[slyfink]

Interesting thoughts being shared by Fairclough and reported over on Dirt: https://dirtmountainbike.com/news/brendan-fairclough-leads-calls-world-cups-cut-30-riders.html

"Speaking to Lifeproof yesterday, Fairclough said: “In my opinion I’d like to see less athletes, so at the moment we have 80+ taking to the track, I’d prefer to see 30 of the fastest competing.”

Fairclough believes this would allow the UCI to use steeper, gnarlier, more technical courses that would create a better race for spectators. It could also open up further opportunity for sponsors to get involved as top riders are guaranteed airtime on Red Bull.


Read more at https://dirtmountainbike.com/news/brendan-fairclough-leads-calls-world-cups-cut-30-riders.html#DMRdiLwouKbrPIWx.99"

Hadn't thought of that before. I can see why he's proposing it, but that means there'd be plenty of times he wouldn't have made it...

I think I'm ok with the current situation where 80 qualify, but only 20 are televised. The other 60 can still get airtime through team edits and such. If you only ran 30, then the slower guys, or the ones that mucked up, get zilch. I don't think that would grow the sport. but what do I know?!

 

[Bikael Molton]

How would fewer competitors make tracks better? 80 IS a lot though.

i wish top 30 were televised still.

 

[jonKranked]

i see his point to a degree, however my first concern is that it would have the unintended side effect of reducing the overall number of riders. if it becomes even harder to make the finals, a lot of people may decide its not worth racing.

 

[Jeremy R]

Odd one to champion this as Fairclough has been outside the top 30 a decent amount in his world cup career.....
but that is none of my business.

 

[mykel]

Odd one to champion this as Fairclough has been outside the top 30 a decent amount in his world cup career.....
but that is none of my business.

Pretty much what I was thinking as well....

 

['size]

Odd one to champion this as Fairclough has been outside the top 30 a decent amount in his world cup career.....
but that is none of my business.

i'm guessing it goes along with his long vocal stance on how the courses aren't right for him. if the courses meet his needs better maybe he thinks he'll be up there.

 

[trib]

Yeah that's ripe coming from Fairclough.

Limiting races to 30 riders would make it even harder to support racing. If there's only 30 teams, instead of the 80+ that a full race brings where does the money come from? Charge entrants even more? How do you become one of the magical thirty selected to race, does every race need some kind of worlds selection process?

If there are only 30 riders do you even have qualification times? 10 rider finals?

The current system isn't great but this proposal is laughable.

More races on harder tracks would be great but to paraphrase an old Dirt article, "if you think the tracks too easy, but don't win, it's not too easy"

 

[norbar]

As much as I like him isn't this just another way of saying "I don't win because the courses don't suit me" ? The thing he can organize a super gnar race like the Athertons or Vink.

The idea is bad since many people who from time to time get great results and break through after a few seasons would not start. Hell it could hurt riders who in 2016 have great seasons but did not perform well before like Brayton, Williamson, Kerr, Fearon. It could also hurt privaters who won't' be able to find sponsors given the chances to quality are much lower. Those privaters often post top20 results but they are not consistent since they can't be on all races.

 

[captainspauldin]

I feel like if they were to switch to a 30 racer format, they wouldn't be able to have protected riders(is it top 20 or top 10?). Either way I'm not a fan of limiting to 30, always fun to see the privateers hang it out and get a good run..

 

[sethimus]

As much as I like him isn't this just another way of saying "I don't win because the courses don't suit me" ? The thing he can organize a super gnar race like the Athertons or Vink.

The idea is bad since many people who from time to time get great results and break through after a few seasons would not start. Hell it could hurt riders who in 2016 have great seasons but did not perform well before like Brayton, Williamson, Kerr, Fearon. It could also hurt privaters who won't' be able to find sponsors given the chances to quality are much lower. Those privaters often post top20 results but they are not consistent since they can't be on all races.

it could also strengthen race series like the european downhill series where you could make your name before entering the world cup

 

[norbar]

it could also strengthen race series like the european downhill series where you could make your name before entering the world cup

If it's not televised and there is less media presence then there will be less sponsors. Even if the small series will win the riders will loose due to fragmented media exposure

 

[ianjenn]

I feel the tracks could be more technical for them, they could have the holy hell I may die line and the go around that is a few seconds slower. The riders should be scared of a number of sections I feel. They should be harder than the trails they practice on.

 

[canadmos]

Since when is less the answer? We need MOAR. More races that is...

 

[kickstand]

I feel the tracks could be more technical for them, they could have the holy hell I may die line and the go around that is a few seconds slower. The riders should be scared of a number of sections I feel. They should be harder than the trails they practice on.

I'm just a weekend warrior, but I hate the tracks where I feel like I almost died 5 times per run, that's not super fun.

 

[jonKranked]

I'm just a weekend warrior, but I hate the tracks where I feel like I almost died 5 times per run, that's not super fun.

i'm with you. while i do agree that their should be challenging sections/features of the track, i'm of the opinion that as a race, you are racing against the clock, not the track. the winner shouldn't be determined by which handful of riders are willing / able to ride high risk sections/features.

 

[Gary]

Dudes.

He's saying he'd like only 30 to race finals. (Don't think there's any mention of how many riders he's proposing to allow to attempt to qualify).
Kinda makes sense. If you were to raise the series to 14 rounds there are only about 30 guys who'd have enough backing to afford to do a full WC season anyway.

I'd be happiest with the format remaining pretty much as is but with way MOAR rounds. Bringing a few old skool tracks back into the mix would be cool too..

 

[kickstand]

i'm with you. while i do agree that their should be challenging sections/features of the track, i'm of the opinion that as a race, you are racing against the clock, not the track. the winner shouldn't be determined by which handful of riders are willing / able to ride high risk sections/features.

yup

I mean the track should be difficult, and it should present challenge, and it should require a full on DH bike, and there should be some big features/chutes/steeps/etc that you contemplate hitting or going around....but it should also remain fun, not death defying.

I think I've had a couple of these weekends (2 or 3 stick out, mainly for a section or two not for the whole track) and looking back they were far more stressful and less enjoyable than the weekends spent on "easy" tracks.

I get that it's world cup, but super hard doesn't always equal super fun. Super fun does not always equal super easy either.

 

[Gary]

should require a full on DH bike

WTF does this mean?

Bearing in mind current tracks ie. Fort William (roughest?) Champery (steepest?) are both rideable on a hardtail. What are you proposing ?

 

[kickstand]

WTF does this mean?

Bearing in mind current tracks ie. Fort William (roughest?) Champery (steepest?) are both rideable on a hardtail. What are you proposing ?

being rideable is one thing (I'd argue most world cup tracks or any trail for that matter is rideable on a hardtail) but it shouldn't be smooth enough or flat enough that you are faster on a trail bike. In general a DH bike should be your best option for the track.

 

[jonKranked]

WTF does this mean?

Bearing in mind current tracks ie. Fort William (roughest?) Champery (steepest?) are both rideable on a hardtail. What are you proposing ?

anything is rideable on a hardtail. it might completely fucking suck, but you *could* ride it.

 

[Gary]

being rideable is one thing (I'd argue most world cup tracks or any trail for that matter is rideable on a hardtail) but it shouldn't be smooth enough or flat enough that you are faster on a trail bike. In general a DH bike should be your best option for the track.

Barring a little kid called Nicolas on a Zaskar 2 decades ago has a World Cup ever been won on anything but a DH bike?
Your point seems mute.

 

[jonKranked]

Barring a little kid called Nicolas on a Zaskar 2 decades ago has a World Cup ever been won on anything but a DH bike?
Your point seems mute.

pretty sure cairns was won at least once on a ~6" bike with a single crown fork.

 

[slimshady]

pretty sure cairns was won at least once on a ~6" bike with a single crown fork.

What about Sea Otter or Pietermaritzburg (or whatever it's called)? I agree with you, designing a Joyride course is one thing, and building a WC DH track it's a totally different beast.

 

[Bikael Molton]

I still don't get what limiting the finals to 30 actually does? Makes the top30 guys not have to wait around with tummy butterflies as long on race day?

How does amount of riders make better tracks? If anything, limiting the amount of wheels down the courses would ensure the tracks stay together better, keeping them more groomed and stable.

 

[jonKranked]

What about Sea Otter or Pietermaritzburg (or whatever it's called)? I agree with you, designing a Joyride course is one thing, and building a WC DH track it's a totally different beast.

sea otter isn't world cup, but yea. and i forgot about pietermaritzbergggggg. people were riding short travel bikes for sure, can't remember if it was won by one.

reminds me of this though:

http://www.sicklines.com/projects/iron-horse-sso/

 

[Gary]

pretty sure

won't cut it here bro

Bruni won Cairns on a Demo with Boxxers
Gee Won Cairns on a GT Fury? with 40s in borrowed 5:10s and flat pedals
Vouilloz did win Worlds there on a sub 6" GT LTS DH but with OG Boxxers not single crowns... Back in 1996

This is RIDEMONKEY. If you can't provide FACTS... You sure as hell NEED to back up your argument with graphs. preferably coloured in.

 

[jonKranked]

won't cut it here bro

Bruni won Cairns on a Demo with Boxxers
Gee Won Cairns on a GT Fury? with 40s in borrowed 5:10s and flat pedals
Vouilloz did win Worlds there on a sub 6" GT LTS DH but with OG Boxxers not single crowns... Back in 1996

This is RIDEMONKEY. If you can't provide FACTS... You sure as hell NEED to back up your argument with graphs. preferably coloured in.

fuck off grandpa. go eat some prunes and shit yoself.

 

[jonKranked]

steve peat used to race dh on a rigid, because that's what they did 80 years ago. you should challenge him

 

[kickstand]

Barring a little kid called Nicolas on a Zaskar 2 decades ago has a World Cup ever been won on anything but a DH bike?
Your point seems mute.

Didn't gwin win on an enduro once?

It may be a moot point, as it should be. My point was simply that tracks that are terrifying aren't fun, but they should still be difficult.

 

[Gary]

Didn't gwin win on an enduro once?

Yes. a 180mm travel one with a 40 upfront a coil shock and mainly DH parts.
Petermaritzberg.

http://www.vitalmtb.com/photos/features/WINNING-BIKE-Aaron-Gwins-Prototype-Specialized-Enduro-EVO-27-5,7436/WINNING-BIKE-Aaron-Gwins-Prototype-Specialized-Enduro-EVO-27-5,74293/sspomer,2

Probably a fair bit better DH bike than mine most folk on here's.
I'm sure @Udi could provide graphs to dispute my claim tho

I'm with you on not having any moar Petermaritzbergs tho

 

[kickstand]

I mean I agree, an enduro is a nice bike...but what else will we bicker about while stuck at work or kids baseball games right?

 

[Udi]

Probably a fair bit better DH bike than mine most folk on here's.
I'm sure @Udi could provide graphs to dispute my claim tho

Come on @Gary, graphs didn't even exist in 1765 AD. Maybe we could go exploring for some ancient rock scrawlings that describe the kinematics of your bike though.

 

[maxyedor]

Why couldn't you have 80 people race, on a gnarly track, and extend the coverage to the top 30? Would that not work? I think it could work.

If you're going to limit finals, you kinda also have to get rid of qualifying. No point for a company to send a rider halfway across the world if they won't even get to ride on race day. You'd have to use the national series like qualifying, but most are pretty piss poor, which would only double down on the dumb associated with this idea.

 

[norbar]

I feel the tracks could be more technical for them, they could have the holy hell I may die line and the go around that is a few seconds slower. The riders should be scared of a number of sections I feel. They should be harder than the trails they practice on.

Wait what? Serious injuries will hurt our sport, not help it. Enduro is already syphoning people from dh. I'm a fan of difficult trails but a good mix like Schladming seems like the sweet spot.

Not to mention going to fewer riders will not make trails better given that even though we can have schladming we sometimes get canbera.

 

[sethimus]

being rideable is one thing (I'd argue most world cup tracks or any trail for that matter is rideable on a hardtail) but it shouldn't be smooth enough or flat enough that you are faster on a trail bike. In general a DH bike should be your best option for the track.

which rider won a race on a trail bike?

 

[kickstand]

which rider won a race on a trail bike?

Gwin won on an enduro, did you miss that post? Ropaleto has also at least raced an enduro and how about all the short travel prototypes built for worlds a few years back...Stevie's devinci comes to mind....

 

[norbar]

Gwin won on an enduro, did you miss that post? Ropaleto has also at least raced an enduro and how about all the short travel prototypes built for worlds a few years back...Stevie's devinci comes to mind....

And then Peaty won Canberra on a V10 against a ton of people riding trailbikes.

Also didn't a lot of people riding PMB on trailbikes last year crash?

 

[slyfink]

Gwin won on an enduro, did you miss that post? Ropaleto has also at least raced an enduro and how about all the short travel prototypes built for worlds a few years back...Stevie's devinci comes to mind....

Didn't Graves come in second on an SB66 one year as well?

 

[kickstand]

Didn't Graves come in second on an SB66 one year as well?

I think yes.

I mean, in fairness, you're always going to have a little of that, I was just saying we should strike the balance of difficult enough to want your DH bike, but not so difficult you feel like you are going to die. Tough balance...

 

[slyfink]

I think yes.

I mean, in fairness, you're always going to have a little of that, I was just saying we should strike the balance of difficult enough to want your DH bike, but not so difficult you feel like you are going to die. Tough balance...

I agree with what you're saying. There's a middle ground between Pietermaritzburg/Canberra and Hardline, and that middle ground is a great place for downhill mountain bike racing!