Living off grid
- Thread starter Jozz
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I read a good book about this same topic about a year ago; it is available for free via Kindle, so I highly suggest checking it out. I'll come back with the book name when I find it.
Biggest hurdles in the author's mind were electricity, water, and financing.
On the electricity front, if power is not available at the build site, it can be prohibitively expensive getting it there. In his case, there were lines running on his neighbors property 1 mile away, but it would cost $80K which had to be paid up front as well as concessions from his neighbor to allow poles on his land. Basically it was a non-starter. From there he suggested a combination of solar and wind, with a generator backup. Municipal regulations in some areas dictate how much capacity you must have available for a residence, so that's something to look into.
Water wise, drilling a well can also be very expensive, depending upon the water table. You could run $30K just drilling the well, perhaps more if it's tough to get the drilling rig out to your build site. You'll have to consider cutting a road, pulling stumps, grading, etc...In the event that a well is impractical, you'll be trucking in all of your water, which, while doable, may prove to be a giant pain.
Financing can also be tricky. The majority of the banks will not finance building an off-grid property like a traditional build. He basically ran into a catch-22 where the bank wouldn't lend him money because there was no structure to warrant collateral, but he couldn't establish collateral without structure. In the end, he had to get a personal loan with it's ridiculous interest rate, then hustle to get the house built, then he could apply for a more traditional loan using the already built house as collateral. Risky part going this route is if the schedule begins to slip, you start paying significant sums in interest. He also mentioned opening up credit cards with interest free periods, but again, paying 22% on an $80K balance will add up fast.
All of this will become a bit more of a moot point if you intend to build something a bit more rustic, and do so out of pocket, but you'll still have to address #1 and #2. Clearly there are plenty of people who have establishments like this, but you'll just have to ensure you are well educated surrounding the idiosyncrasies before leaping in.
Interested in the book.
ELECTRICITY - Biggest hurdle indeed. The land in question got a small summit and lots of elevation changes. So wind generator is an option Mandatory solar panels and storage. Backup generator is also a must. Would have to look at regulation about being of grid.
WATER: - Water would come from a drilled well. It's pretty common around here. Most drilled wells cost around 10-12k. We already had planned that on our current house project on our smaller lot. Same thing for the $10k septic installation. Electricity comes in play also for the water pump, so it need to be available yearly.
MONEY - No financing would be needed, but the land would eat about $75k out of our initial house project on the smaller lot.
Some other considerations: Snow plowing, gas appliances, masonry heaters, internet, cell reception.
It's a pretty embryonic project. First step is to go walk the land.
So what you're saying is that it's like the usual PITA that is home ownership, plus a whole bunch MORE PITA?
Sounds like a PITA.
Personally, I would like the grid to be a little more faster and reliable, k thx.
No one said subtracting ourselves from the realm of mouth breathers would be easy.So what you're saying is that it's like the usual PITA that is home ownership, plus a whole bunch MORE PITA?
Sounds like a PITA.
You tell me! I would be a bit closer to you.
Dude. Haven't you heard?
Shouldn't you be going the other way, away from the cities?You tell me! I would be a bit closer to you.
That would be the plan. Healthcare is covered. Major hospital probably an hour away.What is with access to health care/ER? I assume you want to ride your bike on your property and build legit backyard trails?
There is already a mountain nearby with lots of trails of the gnar kind.
Trails potential in the area seems to be unlimited.
I'm very interested to see where this goes, but I really don't have any expertise to lend unfortunately. Thanks for the tag though @johnbryanpeters
black fly pie
Buy it and post a thread on the monkey about your building endeavors. You know, kind of like the car buying threads or deck building threads. It will provide us on-grid people with entertainment. Or just start a Youtube channel.
A stream, or maybe a small river, seems to border the land, but hard to tell the size of it from sat images. Will need to check this out.
if it was something with enough flow i'd say maybe look into small scale hydroelectric but depending on size and where it falls in relation to the parcel it may be a nonstarter.
Sounds like you have at least some idea of how difficult this could be. If you're up for the challenge however, it could be super rad for sure.
The water/electricity thing is a challenge. Assuming the well will be relatively deep you'll need power for a pump. I've got a 4 acre parcel that came with a well already drilled and power available from the local utility. We had to build a small structure before they would turn on the power but all things considered that was luxuriously easy compared to what you're talking about. If you're relying on solar or wind you will definitely want to "bank" some power.
If there are specific areas you'd want or need to build, make sure you check it out before you buy. Look into building restrictions, whether as a matter of code, environmental issues, easements or other restrictions in the record, etc. The fact that there is running water on or adjacent could be really great but could also limit if/where you can build. Septic could be a challenge as well, depending. That's a big chunk of land for sure but don't assume you can do whatever you want out there.
There may be a reason "the price is right", especially if it's been on the market for a while, and some will say you should wait to see what happens with the real estate market given the covid crisis. But if you go in with eyes open and at least some understanding of how hard it will be, it could be really awesome.
The water/electricity thing is a challenge. Assuming the well will be relatively deep you'll need power for a pump. I've got a 4 acre parcel that came with a well already drilled and power available from the local utility. We had to build a small structure before they would turn on the power but all things considered that was luxuriously easy compared to what you're talking about. If you're relying on solar or wind you will definitely want to "bank" some power.
If there are specific areas you'd want or need to build, make sure you check it out before you buy. Look into building restrictions, whether as a matter of code, environmental issues, easements or other restrictions in the record, etc. The fact that there is running water on or adjacent could be really great but could also limit if/where you can build. Septic could be a challenge as well, depending. That's a big chunk of land for sure but don't assume you can do whatever you want out there.
There may be a reason "the price is right", especially if it's been on the market for a while, and some will say you should wait to see what happens with the real estate market given the covid crisis. But if you go in with eyes open and at least some understanding of how hard it will be, it could be really awesome.
You need to binge watch "Building off the Grid" and see what those ding dongs do and don't think about. Some have zero experience, DIYers, and some just hire contractors. But it's a shit show and funny to watch the episodes unfold.
Maybe put an application in to be featured on the show..
Maybe put an application in to be featured on the show..
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Yeah, the most important part is if you can get a Discovery Channel show, then you can get electrical, water, plumbing, sewage, etc. They'll probably build you a road to get the cameras in there, etc. Then you can make up stories about how hard it is to survive, etc.
I know several people who were featured on those shows as contractors. My wife was on This Old House when a friend installed a water feature/rain cistern at our house.
TV shows don’t cover anything and the only guarantee is that they will make life more difficult. 1/10 would not bang.
TV shows don’t cover anything and the only guarantee is that they will make life more difficult. 1/10 would not bang.
I stayed in some cabins in McCarthy, AK that were completely self sufficient with electric, bathrooms, water, solar, well, etc. a few years ago. It's possible, but it would take a good deal of planning and capital IMO. Solar ain't cheap. Need ample wood for heating and be prepared. Backup gen possibly heating-oil system/propane. In NorCal we used to live for days at a time with no power, due to heavy snow. We were always prepared with good wood-burning stove, ability to cook on it, chords of wood, etc. It's not that big of a stretch IMO with how technology has evolved. As mentioned above, there are hydroelectric systems that siphon off streams, windmills, etc.
The key word is "getting away from mouth breathers" so no go.
Thanks for that. Since I'm an architect (not) I know a lot about everything construction wise. A bit about solar systems since I've build a van. I'm pretty handy and already live somewhat recluse. SO feels the same way. We know nothing or not much about being a bit more sufficient, like taking care of a garden or having a chicken coop.
The land is priced as is cause of said access to power. There is two possible access to the land.
I know all about permitting and land restrictions in regards to wetlands and river protection band.
Biggest challenge would be adapting to even more solitude and implanting in a new region. My dad and brother would now be two hours away instead of 45 minutes.
But first thing first, need to see the land.
my parents are 4+ hours away, and my sister is 7. what's your point?
The wife and I have been looking at this, but not as a primary residence. At least not now or yet. I have a plan for a 2 container house I want to build. Still looking for a spot.
I could see myself building a nice camp at first and planning the house after. The camp would serve as a guest house after, something tiny that I could build all by myself. Would try to build it with harvested wood from the land, so would need a portable sawmill.