), they do little to nothing to train their staff to make sales or do anything possible to satisfy a potential customer, and then they cry wolf at the first hint of criticism.

I'm with MMike. I'd love to see some of these guys working in a REAL industry.