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Look The New G-boxx Ellsworth Dare !!!

Alejandro24

Chimp
Aug 21, 2005
15
0
What do you think?? I like the fact that more brands are exploring the "trans-box"concept. hmmm... i want a time machine and go 5 years in the future.. :rolleyes:
 

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Gex

Turbo Monkey
Oct 29, 2004
1,112
0
Seattle
Wow go ellsworth for going outside and creating a dare frame that is actuelly unique.
 

sanjuro

Tube Smuggler
Sep 13, 2004
17,411
0
SF
V-Dub said:
Why am I always the last to know about this kindof stuff?
You have to work on your industry contacts... Maybe you should try to meet more riders? :love:
 

Nick

My name is Nick
Sep 21, 2001
15,570
3,821
behind you, don't wait up.
according to the riptv interview on Pinkbike ... the gearbox in this bike is a product of HAYES. I believe EW is the only US company to be using Hayes' gearbox at this time, but they mentioned another European companywhich I can't recall.
 

Alejandro24

Chimp
Aug 21, 2005
15
0
Nick said:
according to the riptv interview on Pinkbike ... the gearbox in this bike is a product of HAYES. I believe EW is the only US company to be using Hayes' gearbox at this time, but they mentioned another European companywhich I can't recall.

HAYES?? ahhh that´s the "Petespeed" gearboxx tha they bougth from Be One, a dutch bike company.. they using it in their team DH rig, check them out:

www.petespeed.com
www.beone-bikes.com
 

atrokz

Turbo Monkey
Mar 14, 2002
1,556
79
teedotohdot
FYI people:

'G-Boxx' is a Nicolai based moniker. G-Box might be more appropriate for this bike, as it's akin to calling every SUV a 'Jeep' (which I know irritates some of you on here).

That being said, I can’t say I'm a fan of this system, as it's still a derailleur in a box, which means the same alignment issues, wear issues, and maintenance issues that come with a cog based system. At least they are looking forward however.
 

Alejandro24

Chimp
Aug 21, 2005
15
0
Sorry for the "G-boxx".. i didn´t know how to write it :o:
What i like about that picture is the fact that some companies are building protos that looks a lot diferent from what we are use to watch.. for me that´s "evolution"... :blah:
 

zmtber

Turbo Monkey
Aug 13, 2005
2,437
0
that is a bike that i would like....as long as i don't have to get it in that color
 

xy9ine

Turbo Monkey
Mar 22, 2004
2,845
236
vancouver eastside
atrokz said:
That being said, I can’t say I'm a fan of this system, as it's still a derailleur in a box, which means the same alignment issues, wear issues, and maintenance issues that come with a cog based system. At least they are looking forward however.
agreed. having to open a cogbox to adjust & maintain the bits inside doesn't sound like a fun chore; given the added weight & proprietary bits, the appeal over a conventional deraileur system is reduced. ideally we should have transmissions with similar reliabilty to motorbikes - ie, years without maintenance outside of oil changes. how cool would that be? the rohloff is the closest thing out there, but it needs refinement for frame - mounted applications. i'd like to think they (rohloff) see a future in the g-boxx system & are working on something specifically designed. maybe one of the giants (shimano / sram) have something up their sleeves; they've definately got the engineering/financial firepower to do something really cool...
 

bballe336

Turbo Monkey
Mar 3, 2005
1,757
0
MA
the petespeed/hayes box looks pretty interesting. it seems very similar to honda's gearbox designs (at least internally). but that bike is gross.
 

zedro

Turbo Monkey
Sep 14, 2001
4,160
0
at the end of the longest line
atrokz said:
That being said, I can’t say I'm a fan of this system, as it's still a derailleur in a box, which means the same alignment issues, wear issues, and maintenance issues that come with a cog based system. At least they are looking forward however.
what alignment issues? the main sprocket displaces from side to side giving a perfect chain alignment each gear; the sprockets itself acts as a part of the shifting mechanism.

I don't think people understand how it works, its not a derailleur in a box really (the Honda seems more like that) just because it uses a cog-chain based system. It can be sealed, always lubed, always aligned, very low wear, and actually user servicible.

This system there looks kinda wacky tho, really big, not like the more compact Petespeed.
 

atrokz

Turbo Monkey
Mar 14, 2002
1,556
79
teedotohdot
zedro said:
what alignment issues? .
Perhaps it wasn't clear enough, sorry. To better explain: The Petespeed system still relys on a 'derailiuer' inside right? Even if that derailiuer is continualy moving, it may still need alignment every so often (due to teeth being worn, stops coming loose or wearing, etc) as it's a chain & cog system which means good alignment is key. Even so, a continualy sliding part will wear down it's guide which in turn will create alignment issues as well. Granted it's better than conventional with reagrds to durability but my guess is it's still not Rohloff reliable . My concerns are in this becoming missaligned over continual use which is not the case in typical (note: conventional bicycle transmissions not being typical) transmission systems. Hope that helps.

That being said, I see it this way:

Light weight = cogs and chains
Durability = typical motor transmission

So the question I ask is will new materials and manufacturing processes make light what was once considered heavy.
 

Jeremy R

<b>x</b>
Nov 15, 2001
9,514
585
behind you with a snap pop
Inclag said:
Why can't Ellsworth please go away??
I don't understand this honestly.
How the hell do they stay in business?
There are thousands of stories online about people getting screwed over by them, their frames are known for snapping, and half of the negative talk about them comes from the owner being such a douche. I know people personally who rode their bikes, detroyed them, got shafted and moved on. Whether its on the web or the trail, people relentlessly abuse the company, yet year after after year, they are still around while companies like Ibis could not sell enough bikes to eat.
I have never owned one, and have no personal experience with them, but it makes you wonder who in still buying these bikes? :think:
 

Inclag

Turbo Monkey
Sep 9, 2001
2,351
73
MA
Jeremy R said:
I don't understand this honestly.
How the hell do they stay in business?
There are thousands of stories online about people getting screwed over by them, their frames are known for snapping, and half of the negative talk about them comes from the owner being such a douche. I know people personally who rode their bikes, detroyed them, got shafted and moved on. Whether its on the web or the trail, people relentlessly abuse the company, yet year after after year, they are still around while companies like Ibis could not sell enough bikes to eat.
I have never owned one, and have no personal experience with them, but it makes you wonder who in still buying these bikes? :think:
The secret is gothic lettering. It has to be THE only reason.
 

oly

skin cooker for the hive
Dec 6, 2001
5,119
6
Witness relocation housing
Jeremy R said:
I don't understand this honestly.
How the hell do they stay in business?
See: MTBR threads about non Horst Turners.

Hope this seriously cuts into TE's padded budget... that 7 page catalog insert cant be cheap....
 

patineto

The RM Mad Scientist
Feb 19, 2002
935
0
berkeley, ca
Alejandro24 said:
HAYES?? ahhh that´s the "Petespeed" gearboxx tha they bougth from Be One, a dutch bike company.. they using it in their team DH rig, check them out:

www.petespeed.com
www.beone-bikes.com
The Petespeed is a thing of beauty in terms of simplisity


really really cool concept, plus i'm sure will be cheaper to produce than the Planetary gear sistems that require really high tolerances.
 

dhkid

Turbo Monkey
Mar 10, 2005
3,359
0
Malaysia
julian_dh said:
is it just me or dose that look like a v10 somehow?
:stupid:
thats what haapens when you leave v-10 and a honda in a room for a long time. :think: they should call it RN-10. :cool:
 
Apr 9, 2004
516
8
Mount Carmel,PA
V-Dub said:
Why am I always the last to know about this kindof stuff?
IT'S AMAZING, IT ALWAYS SEEMS THE FIRST PEOPLE WHO SHOULD KNOW ARE ALWAYS THE LAST. IT IS SO WIERD THAT CUSTOMERS KNOW MORE ABOUT MY VENDORS NEW PRODUCT OFFERINGS THAN I DO. WHY CANT MORE MANUFACTURERS RELEASE DEALERS NEWS LETTERS. FOR ONCE IT WOULD BE NICE TO BE ONE STEP AHED INSTED OF A HALF STEP BEHIND!!
 

DHS

Friendly Neighborhood Pool Boy
Apr 23, 2002
5,100
0
Sand, CA
teamkranzelbike said:
IT'S AMAZING, IT ALWAYS SEEMS THE FIRST PEOPLE WHO SHOULD KNOW ARE ALWAYS THE LAST. IT IS SO WIERD THAT CUSTOMERS KNOW MORE ABOUT MY VENDORS NEW PRODUCT OFFERINGS THAN I DO. WHY CANT MORE MANUFACTURERS RELEASE DEALERS NEWS LETTERS. FOR ONCE IT WOULD BE NICE TO BE ONE STEP AHED INSTED OF A HALF STEP BEHIND!!
everything will be ok. calm down.
 

RhinofromWA

Brevity R Us
Aug 16, 2001
4,625
0
Lynnwood, WA
I don't see a picture. :think:

But seriously, How much do you have to spend for a cracked peice of MTB art? Cuz after a few rides it is only good for hanging on the wall.
 

Tootrikky

Monkey
Jul 31, 2003
772
0
Mount Vernon
Jeremy R said:
I don't understand this honestly.
How the hell do they stay in business?
:

I have asked more than one person who's just getting in to the sport, been reading some mags and such, which kind of bike they want and they say an Ellsworth. Than you look at their 15 page spread in MBA and all their marketing lingo, put yourself in their shoes, and realise that you would probably be a sucker too!
 

zedro

Turbo Monkey
Sep 14, 2001
4,160
0
at the end of the longest line
atrokz said:
Perhaps it wasn't clear enough, sorry. To better explain: .....
lots of assumption there, and i dont feel the type of mechanism it uses (a linear slider vs the 4bar linkages of deraillers) will have any of those problems. In fact the generic type of wear you talk of could be "assumed" in a planetary style system too, that is not exempt from wear.

The key i believe will be in how well the system is indexed, but the problem is much simpler than a derailler system (look at the pics). The big difference is it wont be jarred around but rather be self-contained and properly constrained. I wouldnt be surprised if cog/chain systems become the IT standard

btw i started playing around with these designs in the concept phase before the Petespeed was revealed so i am a bit biased :D
 

OGRipper

Turbo Monkey
Feb 3, 2004
9,766
192
NORCAL is the hizzle
zedro said:
i dont feel the type of mechanism it uses (a linear slider vs the 4bar linkages of deraillers) will have any of those problems.
I agree with most of what you say but there is an ongoing debate as to whether rear derailleurs are four bar, faux bar, horst link, single pivot, or VPP... :p

Seriously, I also don't see excessive wear being a problem, the system will stay pretty clean and once set up should be good to go for a long time. If wear is an issue in the way suggested, hopefully individual parts will be available in the same way hayes makes their brake parts available. I think the real questions are about performance advantages vs. the desire for simplicity (see KISS rule), adapting the system to good suspension designs, and cost.
 

zedro

Turbo Monkey
Sep 14, 2001
4,160
0
at the end of the longest line
OGRipper said:
I think the real questions are about performance advantages vs. the desire for simplicity (see KISS rule), adapting the system to good suspension designs, and cost.
yeah my worry has been the potential for say a jam, and weither that can be corrected on the trail. That meant access was needed which causes some design problems if you want an otherwise sealed system.

what could be neat is since there are already 10 speed cogsets out there, having such a tight system could make them much more reliable.