[Barbaton]

http://overstated.net/05/01/31-nyc-bicycle-abuse

"Because of the cold, there weren't that many riders, so the Mass was not quite critical enough. With absolutely no blocking of any traffic the mass took off from Union Square. I made it about 4 blocks before I was swarmed by cops on scooters who grabbed me off my bike and put me in handcuffs. Let me make one point particularly clear: I WAS RIDING IN THE BIKE LANE at the time of my arrest. The mass was small so we it wasn't taking up the whole road and everyone was riding off to the side. Not that it mattered. A small woman who was riding behind me was forcibly pulled from her bike and thrown to the ground with a knee in the back of her neck."


Is there some sort of action non-NYC monkeys can take to support these guys?

 

[dwaugh]

That's not right, bicyclists are people too and should be judged equally, even when on the road.

 

[Toshi]

take the chinatown express down to nyc, borrow a beater, ride in the next critical mass, have the gazette write it up when you get assaulted...

 

[Rip]

That's the NYC police for you.

 

[TheInedibleHulk]

Cops suck. I've meant plenty who were reasonable and sane people, but whenever my opinion on them begins to soften I encounter some power tripping s%#@head without a scrap of common sense or decency who could barely be trusted with a mop, much less a badge and a gun. A friend of mine was recently put in cuffs after a cop saw him doing a wallride on a sign. I know there's at least one monkey cop on here, who I can only assume would never be so idiotic towards an innocent bike rider, but the majority sure to seem to be a bunch or worthless assholes. Now I live in boulder, which is much more bike friendly than my hometown of Baltimore, but the cops here are still dicks, just on different issues.

 

[Echo]

What I don't get is, these people go out there specifically to make a scene and piss off motorists, and they know from past experience that the police are going to get involved. But they go out there and do it anyway, then act all surprised when it happens.

 

[Westy]

Around here you get a 100 fat lawyers on Harleys and the Cops will go and block traffic for them. Do it on bikes and get hassled by the man.

 

[boehm]

Here in texas if you go on a road ride you are lucky not to get a empty chucked at the back of you head. Seems the 'necks around here havent taken to our"share the road" campaign.

 

[clancy98]

you're right they know its going to happen, but does it *have* to happen to 4 riders in a bike lane? Can people even ride their bikes in NYC recreationally or for transportation, or are they tackled as soon as they hit the streets?

 

[Westy]

The whole idea of cops on scooters cracks me up.

 

[Wumpus]

Here in texas if you go on a road ride you are lucky not to get a empty chucked at the back of you head. Seems the 'necks around here havent taken to our"share the road" campaign.

I guess I'm lucky. I've never had anything chucked at me.

 

[Echo]

you're right they know its going to happen, but does it *have* to happen to 4 riders in a bike lane? Can people even ride their bikes in NYC recreationally or for transportation, or are they tackled as soon as they hit the streets?

It definitely *shouldn't* happen, I just think Critical Mass has made such a scene and such a bad name for themselves (and cyclists as a whole) that they just need to STFU now and let someone come up with a better plan that doesn't involve provoking motorists and police.

 

[DHS]

i've had people chuck things at me on road rides....
sucks.

 

[N8 v2.0]

I thought the whole idea of Critical Mass, like most goofy 'protests,' was to get arrested anyway...???

 

[spincrazy]

It definitely *shouldn't* happen, I just think Critical Mass has made such a scene and such a bad name for themselves (and cyclists as a whole) that they just need to STFU now and let someone come up with a better plan that doesn't involve provoking motorists and police.

BOO BOO

 

[tmx]

What I don't get is, these people go out there specifically to make a scene and piss off motorists, and they know from past experience that the police are going to get involved. But they go out there and do it anyway, then act all surprised when it happens.

here here!!

 

[sanjuro]

I am a huge supporter of Critical Mass and I have ridden in many. However, I grew in New York City, and one thing I have learned is not to f**k with the NYPD.

There was a huge police build-up for the Republican National Convention last year (for you history majors, it was in New York City last year). The August CM was held the Friday before the start of the RNC. There was a huge crowd, probably 2000-3000 riders, there in protest of the RNC.

As a rider in CM, we run red lights, stop cars from crossing, and take a generally agressive posture. Considering the amount of crap I receive on the road, justified or not, this is my one chance to give some of it back to the cars. Keep in mind there is no violence, this is generally a fun event, and the worst thing that happens is some cars get held up on a Friday evening (something which could happen anyway).

However, I recognize that what we are doing is illegal, and while we usually get a free pass because it is not worth the police's trouble, we operate because they allow us.

I knew there was going to be a clash, and my heart broke when I saw riders getting beat down. For you gun-loving conservatives, yes I know they were breaking the law, but considering if I lived in the East Coast at time, I would have been in that ride.

I suppose many of the riders have forgotten history. The Tompkins Square Riots is a perfect example of how the cops are not going to be f***ed with.

I think for CM to continue in New York, a very careful toe'ing of the line will have to take place. Or changing the day they ride. The cops are not that smart.

 

[Echo]

I think for CM to continue in New York, a very careful toe'ing of the line will have to take place. Or changing the day they ride. The cops are not that smart.

Funny, I ride with several cops on a regular basis. We ride MTB, BMX, road, jumps, etc. Most people we run into while riding don't know they are cops. They lurk the biking sites and are members of various MTB clubs and cycling organizations. I bet most cops know where CM is going to be before half of the riders.

 

[sanjuro]

Funny, I ride with several cops on a regular basis. We ride MTB, BMX, road, jumps, etc. Most people we run into while riding don't know they are cops. They lurk the biking sites and are members of various MTB clubs and cycling organizations. I bet most cops know where CM is going to be before half of the riders.

Ok, you got me for making a blanket statement about cops. Should I put up a thread for dumb cop stories?

 

[clancy98]

no seriously though I'm asking a question?.

Are the streets in NYC just devoid of bikes for now? It sounds like everybody on two wheels get pokey'd on sight! Just trying to guage the reaction all the way over here from Ohio.

 

[SkaredShtles]

<snip>
As a rider in CM, we run red lights, stop cars from crossing, and take a generally agressive posture. Considering the amount of crap I receive on the road, justified or not, this is my one chance to give some of it back to the cars.

This sounds like a great way to pi$$ off motorists who might have otherwise been somewhat sympathetic to cycling.......

Of course, in a city of 4 billion people, things are probably quite a bit different than 'round these parts.

-S.S.-

 

[Mackie]

no seriously though I'm asking a question?.

Are the streets in NYC just devoid of bikes for now? It sounds like everybody on two wheels get pokey'd on sight! Just trying to guage the reaction all the way over here from Ohio.

Devoid of bikes? Not even close.
I've ridden in NYC since i was a kid, and I've been hassled by a motorist or 2, but my only run-in with the cops was for speeding on my bike on the Brooklyn Bridge.

So despite not always following all the traffic laws, and bike commuting daily for a couple of years in New York - I never got arrested!
But then again - I didn't ride in a CM. And i wouldn't.

Things as i see them:
NYC is more bike friendly than ever - more lanes more greenways, safer
NYC has less crime than ever - and in large part, we owe the cops for that.

Some folks are trying to make cycling into a big issue - but really, the advocacy groups (like TA) have been quitely doing their job for years - and they've been doing it well. And really, the bulk of the commuters, recreational riders, and working cyclists in the city have no problem riding where they want, without any police interference.

But a small number of folks are out to piss off the cops.
And when you set out to piss off the cops in NY, you are going to get arrested.

 

[sanjuro]

This is a funny one. I am not the best defender of the CM, because I acknowledge some of its faults and my own somewhat callous attitude to blocking traffic.

On the other hand, anyone who defends p*ss*d off drivers makes me wonder if they have ever ridden a bike on the road before. I have been:

hit by a car accidentally
hit by a car on purpose
hit by beer cans and garbage thrown from moving cars
and of course, harassed verbally a zillion times.

So if a car is delayed a few minutes, my heart is not broken.

On the other hand, if there is traffic in a cross section, do you proceed and hit the vehicle, or do you wait until the traffic clears?

Cyclists passing through an intersection is no different than lets say a funeral procession (and we do have police escort as well), except that if a car gets into our midsts, we are put into severe danger.

I feel a certain freedom during CM, freedom from getting pushed around by cars. I also feel comraderie with my fellow riders, moreso than any other time.

I have ridden in 4 man CM's and the San Francisco rides with over 2000 riders. I have enjoyed them all.

Steve

 

[sanjuro]

And the people in the Critical Mass are not a bunch of anarchists. They are the bike advocates, mechanics, messengers, and professionals.

SF Bike Coalition was formed from members of the Critical Mass. Keep that in mind in case you think CM is a bunch of troublemakers.

 

[Echo]

I never defended pissed off drivers. I just questioned the logic of pissing them off on purpose.

 

[bmxr]

It definitely *shouldn't* happen, I just think Critical Mass has made such a scene and such a bad name for themselves (and cyclists as a whole) that they just need to STFU now and let someone come up with a better plan that doesn't involve provoking motorists and police.

Exactly. A CM ride in NYC is not the same as "four innocent cyclists JRA". Nor is a CM ride (where the whole point is to piss off as many people as possible to get attention and be a "rebel"), comparable to a Ride-For-Kids (Harley riders who ask permission and jump through the appropriate hoops to do charitable work). Grow up.

 

[N8 v2.0]

And the people in the Critical Mass are not a bunch of anarchists. They are the bike advocates, mechanics, messengers, and professionals.

SF Bike Coalition was formed from members of the Critical Mass. Keep that in mind in case you think CM is a bunch of troublemakers.

Where's the thrill of civil disobedence protesting in SF? Does anyone even notice?

You need to try it in Houston or Dallas or Huntington Beach etc...

 

[sanjuro]

Exactly. A CM ride in NYC is not the same as "four innocent cyclists JRA". Nor is a CM ride (where the whole point is to piss off as many people as possible to get attention and be a "rebel"), comparable to a Ride-For-Kids (Harley riders who ask permission and jump through the appropriate hoops to do charitable work). Grow up.

There is no comparing a Harley Ride-For-Kids to a CM.

1. CM doesn't pollute.
2. There are plenty of agendas with any charity ride, most of them having nothing to do with charity.
3. Do you think Harley owners get the loudest vehicle on the road because they don't want to piss anyone off?

And I should point out something, the reason why I do the Critical Mass:

It's Fun!

I ride around the city and I meet other riders. I am not protesting anything, and trust me, I don't need anyone to be confrontational. There is nothing else to be said.

Frankly, I think anyone who thinks there is something wrong with CM is against having a little illegal fun (or maybe jealous). Remember, the worst thing that happens is some cars get held up in traffic on a Friday evening.

I recommend everyone meet up in their own town center on the last Friday and go for a ride.

 

[Echo]

Remember, the worst thing that happens is some cars get held up in traffic on a Friday evening.

Actually, the worst thing that can happen is you get beat down by the cops because some asshat next to you thought it would be cute to run his mouth.

 

[MTB_Rob_NC]

And I should point out something, the reason why I do the Critical Mass:

It's Fun!

I ride around the city and I meet other riders. I am not protesting anything, and trust me, I don't need anyone to be confrontational. There is nothing else to be said.

Frankly, I think anyone who thinks there is something wrong with CM is against having a little illegal fun (or maybe jealous). Remember, the worst thing that happens is some cars get held up in traffic on a Friday evening.

Actually the worst thing that can happen is you give cyclist a crappy name. Keep your "having a little illegal fun" to something that doesn't affect something the rest of us enjoy.

 

[llkoolkeg]

I guess I'm lucky. I've never had anything chucked at me.

Come visit beautiful Frederick, MD sometime. You will either get a bottle thrown at you, a car swerved at you, vulgarities/epithets hurled at you, a ticket from the man or an injury due to trail sabotage.

 

[sanjuro]

Actually the worst thing that can happen is you give cyclist a crappy name. Keep your "having a little illegal fun" to something that doesn't affect something the rest of us enjoy.

Mtb_Rob_FL has warned all trail poachers and red light runners to hand in their bikes.

 

[BurlyShirley]

Critical mass is the single, stupidest thing Ive ever heard of.

How is it they figure pissing off the people who already make their lives a living hell is going to help? Id say it does way more harm than good by pissing off drivers who were not previously against cyclists in the street every time they pull off one of their little hippy fests.

 

[sanjuro]

Critical mass is the single, stupidest thing Ive ever heard of.

How is it they figure pissing off the people who already make their lives a living hell is going to help? Id say it does way more harm than good by pissing off drivers who were not previously against cyclists in the street every time they pull off one of their little hippy fests.

I think the key to understanding Critical Mass is that the goal is not to piss off drivers.

To me, it is an opportunity to meet other riders and see the city in a way I wouldn't via car. The fact it annoys drivers amuses me, but is not my intent. Again, I don't need a group of people to be annoy others.

Put this way: if I said, lets meet on a Friday and go for a ride around town, would that be a bad idea? I've done a CM with smaller groups, as small as 4 people (not in SF, I should point out). We followed all traffic rules and had almost no problems with drivers, except for comments like "get on the sidewalk".

Now if you take that smaller group, and expand it to 1000 riders. Should we apply for a permit to shut down streets along the route? Or what is going to happen to traffic with 10 blocks of bicycles? Even if we stopped at every red light, the 9 previous intersections will be blocked.

I think the point here is bicyclists are vehicles, and allowed to be on the road just like cars. Thanks to the bike advocates in San Francisco, I am allowed to take a full lane. This simple traffic measure saves lives. Try riding your bike in the middle of a lane in your locale (try a road with no shoulder), and you can appreciate the need for Critical Mass.

 

[freightGOD]

What I don't get is, these people go out there specifically to make a scene and piss off motorists, and they know from past experience that the police are going to get involved. But they go out there and do it anyway, then act all surprised when it happens.

doesn't sound surprized to me. Just pissed that it HAD to happen. I suspect they had a feeling it would go down that way though. It's exactly the response they are trying to get. And they got it!