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Moral issue.

DirtyMike

Turbo Fluffer
Aug 8, 2005
14,437
1,017
My own world inside my head
black noise said:
I would have stopped until justsomeguy came in again. I thought we had it all wrapped up and everything.

haha no really, lets hijack into another totally unrelated topic and keep this thread alive as long as possible!!!

I mean Hell we are already at nine pages, lets see what a few months can do!!!
 

DaveW

Space Monkey
Jul 2, 2001
11,525
3,071
The bunker at parliament
DirtyMike said:
That statement right there Ends the entire arguement. Freedom, its what our soldiers are fighting for as we speak/type. Freedom to make money, freedom to ride, freedom to Drive to a race, freedom to sit up dismissing homework for ridemonkey, freedom to bounce back and forth, and yes freedom to MAKE A PROFIT. Freedom to make a choice, freedom that Most take for granted, freedom to live!!
Freedom to go to a bar, get piss drunk and go home with a total heffer, freedom to make fun of your friend who did so, Freedom to whatever, And freedom to GET BACK TO THE HOMEWORK!!!!!. Sorry i had to add that!!

Only freedom for a small select group, at the expense of oppression and suffering for a far larger group. ;)
 

black noise

Turbo Monkey
Dec 31, 2004
1,032
0
Santa Cruz
Changleen said:
Sorry dude but that's nothing even close to anarchy.
Why not? I see everything, the peace, the non-heiarchical organization, the self-organization, the independence, the use of bicycles... what's it missing? Molotovs?

Yeah, I have a few minutes before more homework.
 

Changleen

Paranoid Member
Jan 9, 2004
14,538
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Pōneke
black noise said:
Why not? I see everything, the peace, the non-heiarchical organization, the self-organization, the independence, the use of bicycles... what's it missing? Molotovs?

Yeah, I have a few minutes before more homework.
It's not a question of what's missing but what is included as well.

Um... Also:

I see everything, the peace,
what's it missing? Molotovs?
Make up your mind about what you think anarchy means eh?
 

black noise

Turbo Monkey
Dec 31, 2004
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Santa Cruz
DaveW said:
That pic is of an organised group trying to enforce their will on another group..... the very antithesis of anarchy.
They're not forcing drivers to get on bikes, though if they did that would help. The drivers made the choice to drive 4000lb monsters. Besides, it's a once-a-month protest, I say the drivers should get over it and accept a delay once a month to celebrate bikes.

Are drivers not forcing their will on bikers all the time? And the government buiding roads strictly for cars?
 

black noise

Turbo Monkey
Dec 31, 2004
1,032
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Santa Cruz
Changleen said:
Make up your mind about what you think anarchy means eh?
The comment about molotovs was sarcastic, directed towards anyone who thinks anarchy is about vandalism and molotovs. I should have included some smileys, and I take it back now that I can tell you're not one of those people. :)
 

Changleen

Paranoid Member
Jan 9, 2004
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Although it's a nice idea, true anarchy, like true communism or extreme socialism is unrealistic because all people (including me) are actually incapable of always thinking of the greater good and not of their own ass.
 

DirtyMike

Turbo Fluffer
Aug 8, 2005
14,437
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My own world inside my head
I think i am going to go find some Anarchy for teh night . I still have near two and a half hours till the Titty bar closes. True Anarchy Im dropping 20's to see the Girls fight for them......just kidding... but really Im goin to the titty bar... Anyone wanna join me??
 

black noise

Turbo Monkey
Dec 31, 2004
1,032
0
Santa Cruz
Changleen said:
Although it's a nice idea, true anarchy, like true communism or extreme socialism is unrealistic because all people (including me) are actually incapable of always thinking of the greater good and not of their own ass.
Yes, but isn't that selfishness inspired by our highly competitive society? There are countless examples of selfless people, or anarchist revolutions, or co-ops or communities or tribes, where anarchy or extreme socialism worked.

The only reason why it's impossible now is how are you supposed to have a revolution when foreign armies would be waiting outside to conquer your people's militias? In Spain in 1936 during their revolution/civil war Britain posted warships off of Barcelona to protect their assets.

What most people call "human nature" of corruption or greediness I blame on our system that promotes that nature.
 

black noise

Turbo Monkey
Dec 31, 2004
1,032
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Santa Cruz
I'm going to give this thread a rest, sorry for turning it into a politcal/philosophical discussion. I'm going to go talk about bikes.

edit: Does this give me a custom title? :)
 

DaveW

Space Monkey
Jul 2, 2001
11,525
3,071
The bunker at parliament
black noise said:
They're not forcing drivers to get on bikes, though if they did that would help.
Which is the point of the protest. As I said it's an organised attempt to force their will on others..... They are forcing cars off a road that was designed for them.

black noise said:
Are drivers not forcing their will on bikers all the time? And the government buiding roads strictly for cars?
Yes but they are not claiming this act to be anarchy.......
 

bikenweed

Turbo Monkey
Oct 21, 2004
2,432
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Los Osos
Back to the moral issue. Freshman year of college, I decided to make my trials bike a slalom bike. I saw that a teammate in town was selling a good fork and front wheel. I went over, checked it out, and it was a legit setup. I ended up buying the fork/wheel for about $150. A few months later, I learned that another friend of mine originally sold the fork and wheel for $100 to the guy who sold it to me. So the teammate who I bought the fork from made a $50 profit.

Should I be angry? At first, I was just dissapointed with the team mate. Then I realized that it was still a pretty good deal that I got. We're both starving bike riders. I do think lower of him for doing that, but he still didn't rip me off. When I meet a new rider in town, I usually try to help them out however I can. You could make a case saying he helped me buy not selling it for more than he did, or you can say he made an extra buck at the expense of another team mate. Every story has two sides to it, and I can understand both sides of this dilema. Just an example for this moral debate.
 

Kevin

Turbo Monkey
Dammit stop hijacking this fine thread you Capitalistic asshats. :D
What about the secret Santa thingy, your giving stuff away for free while you could have made money out of it all under the spirit of helping a guy/gal out.
But since this only seems to works around Xmass I think your either all full of **** or your all a bunch of hypocrites :eviltongu
Now go hijack another thread and let this one die in piece :wave:

:banghead:
 

SkaredShtles

Michael Bolton
Sep 21, 2003
67,381
13,928
In a van.... down by the river
black noise said:
No to the first part, other parts of my budget will be cut before my bike fund.
And people will still starve while you're riding your bike. How in the world can you *live* with that? :D

And to the second, I don't know how learned you are in true anarchist philosophy but from that statement it appears not much. Yes, a real anarchist would. By not driving I'm not funding oil companies, which also stops funding their practices in poor oil-rich countries. I'm also not supporting sprawl, pollution, obesity, and the isolation associated with cars. I'm also not funding the cloning of america by not buying at Starbuck, Taco Bell, etc. I also set an example for others to do the same.
You're an anarchist wannabe in your cozy house with your good food riding your nice bike. :p
 

splat

Nam I am
Kevin said:
Dammit stop hijacking this fine thread you Capitalistic asshats. :D
What about the secret Santa thingy, your giving stuff away for free while you could have made money out of it all under the spirit of helping a guy/gal out.
But since this only seems to works around Xmass I think your either all full of **** or your all a bunch of hypocrites :eviltongu
Now go hijack another thread and let this one die in piece :wave:

:banghead:
WHat a thread this long usually gets Hijacked 3 or 4 times before all is said and done.
 

robdamanii

OMG! <3 Tom Brady!
May 2, 2005
10,677
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Out of my mind, back in a moment.
Seems like Black Noise is a utilitarian; good of the masses over the good of the individual. The problem is, if you hurt enough individuals to appease "the masses", eventually, the individuals become the masses. See-saw, tit for tat....it doesn't work.

Hell, NOTHING works perfectly.
 

DirtyMike

Turbo Fluffer
Aug 8, 2005
14,437
1,017
My own world inside my head
Oh dear god this is still going??? Hey Bikenweed good nab on a fork and wheel for 150 not bad. And good for you for seeing you May have paid 50 bucks more than teh guy you got it from and still being able to say you got a good deal. Truth is, he could have kept it for himself, or sold it even higher. SOunds like 200 still would have been a good deal.

Black noise isnt An anarchist, he isnt a Utilarian, he is young, and lacks life experience is all. But there are alot of people here who lack that certain Life experience also. Some thing you just have to realize Are not going to change, like the law of Gravity wont change.

Oh on the hijacking part... titty bar alst night was awesome.... How come noone joined me, scored a 2 for 1 and got hooked up in the ViP for the last three hours!!!
 

robdamanii

OMG! <3 Tom Brady!
May 2, 2005
10,677
0
Out of my mind, back in a moment.
DirtyMike said:
Oh dear god this is still going??? Hey Bikenweed good nab on a fork and wheel for 150 not bad. And good for you for seeing you May have paid 50 bucks more than teh guy you got it from and still being able to say you got a good deal. Truth is, he could have kept it for himself, or sold it even higher. SOunds like 200 still would have been a good deal.

Black noise isnt An anarchist, he isnt a Utilarian, he is young, and lacks life experience is all. But there are alot of people here who lack that certain Life experience also. Some thing you just have to realize Are not going to change, like the law of Gravity wont change.

Oh on the hijacking part... titty bar alst night was awesome.... How come noone joined me, scored a 2 for 1 and got hooked up in the ViP for the last three hours!!!
President's day special or something?