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Lots of non-Maxxis tires at Ft. Bill

Pslide

Turbo Monkey
Anyone else notice how many Schwalbes on the pros bikes now?

Have a gander...

http://www.pinkbike.com/news/Fort-William-2011--The-Story.html

(And all running directionally the wrong way according to Kidwoo!)

Blenki and Cam Cole are one Hutchinson Bulldogs the best I can gather.

And the Athertons are finally actually on Contis and experimenting with new compound. And possibly tubeless, not sure on that one. (Note: Dan flatted.)

Lappierre team truck...not a Maxxis in sight...



The times they are a changin...
 

p-spec

Turbo Monkey
May 2, 2004
1,278
1
quebec
I hate my minions.

who else hates.

Anyone prefer dual highrollers ???

Or any other ust tire.
 

SuspectDevice

Turbo Monkey
Aug 23, 2002
4,157
359
Roanoke, VA
:eek:
That shot is almost perfect
It reminds me of an old Dirt cover with Martin Murray and Peaty banging bars in a 4x race. The whole sequence is rad.

Also-
Lapierre wasn't running Deemax Ultimate wheelsets this weekend- looks like the standard 823 powdercoated yellow. The Ultimate rims are know to be intentionally softer to avoid flatting. I wonder what that says about the tires?
 

Nagaredama

Turbo Monkey
Nov 15, 2004
1,596
2
Manhattan Beach, CA USA
It reminds me of an old Dirt cover with Martin Murray and Peaty banging bars in a 4x race. The whole sequence is rad.

Also-
Lapierre wasn't running Deemax Ultimate wheelsets this weekend- looks like the standard 823 powdercoated yellow. The Ultimate rims are know to be intentionally softer to avoid flatting. I wonder what that says about the tires?
I thought they were running Easton wheels.

 

kidwoo

Artisanal Tweet Curator
That one of hart is lacking the eyes....THE EYES!!!!


I like this better...
Kidwoo, I did flop my Nobby Nics around on my trail bike and tried them both directions...I can't really tell the difference.
Soft compound?


The angles on that one in particular aren't overly exaggerated like some tires are so there should be less of a difference in how they bite. However......as with most of my gripes with tires, there are plenty of reasons to run that tire opposite their recommended direction, and zero to run it the way they suggest (other than as a rear which you might want to break loose a little easier). Like most companies they're just trying to do something that sets them apart.....and not all of it has to do with actually making a well thought out superior product.

As a front tire, I'd LOVE to hear someone from schwalbe tell me why they suggest running it that way. Because although subtle on that particular tread, the general idea of the angles they've put into those sideknobs release dirt from the angle they'll be leaned into, not grab it. But hey maybe a front tire that breaks loose more than it helps you steer is what they're after. I doubt it though. (For what it's worth, I'm mostly talking sideknobs here)

I bet you'd be able to tell the difference on a hard compound version on some dry loose stuff. But then again....maybe not.
 
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CBJ

year old fart
Mar 19, 2002
12,863
4,162
Copenhagen, Denmark
Just bought a set of Minions today. With the price of Maxxis I would love to see some alternatives and I have to say it's about time.
 

tacubaya

Monkey
Dec 19, 2009
720
89
Mexico City
Tip for all guys here wanting Schwalbes.

BUY THEM DIRECTLY FROM GERMANY.

www.bike-components.de

Shipping is rediculously inexpensive (10 Euros for 4 Wire tires) and prices are great.

A friend of mine and me bought 4 Muddy Marys wire (2 Vertstar and 2 Performance) with shipping included for $175
 

captainspauldin

intrigued by a pole
May 14, 2007
1,263
177
Jersey Shore
Tip for all guys here wanting Schwalbes.

BUY THEM DIRECTLY FROM GERMANY.

www.bike-components.de

Shipping is rediculously inexpensive (10 Euros for 4 Wire tires) and prices are great.

A friend of mine and me bought 4 Muddy Marys wire (2 Vertstar and 2 Performance) with shipping included for $175
What's the difference between the performance and the vertstar, other than the price?
 

tacubaya

Monkey
Dec 19, 2009
720
89
Mexico City
What's the difference between the performance and the vertstar, other than the price?
Durometer.

Vertstar is the softest compound, performance is very hard.

Schwalbe used to call the softest compound Gooey Gluey, then came Triple Compound and then Performance.

Now the softest is Vertstar, then comes Trailstar and then Pacestar.
 

buckoW

Turbo Monkey
Mar 1, 2007
3,777
4,700
Champery, Switzerland
That one of hart is lacking the eyes....THE EYES!!!!




Soft compound?


The angles on that one in particular aren't overly exaggerated like some tires are so there should be less of a difference in how they bite. However......as with most of my gripes with tires, there are plenty of reasons to run that tire opposite their recommended direction, and zero to run it the way they suggest (other than as a rear which you might want to break loose a little easier). Like most companies they're just trying to do something that sets them apart.....and not all of it has to do with actually making a well thought out superior product.

As a front tire, I'd LOVE to hear someone from schwalbe tell me why they suggest running it that way. Because although subtle on that particular tread, the general idea of the angles they've put into those sideknobs release dirt from the angle they'll be leaned into, not grab it. But hey maybe a front tire that breaks loose more than it helps you steer is what they're after. I doubt it though. (For what it's worth, I'm mostly talking sideknobs here)

I bet you'd be able to tell the difference on a hard compound version on some dry loose stuff. But then again....maybe not.
Schwalbe says they angle the side knobs like they do for off camber sections so the tire wants to climb up rather than slide down. I run the Wicked Will backwards and all the other ones in the recommended direction. I love leaning hard on the Dirty Dan or Muddy Mary. They hold very well, imo. I loved dual DHFs before I got hooked on Schwalbes.
 

Huck Banzai

Turbo Monkey
May 8, 2005
2,523
23
Transitory
I really like the Minion up front, not as crazy about it in the rear, but thats what I run.

I miss Mobsters (60a)

EDIT: Minion DHF that is; I do like DHR a bit in the rear, and for loose stuff, it isnt a terrible front tire.
 
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kidwoo

Artisanal Tweet Curator
Schwalbe says they angle the side knobs like they do for off camber sections so the tire wants to climb up rather than slide down.
Think about it though. That's NOT what those angles do. I'm dead serious.

Leaning a bike over and having it bite in a non bermed turn is really similar to having a bike level on an off camber section....the sides are engaged either way. You can't say 'oh it's for off camber sections, not really for cornering'. The way those side knobs are angled, they're open at the 'entrance' of the engagement, and closed at the end. Now break traction. If your uphill side is on the right, those angles on the right side of your tire face downhill as you 'leave' the knob rolling forward or as the tire wants to slide. It pushes your tire to the left as you move forward. Rolling in tilled dirt is kind of a constant motion of controlling a little bit of sliding in a cyclic fashion as the tire rolls. All those micro sliding motions are directed the wrong way by that kind of angle.


I kind of see what they're thinking in that the open entrance will 'grab' dirt but it doesn't work that way. Besides, round things naturally want to climb when spinning on one side edge anyway. You know what happens on a bike when you lean it over without even turning the bars. It turns. You're a snow guy, what's one of the most key motions on turning a snowmobile, even on kind of hard packed snow? Leaning the track. Those certainly don't have angled knobs.
So even a fairly 'neutral' angle like on a high roller will want to climb because it's still round......and I'd argue even better because of the bigger channel and accessible 'wall' the sideknobs form hold material and keep it there better.

This is kind of like debating clicks of damping on a shock. You'll get down the hill just fine and most competent riders can adjust to about anything and make it work. I'm not saying you're going to die or anything running tires the way they suggest. Like most of what gets discussed on RM it's just minutia to add to the mix. It's just that I know most tire companies are guessing on a lot of this and it bugs me.
 
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Pslide

Turbo Monkey
Soft compound?

...

I bet you'd be able to tell the difference on a hard compound version on some dry loose stuff. But then again....maybe not.
No, they are hard compound and I have been riding mostly hardpack with them. The Nobby Nic is pretty...nobby...and therefore I don't think you see the same kind of engagement with the shoulder knobs that you would with a Minion or more open tread pattern. And I haven't back to backed the two different directions.

For what it's worth, I do agree with you on the directionality. And I am running my Nobby Nics backwards now. I still run my Muddy Marys per Schwalbes recommendation due to the ramping of the knobs, and there is very little angle on the shoulder knobs anyway.

Been running a set of Kenda BBGs on the DH bike and will do a detailed tire review after I get some more time on them. I took measurements and everything. So far, great dry/hardpack tire, corners very aggressively, but not so good in wet/intermediate/soft conditions in terms of braking and control around center. What you'd guess basically.

 

kidwoo

Artisanal Tweet Curator
haha^^ That's the ONE tire I'm sitting on my hands waiting for right now. (Mostly the 2.1 UST version for my trail bike). Yeah I'm sure they're potentially frightening in mud but for the dry stuff I ride all summer, I'm stoked to get a pair. You have the dh versions? How squishy are those centerknobs? I wish Kenda had more DTC setups.

But yeah, like I said, the nobby nic thing isn't THAT angled so I doubt it'll be worlds of difference. But try this. Find some flat, kind of hardpacked turns that you can lean into without breaking or stressing over....longer the better. Ride those sections a bunch with the tires each way, really paying attention to what they're doing when you're leaned over on them. On some tires with more aggressive angles it's comical once you realize what's going on.

I still run my Muddy Marys per Schwalbes recommendation due to the ramping of the knobs, and there if very little angle on the shoulder knobs anyway.
Drives me ape**** when they do that. I see a sideknob pattern that would look great run in reverse of their recommendation but then they go and ramp the centerknobs so you can't. (or just shouldn't) Continental too for that matter.
 

Pslide

Turbo Monkey
haha^^ That's the ONE tire I'm sitting on my hands waiting for right now. (Mostly the 2.1 UST version for my trail bike). Yeah I'm sure they're potentially frightening in mud but for the dry stuff I ride all summer, I'm stoked to get a pair. You have the dh versions? How squishy are those centerknobs? I wish Kenda had more DTC setups.
My local track is flat and without rocks, so I got the 2.35 single plies with DTC. Weigh in at 780-800g. I needed something fast rolling and hard cornering.

DTC is spot on, 60 ShA center, 50 ShA side knobs with very slow rebound. I think the center knobs would be pretty squishy with the soft DH compound (and wear fast) but they work great with DTC. Roll great too.

I think they'd be a great tire for out West when dry and for bike parks / man made trails.
 

KavuRider

Turbo Monkey
Jan 30, 2006
2,565
4
CT
Minion DHF Front/HighRoller Rear always worked for me, but like the others said, I'd love to see other options.

Haven't been riding DH in awhile, so I haven't tried any of the newer tires. Most of our trails here are just rocks on top of rocks.
 

marshalolson

Turbo Monkey
May 25, 2006
1,770
519
pslide, i have the 2.35 dtc single ply's on my trail bike right now and am convinced they are the best dry hardpack/loose over hard tire ever. awesome at everything (braking, conrnering, steering, rolling).

nobody has a dh casing that i can find, really want to run them on my DH bike as well.
 

Orfen

Monkey
Feb 22, 2004
259
0
UP, michigan
pslide, i have the 2.35 dtc single ply's on my trail bike right now and am convinced they are the best dry hardpack/loose over hard tire ever. awesome at everything (braking, conrnering, steering, rolling).

nobody has a dh casing that i can find, really want to run them on my DH bike as well.
are you running that tires both as a front and rear?
 

Pslide

Turbo Monkey
pslide, i have the 2.35 dtc single ply's on my trail bike right now and am convinced they are the best dry hardpack/loose over hard tire ever. awesome at everything (braking, conrnering, steering, rolling).

nobody has a dh casing that i can find, really want to run them on my DH bike as well.
Yeah, agree, although I'm guessing they are better suited to the DTC than the Stick-E compound, too bad they don't make DTC in 2-ply like Kidwoo said.

These BBGs will slingshot you out of corners...don't know if you've found this too but they seem to generate more cornering power for a given lean angle. They rip around turns, you have to back off slightly at first or you will over-turn, so to speak.

Looking forward to trying them on my trail bike when they come off the DH bike...

EDIT: I am running mine both front and rear.
 

marshalolson

Turbo Monkey
May 25, 2006
1,770
519
yup front and rear here too.

i think it is the ultimate tire for a 150-170mm trail bike in dry conditions. literally by far and away the best trail bike tire ever.

been pretty happy with 2.4 nobby nic's and 2.5 exo dhf's, but the bbg combines the best of both of those tires. rolls fast like nobby nic + brakes as well/better than DHF + corners as well/better than DHF. and is the tread wears slower over long miles than either by far.
 

Acadian

Born Again Newbie
Sep 5, 2001
714
2
Blah Blah and Blah
yup front and rear here too.

i think it is the ultimate tire for a 150-170mm trail bike in dry conditions. literally by far and away the best trail bike tire ever.

been pretty happy with 2.4 nobby nic's and 2.5 exo dhf's, but the bbg combines the best of both of those tires. rolls fast like nobby nic + brakes as well/better than DHF + corners as well/better than DHF. and is the tread wears slower over long miles than either by far.
I'm highly curious about that tire now...sounds like it would work well for what I ride - but I still have this phobia of Kenda tires. To me they are synonymous with NeverGrip and AlwaysFlat