[urbaindk]

My wife and I were out riding at a local state park yesterday and we came to a open field and noticed a bunch of people doing some sort of dog training. For curiosities sake, we decided we would ride up and see what they were doing. When we got up a little closer we realized they were training their dogs to attack people. They had a guy in one of those padded outfits and the trainer would command the dog to attack at which point the dog would go crazy on the dude. It was sort of a weird thing to stumble upon while out for a ride.

I found it to be pretty disturbing and it left me wondering for what purpose were they training these dogs to attack? They just seemed like regular people. There was no indication that I could see that they were involved in any kind of law enforcement (however, I could be wrong). The dog breeds varied from pitbulls, to boxers, to german shepherds.

Anybody have any thoughts?

 

[Tenchiro]

I think it is a good idea to train your dog in such a way. Not so that you can command them to attack someone, but so that they won't attack until you command them to do so.

 

[urbaindk]

I think it is a good idea to train your dog in such a way. Not so that you can command them to attack someone, but so that they won't attack until you command them to do so.

That is a very good point I hadn't thought of. I used that sort of reverse psychology to keep my dog from sniffing every freaking thing on walks. I taught her the command sniff, praised the hell out of her for doing it, and now I never call it!

 

[BikeGeek]

...I taught her the command sniff...

I love it!

 

[urbaindk]

I love it!

What can I say, she's not the brightest bulb in the box...

 

[I Are Baboon]

If I tried to teach my dog to attack, she'd just lick herself and fall asleep.

 

[Silver]

I found it to be pretty disturbing and it left me wondering for what purpose were they training these dogs to attack? They just seemed like regular people. There was no indication that I could see that they were involved in any kind of law enforcement (however, I could be wrong). The dog breeds varied from pitbulls, to boxers, to german shepherds.

Anybody have any thoughts?

Out in the woods? White trash training them to guard meth labs or grow ops? That's the first thing that comes to mind, especially when you mentioned pitbulls and boxers. Those aren't two breeds that pop into my head when you mention a working dog...

 

[urbaindk]

Out in the woods? White trash training them to guard meth labs or grow ops? That's the first thing that comes to mind, especially when you mentioned pitbulls and boxers. Those aren't two breeds that pop into my head when you mention a working dog...

Not in the woods, in a big field. It was in the middle of a state park and they were in plain view and were using a parking lot as a staging area. I'm sure they must have had permission to be there, as they were in plain view of park rangers. I didn't really get a sketchy vibe from the people. The only thing I saw that was out of the ordinary was that they were training attack dogs.

I agree it was odd a bit that they were training pits and boxxers. Pits aren't even legal in several surrounding counties. This was in a suburb of DC (20-30 minutes out of the city) so who knows what was going on???

 

[Batman]

Those aren't two breeds that pop into my head when you mention a working dog...

Umm, you may want to do some research on "pitbulls"....you'll find out that's exactly what they are: a working breed.

 

[blt2ride]

When I was a kid, my family was given a Labrador/pit-bull mix that went through some attack training. Apparently, she was just too friendly and hyper to be an effective attack dog, so the owner gave the dog to us. She was a loyal member of our family for almost 12 years—sadly she died of cancer. She was a great dog, who was great with kids; we never worried about her turning. While she was a very gentle and patient dog, she was very protective.

When I was about 13 years old, some guy broke into our house in the middle of the night, and she went after him with precision. My parents heard her barking (probably when the guy was in the backyard), but once he started to crawl through the window, she stopped barking. When the guy was coming through the window, she didn't make a sound, she just attacked!

I don’t know too much about attack dogs or the training that is involved, but the one we had was a great dog. Although, I don’t really know who much training she had prior to her flunking out of attack school--her behavior may have been instinctive. One thing I can say, she was a great family member, and she might have saved our lives...

 

[Silver]

Umm, you may want to do some research on "pitbulls"....you'll find out that's exactly what they are: a working breed.

I know a bit about pitbulls. I'm not one of the breed ban people.

I also can't think of a police department, military agency, or guide school that uses them as professional working dogs. If I'm wrong, please enlighten me. I certainly don't know everything.

edit: In a state park? Maybe schutzhund? I don't know enough about it to know if that's part of it or not...

 

[BikeGeek]

I also can't think of a police department, military agency, or guide school that uses them as professional working dogs. If I'm wrong, please enlighten me. I certainly don't know everything.

They work mostly in rap videos these days.

 

[urbaindk]

edit: In a state park? Maybe schutzhund? I don't know enough about it to know if that's part of it or not...

Dude that's it! I just googlized schutzhund and I'm almost certain that's what they were doing:

They had a course set up exactly like this:

I've never heard of it. Here is a link: http://www.workingdogs.com/doc0035.htm

 

[Jr_Bullit]

Steve's family has a german shephard who's been trained, actually by a police run dog school, to be an attack dog when necessary. I can't even pronounce the 'kill' word as it's in their native tongue (they didn't want some north american goof setting the dog off), but it's very reassuring when I take him (the gs) on long walks around here. I've seen some unsavory individuals way out in the deep woods that make me very glad to have him by my side and know that he knows it's his job to keep me safe.
My next dog, even though it won't be a big intimidating thing (I like mid-size dogs 50lbs and under), will also be trained appropriately.

 

[Tenchiro]

I know a bit about pitbulls. I'm not one of the breed ban people.

I also can't think of a police department, military agency, or guide school that uses them as professional working dogs. If I'm wrong, please enlighten me. I certainly don't know everything.

edit: In a state park? Maybe schutzhund? I don't know enough about it to know if that's part of it or not...

I was under the impression that Bull Terriers have were originally bred as a fighting dog and never really were a working dog. Although the breed was derived from multiple working class beeds.

 

[Jeremy R]

Umm, you may want to do some research on "pitbulls"....you'll find out that's exactly what they are: a working breed.

It goes totally against the nature of the Pit Bull to use it as a guard dog, much less an attack dog.
Pit bulls were bred for hundreds of years to not bite a human being.
It is the same way that Labs are used for hunting, so when you go to take a bird out of a lab's mouth, it will not bite you.
The Pit Bull was bred to fight other dogs, but not be aggressive toward humans, simply because they should not bite their handlers when breaking up a dog fight.
Once, dog fighting was banned, the bit bull actually made a great family dog, because of this trait and its loyalty.
They did not get a bad name until a bunch asshats and drug dealers got Pits and started breeding bad ones to purposely be aggressive towards other humans.
But yeah, in genaral, Pits suck as guards dogs, because if you jump into their fence they are more prone to lick you than bite you.
A German Shepperd on the other hand......

 

[macko]

Best home-theft deterrent system for the price: a couple of big, scary lookin' dogs.

As far as training dogs to attach people goes... I have a friend who works with shepards and that is a good portion of the dogs' training. I don't think that it's for ill intentions, it's just another degree of control you have over the dog. And personally, i'd rather my dog be able to stop (or start) attacking someone on command than sit, lie down, or play dead.

 

[dhbuilder]

back in texas, i had a good friend(as hard as that is for some of you to believe) who had an english bull terrior.(the kind with the pointy bullet shaped head)

this was the coolest and friendliest dog you'd ever want to meet. he was good with the neighborhood kids etc...

it was never trained for anything other than just basic obedience.

one night a guy broke into the house and started wandering throughout.

he didn't get a thing, and he actually left more than he came with, because when the police showed up the had a nice piece of evidence.

a piece denim and a LARGE chunk of asscheek to go with it.

they checked the closest emergency room. and sure enough, they nabbed their man. he lost almost half of his right cheek.

 

[narlus]

I found it to be pretty disturbing and it left me wondering for what purpose were they training these dogs to attack?

track #5

 

[tomvan72]

My dog attacks food bowls on command! And if you are a leather boot, look out!

 

[Tenchiro]

back in texas, i had a good friend(as hard as that is for some of you to believe) who had an english bull terrior.(the kind with the pointy bullet shaped head)

this was the coolest and friendliest dog you'd ever want to meet. he was good with the neighborhood kids etc...

it was never trained for anything other than just basic obedience.

one night a guy broke into the house and started wandering throughout.

he didn't get a thing, and he actually left more than he came with, because when the police showed up the had a nice piece of evidence.

a piece denim and a LARGE chunk of asscheek to go with it.

they checked the closest emergency room. and sure enough, they nabbed their man. he lost almost half of his right cheek.

fnorgby?

 

[Batman]

Oh, I think we're using different definitions for "working dog"....I'm not referring to "gaurd dogs" when I use the term "working"...
I agree generally with what Jeremy R said..."pitbulls" thrive in an environment where they are working...if you can control their prey-drive, they make great farm dogs.

Oh, "pitbulls" were actually not originally bred to fight other dogs, they were bred to grab bulls/cows and not let go until their handler said so. They were bred very strictly as you can't have an out of control dog with that much power...

 

[urbaindk]

track #5

Link doesn't work for me...

 

[Jeremy R]

Oh, I think we're using different definitions for "working dog"....I'm not referring to "gaurd dogs" when I use the term "working"...
I agree generally with what Jeremy R said..."pitbulls" thrive in an environment where they are working...if you can control their prey-drive, they make great farm dogs.

Oh, "pitbulls" were actually not originally bred to fight other dogs, they were bred to grab bulls/cows and not let go until their handler said so. They were bred very strictly as you can't have an out of control dog with that much power...

Yep, they called it bullbaiting or something like that.
That must be where they got their loyalty and fearlessness from.
I can see that conversation now...
"Hey Spot, go over there and take down that bull."
You could not train a normal dog for this.

 

[urbaindk]

"Hey Spot, go over there and take down that bull."
You could not train a normal dog for this.

Yeah, I'm pretty sure my dog would go over to the bull, try to sniff it's butt, and then get trampled mercilessly into the dirt.

 

[stinkyboy]

But yeah, in genaral, Pits suck as gurds dogs, because if you jump into their fence they are more prone to lick you than bite you.

My pit wants to meet you.

 

[narlus]

Link doesn't work for me...

it's a Big Black song called "Seth", from _Bulldozer_.

from steve's liner notes:

this guy trained his dog seth to attack black people. he was an asshole beyond that, but that's the sort of thing he'd do. he has a cornflakes box with his photo on the front. he's big in the democratic machine. he tried to beat up a girl tenant in an apartment building he had equipped with illegally-tapped gas and electricity. he bets on sports. the introductory message is from the america first committee telephone hotline.

 

[Westy]

But yeah, in genaral, Pits suck as guards dogs, because if you jump into their fence they are more prone to lick you than bite you.
A German Shepperd on the other hand......

My pup cubby is part pit. He is a real killer. I feed him kittens and babies.

Edit: I meant to say I feed him to kittens.

 

[Jeremy R]

My pit wants to meet you.

Oh, you have one of the "new" pit bulls.
Congratulations on your liability!

No seriously, I was not talking out of my azz on this subject.
It is a general rule that Pits do not make good guard dogs.
But then again, for a fear factor alone, they kinda do.
You have to be a fairly retarded burglar to step up on a pit
when you don't know its background.

 

[Jeremy R]

My pup cubby is part pit. He is a real killer. I feed him kittens and babies.
Edit: I meant to say I feed him to kittens.

Sweet pics.
I have a cat just like one except 100% more criminally insane.

I got a puppy from the pound a few years back, that looked identical to a pit pup. The guy at the shelter told me he was a Pit, but they could not say so on its tag. Anway, so I did a ton research on them,
and find out alot of cool stuff about the breed.
It turned out that my dog was a Shar-Pei mix though and only looked like a pit. The vet said the sandpaper feel to its coat should have given it away. She rules though, and is a big baby.

 

[Westy]

Sweet pics.
I have a cat just like one except 100% more criminally insane.

I got a puppy from the pound a few years back, that looked identical to a pit pup. The guy at the shelter told me he was a Pit, but they could not say so on its tag. Anway, so I did a ton research on them,
and find out alot of cool stuff about the breed.
It turned out that my dog was a Shar-Pei mix though and only looked like a pit. The vet said the sandpaper feel to its coat should have given it away. She rules though, and is a big baby.

Cub is a total mutt. I'm just guessing he has a bit of pit in him. Total sweethart other than not realizing his own size and strength, he tends to use his head as a bit of a wrecking ball. Nuts beware.

 

[qualude]

Here is my dog. She's an AmStaff (American Staffordshire Terrier), and absolutely refuses to attack people with anything other than her tongue or her crazy tail when she wants her butt rubbed. Man, these pit bulls are ferocious baby-killers.

If you want info on pitties and other bully breeds, check out http://www.pitbullforum.com/

 

[stinkyboy]

Oh, you have one of the "new" pit bulls.
Congratulations on your liability!

I have a rescued fighter, that will prolly end up taking me out one day. I named him Fluffy hoping that would help a little.

 

[urbaindk]

Those eyes.... So sad. Awwwww.


Edit: This post is in reference to qualude's post, not stinkyboy's

Stinkyboy: Damn that is one ugly dog!

 

[stinkyboy]

Stinkyboy: Damn that is one ugly dog!

Say that to his face.

 

[urbaindk]

Say that to his face.

Not on your life!

 

[Jr_Bullit]

Pit bulls are cool so long as the owner knows how to handle/control them properly - they scare me though when unleashed and no owner around. The other day, walking to the store, I passed by a house that, just behind the pickup, stood two pit bulls guarding the property - completely unleashed and looking right at me.

I was like - play ignorant...turn the music up...pretend you're not nervous....tiptoe tiptoe - I'm sure the dogs were trained properly, it's a shame that the news reports so many bad things about that particular breed.

 

[stinkyboy]

I'd never let mine around kids or other animals. I have a neighbor with 2 little annoying yappy dogs that will bark at me and Fluffy, so all I have to do is give dude a wild eyed smirk, and hold up the leash like I'm gonna let go. Dude picks them up and scurries off. Fluffy is totally quiet, and is just waiting for the day I let go...

 

[Jeremy R]

I have a rescued fighter, that will prolly end up taking me out one day. I named him Fluffy hoping that would help a little.

Stinky,
That was really cool of you to take in a rescued pit.
I don't know if it was smart but cool none the less.
They will not adopt them out, so they get put down really quick if nobody rescues them.

One day I want to get a female Staffy Bull, they top out at around 25 pounds or so, but they are a little pocket rocket.

 

[qualude]

Pit bulls are cool so long as the owner knows how to handle/control them properly - they scare me though when unleashed and no owner around. The other day, walking to the store, I passed by a house that, just behind the pickup, stood two pit bulls guarding the property - completely unleashed and looking right at me.

I was like - play ignorant...turn the music up...pretend you're not nervous....tiptoe tiptoe - I'm sure the dogs were trained properly, it's a shame that the news reports so many bad things about that particular breed.

It really is. When a dog attack happens involving a different breed, it is alway a "dog" attack, not a Black Lab Attack, Schnauzer Attack, Minature Pinscher attack, etc.
And we all know how well a Lab can remove a face...