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Light Tires with Good Sidewalls

trialsboy50

Monkey
Nov 23, 2004
160
0
I'm building my DH/FR rig, looking to buy some tires. I'm trying to keep the rig under 40lbs, and with a 10lb frame, I'm trying to save weight everywhere. I will be doing DH, FR and some urban hucking, so somethign with a decent sidewall/casing is important. Weight is also important. Any suggestions? 130lbs, and I guess somewhat smooth for my weight. Considering the Kinetics Singleply or Minions DH Rs and Fs singleply, don't know if they'll hold up though.

Byron
 

-BB-

I broke all the rules, but somehow still became mo
Sep 6, 2001
4,254
28
Livin it up in the O.C.
I don't think that you can get both good sidewalls AND low weight.

You can get high-volume and low weight, but to get good sidewalls and low weight, you need to get a 1.95 or something.


For Size w/o weight, look at WTB Weirwolves or 2.35 Highrollers.
 

Zutroy

Turbo Monkey
Dec 9, 2004
2,443
0
Ventura,CA
trialsboy50 said:
I'm building my DH/FR rig, looking to buy some tires. I'm trying to keep the rig under 40lbs, and with a 10lb frame, I'm trying to save weight everywhere. I will be doing DH, FR and some urban hucking, so somethign with a decent sidewall/casing is important. Weight is also important. Any suggestions? 130lbs, and I guess somewhat smooth for my weight. Considering the Kinetics Singleply or Minions DH Rs and Fs singleply, don't know if they'll hold up though.

Byron

I've been using the Kenda Kevlar beaded tires at Fontucky and haven't flated yet. Even put a quarter size dent in my front 321, and didn't flat it.
 

joelsman

Turbo Monkey
Feb 1, 2002
1,369
0
B'ham
just get mavic tubeless rims and tubeless minions, no tubes will drop the wieght the best. also use double butted spokes alloy nips.
 

Zutroy

Turbo Monkey
Dec 9, 2004
2,443
0
Ventura,CA
trialsboy50 said:
I guess I'll look at the Kinetics DH and Kolassals(only $5)

Kenetics are ok, the Kolassals are not very good in my opinion. I love the Blue Groove and Nevegal. Which ever one you get, get the Stick-E rubber version.
 

The Rose

Monkey
Aug 2, 2004
120
0
pine barrens N.J
The Kolassals roll fast as hell but they arent that grippy. The Kinetics on the other hand don't roll as fast but they grip like hell. I run the blue grooves and they work great in the dry and on the rocks.
 

ncrider

Turbo Monkey
Aug 15, 2004
1,564
0
Los Angeles
joelsman said:
just get mavic tubeless rims and tubeless minions, no tubes will drop the wieght the best. also use double butted spokes alloy nips.
Not trying to start a tube vs. tubless battle, but the tubless route really isn't any lighter. There used to be a huge thread about this look it up if you want proof.
 

Kntr

Turbo Monkey
Jan 25, 2003
7,526
21
Montana
trialsboy50 said:
Hmm, 2.4" would be nice, but my Thule Big Mouth rack holds up to 2.35/2.35.

It will fit. The 2.4 is a little small but the knob make it a 2.4. It is a sweet light tire.
 

Jm_

sled dog's bollocks
Jan 14, 2002
20,522
11,010
AK
-BB- said:
I don't think that you can get both good sidewalls AND low weight.

You can get high-volume and low weight, but to get good sidewalls and low weight, you need to get a 1.95 or something.


For Size w/o weight, look at WTB Weirwolves or 2.35 Highrollers.
Word. I've had it with ripping up weirwolf 2.1 tires on the rear of my bike. The sidewall is simply not strong enough for the XC riding that I do, and tires seem to be one part of cyling that violates the; "pick two of the following: light, strong, cheap".

There are no real light and strong tires, no matter how much you pay. Relating to the rear tire on my XC bike, there are no 500-600g tires no matter how much you pay that are going to have sidewalls that hold up well when rubbing against sharp rocks...

Light 600-750g 2.3ish tires have extremely thin sidewalls usually.

800g seems to be about the level where you start to get a decent sidewall, but again, it depends on where and how you are riding.
 

Jm_

sled dog's bollocks
Jan 14, 2002
20,522
11,010
AK
trialsboy50 said:
I guess I'll look at the Kinetics DH and Kolassals(only $5)
There's a reason the Kolassal is only $5, it's because it's one of the worst DH tires ever made. I used it for a while. Take my advice; Don't ride this tire even if it's given to you. It's simply not worth it.
 

Kntr

Turbo Monkey
Jan 25, 2003
7,526
21
Montana
Jm_ said:
There's a reason the Kolassal is only $5, it's because it's one of the worst DH tires ever made. I used it for a while. Take my advice; Don't ride this tire even if it's given to you. It's simply not worth it.

I completely agree. They are junk and ment to be cut up and used as a chainstay protector....
 

BMXman

I wish I was Canadian
Sep 8, 2001
13,827
0
Victoria, BC
yeah so far I have been on Blue Groove, Cortez, Nevegal, Kinetics, and Karma's all with Kevlar beads...and no problems...D
 

Salami

Turbo Monkey
Jul 17, 2003
1,788
121
Waxhaw, NC
ncrider said:
Not trying to start a tube vs. tubless battle, but the tubless route really isn't any lighter. There used to be a huge thread about this look it up if you want proof.

:rolleyes: My scale must be wrong then. I had a pair of Mag 30's laced to a pair of Hope Bulbs running Michelin Comp 24.1's and DH tubes. Weighed the entire combo. Tore down wheels, laced hubs to Mavic EX823's and mounted the tires without the tubes. Weighed entire wheelset and it was 2.6lbs lighter. :think:

7.75oz lost from each rim and 12.75oz lost from each tube, per wheel. I guess it must not be lighter. :blah:
 

Sir_Crackien

Turbo Monkey
Feb 7, 2004
2,051
0
alex. va. usa.
salami those rims are not as strong as the mag30's and you know it. also you are compareing a tubeless tire w/tube to a setup with the same tire w/o tube.

and as JM said the kollosal is worthless! the worse tire i have ever had. but i do like many other kenda tires.
 

bullcrew

3 Dude Approved
I too amtrying to get my rig down below 40lbs and debated tubeless and my conclusion is whats on my bike and I weigh 205lbs maxxis minion dh 40d slow reezays w/ medium x/c tubes. No problems yet and thats 3 rim dents since I put them on. I like tubless it has a BLING BLING thing going on and apparently works awesome. My set up has proven to be extremely durable through jagged rock retaining walls behind wall mart to the sharps and rock gardens at hells gate state park.
 

Salami

Turbo Monkey
Jul 17, 2003
1,788
121
Waxhaw, NC
Sir_Crackien said:
salami those rims are not as strong as the mag30's and you know it. also you are compareing a tubeless tire w/tube to a setup with the same tire w/o tube.
:confused: I never said they were, what's your point?

What does it matter whether the tire was tubeless or not? Bottom line was the tube came out and saved almost 13oz. Michelin DH tubes are one of the lighter ones out there at ~365 grams, most that I have seen are 450-550 grams. The Comp 24.1's weigh ~1280 grams which is line with the most of the 2.5 DH tires out there, except Intense which are about 100-150 grams more.


NCrider can't make such a blanket statement like he did when it is incorrect. It is possible to loose weight by going tubeless.
 

Inclag

Turbo Monkey
Sep 9, 2001
2,781
465
MA
Take a look at the Hutchinson Octopus tire in the 2.3" size. It is very very similar to the Michelin Comp16 and has a listed weight of 960 grams. Even if it weighs a bit more than the listed weight, I would still say that it is very light for a downhill tire.

I don't ride them, but I know that Supa8 has one on his rig and he seems to really like it. Maybe you should shoot him a pm.
 

ncrider

Turbo Monkey
Aug 15, 2004
1,564
0
Los Angeles
Salami said:
:confused: I never said they were, what's your point?

What does it matter whether the tire was tubeless or not? Bottom line was the tube came out and saved almost 13oz. Michelin DH tubes are one of the lighter ones out there at ~365 grams, most that I have seen are 450-550 grams. The Comp 24.1's weigh ~1280 grams which is line with the most of the 2.5 DH tires out there, except Intense which are about 100-150 grams more.


NCrider can't make such a blanket statement like he did when it is incorrect. It is possible to loose weight by going tubeless.
Would you race DH on a tubless tire with a tube if you had the choice not to? Then I guess it does matter huh.

Like I said just search the forum and you will find a big battle on this. I honestly wanted to go tubless because I thought it would save me weight.

However, after reading all the hupla I noticed that I might as well stay with what I'm used to. So for an example, up front I have a 2.7 maxxis mobster at 1320grams and a xc tube at 90grams. Yes I run xc tubes and NEVER flat (knock on wood). Total weight 1410grams.

What did you write? oh yeah your tubless tire weighs 1280grams (and it's smaller then mine) + the strip+ all the latex goo mess and you're looking at anywhere from anouther 300-500grams. Total of 1700- 1900 grams.
I know what your thinking... you aren't running a DH tube. Well even if I was and it was the heaviest mofo out there and weighed 500grams, then I'd come in right about the same weight as your tubless set up. :blah:
 

BigStonz

Monkey
Jan 7, 2005
240
0
Swain!! NY
IMO, don't shave grams on tires if you using them for DH/FR. I would suggest the DH casing Blue Groove and Nevegal with reg tubes. Good bang for your buck. I can't count the pinch flats I've had with the Kevlar casing Kendas
 

Salami

Turbo Monkey
Jul 17, 2003
1,788
121
Waxhaw, NC
First off you made a blanket statement which isn't true and I quote
ncrider said:
Not trying to start a tube vs. tubless battle, but the tubless route really isn't any lighter.
If you simply stated "going tubeless will not always save you weight" I would agree and be okay with it. But you continue to state wrong information.




ncrider said:
Would you race DH on a tubless tire with a tube if you had the choice not to? Then I guess it does matter huh.
It doesn't matter that the tires are tubeless compatible. When I bought the tires I had no intentions of running them tubeless. I bought them because they appeared to be the best tire for where and how I ride, they just happened to have UST compatibility. They are only about 50 grams more than most of the Maxxis 2.5's. I know of quite a few people who run Michlein DH tires with tubes because they do not have tubeless rims and for other reasons. Bottom line take ANY tire and rim combination, if you remove the tube the weight of it needs to be removed from the equation.




ncrider said:
Like I said just search the forum and you will find a big battle on this. I honestly wanted to go tubless because I thought it would save me weight.However, after reading all the hupla I noticed that I might as well stay with what I'm used to. So for an example, up front I have a 2.7 maxxis mobster at 1320grams and a xc tube at 90grams. Yes I run xc tubes and NEVER flat (knock on wood). Total weight 1410grams.
I have read ALL of the threads. In your case running a 90 gram XC tube is going to be hard to beat by going tubeless. But I can guarantee that your combination is more likely to pinch flat than mine.





ncrider said:
What did you write? oh yeah your tubless tire weighs 1280grams (and it's smaller then mine) + the strip+ all the latex goo mess and you're looking at anywhere from anouther 300-500grams. Total of 1700- 1900 grams.
I know what your thinking... you aren't running a DH tube. Well even if I was and it was the heaviest mofo out there and weighed 500grams, then I'd come in right about the same weight as your tubless set up. :blah:
More incorrect information. How are you coming up with 1700-1900 grams? 1280 grams + 0 grams is 1280 grams!!! Check my math, it is spot on!
There are no rimstrips or latex goo mess. The rim AND tire combined weigh 1930 grams.


BTW It is TUBELESS. Notice the letter E should be in the word twice. :blah:
 

Jeremy R

<b>x</b>
Nov 15, 2001
9,703
1,067
behind you with a snap pop
Yep, it does not take a brain surgeon to figure out that a proper tubeless setup is way lighter. It saved over 2 pounds on my bike as well.
And I got better traction, easier mounting, no flats, and awesome performance. Using Michelin UST tires and those 823 rims will spoil you from using anything else. No sealant and no mess. Yeah, you can use thick walled DH tires and stretch out a XC tube in there, but if you ride with sharp rocks, it is just a matter of time.
All that said, even though the system is great, the 823 rims just don't hold up well enough for me, so I am trying something else this year. Why more companies are not making UST rims is beyond me.
 

ncrider

Turbo Monkey
Aug 15, 2004
1,564
0
Los Angeles
Hey Salami thanks for the corrections.
I guess I got all fixated on ghetto or stans TUBELESS set up because thats what I was considering. However, the proper ust rim tire set up, like yours, is clearly lighter. Cool I should probly stop speed reading post and actually pay attention :rolleyes: