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Mullet Madness

Andeh

Customer Title
Mar 3, 2020
1,026
997
@Andeh and @StiHacka

How low do you guys think DH bb heights actually are?

Lots of winning DH bikes are 350mm to 360mm bb heights
Yeah, but that's static, unsagged BB height on like 200mm travel. This is on 160mm travel. 345 is the norm, with some brands like Spec going a lot lower.

Also, the higher BB feels even weirder when on a mullet, because you end up with the BB higher relative to the rear axle.
 

Rhubarb

Monkey
Jan 11, 2009
463
238
Back up in Scotland for work. Was up here during Autumn last year and will be up here for the rest of the year. Living in my camper so every Friday I hit the road and just camp out for the weekend at whatever trail grabs my fancy. Was hoping to ride an old favourite this weekend but the storm damage earlier this Winter has the hill completely shut.
All the Scottish trails I have ridden so far are mental. Completely different to what we have down south. Endless rocks and roota, but they handle the wet better is rad.
loving this bike and it’s spot on for the trails up here. Dropped a set of 165mm cranks in before driving up and they feel a lot better. I was pedal striking continuously last year, did I mention it is seriously rocky. Yes the BB is very low and with the 27.5 out back this thing rails. This bikes comes alive at speed and can plough through the nastiest of shit. Super confidence inspiring. Trails are mint this weekend and I know the trails well enough now to start fine tuning the rear shock.
8D6FE60C-D15B-42C5-A7FD-6BA85683D280.jpeg
 
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Rhubarb

Monkey
Jan 11, 2009
463
238
Basing myself in Forfar so I can walk to the office. Just heard rumours there could some very local trails, which even if okayish means I could be able to get some rides in after work, without driving. With Scolty hill closed I might try Dunkeld next weekend, seen a few Yootoob vids and look pretty good. I want to ride Heartbreak Ridge but the web says it’s closed due to storm damage.
Where about a are you Gary?
 

Gary

"S" is for "neo-luddite"
Aug 27, 2002
7,681
5,613
UK
Basing myself in Forfar so I can walk to the office. Just heard rumours there could some very local trails, which even if okayish means I could be able to get some rides in after work, without driving. With Scolty hill closed I might try Dunkeld next weekend, seen a few Yootoob vids and look pretty good. I want to ride Heartbreak Ridge but the web says it’s closed due to storm damage.
Where about a are you Gary?
I'm East of Edinburgh. 10 miles from the City. 35 minutes drive from innerleithen (Golfie). GF is South of the City and slightly closer to Peebles. The trail builders (official and not) have done a great job of re-opening/rebuilding the trails. a fair few re-routes but most are good and have freshened up old trails. At the weekend the Golfie is like Blackpool pleasure beach on trade holidays week. Never seen the place so busy.
Dunkeld has absolutely tons of trails. basically 3 hills full of them surround the town.
AFAIK the trails weren't hit as badly as down this way. You'll love what's there. Be prepared for a LOT of climbing though. You'll probably love Aberfoyle and Pitlochry too. Plenty good riidng around Stirling and some decent stuff in Perth.
For local(ish) trails check out Ballo too. it's close to Coupar Angus and has a few shorter Enduro tracks with fun features and fairly easy access. Been used for a few Derp races over the years.
I don't know Forfar at all really. But being Scotland if there's a suitable forest/hills nearby there's bound to riding of some sort.
I just got Covid again so probably won't be riding much for the next couple of weeks.

Oh... and remember. it's just about to start staying light for ages in the evenings. One of the best things about Scotland
 
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Gary

"S" is for "neo-luddite"
Aug 27, 2002
7,681
5,613
UK
You get hit hard, Gary, or more like a cold? IIRC, you were the first one of us to get it originally.
More like a Flu. different than first time.
fever. headache. Aching. but sense of smell still there and breathing fine.
It's almost exactly 2 years since I had it first time round.

Scotland is cool for wild camping/pitching up a van. basically don't be a dick about it and you won't be bothered
 

konastab01

Turbo Monkey
Dec 7, 2004
1,235
284
I'm East of Edinburgh. 10 miles from the City. 35 minutes drive from innerleithen (Golfie). GF is South of the City and slightly closer to Peebles. The trail builders (official and not) have done a great job of re-opening/rebuilding the trails. a fair few re-routes but most are good and have freshened up old trails. At the weekend the Golfie is like Blackpool pleasure beach on trade holidays week. Never seen the place so busy.
Dunkeld has absolutely tons of trails. basically 3 hills full of them surround the town.
AFAIK the trails weren't hit as badly as down this way. You'll love what's there. Be prepared for a LOT of climbing though. You'll probably love Aberfoyle and Pitlochry too. Plenty good riidng around Stirling and some decent stuff in Perth.
For local(ish) trails check out Ballo too. it's close to Coupar Angus and has a few shorter Enduro tracks with fun features and fairly easy access. Been used for a few Derp races over the years.
I don't know Forfar at all really. But being Scotland if there's a suitable forest/hills nearby there's bound to riding of some sort.
I just got Covid again so probably won't be riding much for the next couple of weeks.

Oh... and remember. it's just about to start staying light for ages in the evenings. One of the best things about Scotland
Mental how busy the golfie is now, about 12 ish years ago it was for locals only and no one knew about it
 

Gary

"S" is for "neo-luddite"
Aug 27, 2002
7,681
5,613
UK
Been riding there since the early 90s. But rarely over the last few years.
Back in the early 90s the hill had far more use by off road motorcycles than cyclists and it was only really the fittest XC riders who rode there. (for its challenging climbing) Then in 94ish we built the first DH track and friends of mine held small stopwatch timed races. And that's how it was discovered as a gem for mtb. Eventually motorcycles were banned. Similar story for Traquair (Adrenalin DH side). The DH Quarry and 39steps was originally an Enduro motorcycle climb.
 

djjohnr

Turbo Monkey
Apr 21, 2002
3,021
1,729
Northern California

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konastab01

Turbo Monkey
Dec 7, 2004
1,235
284
Been riding there since the early 90s. But rarely over the last few years.
Back in the early 90s the hill had far more use by off road motorcycles than cyclists and it was only really the fittest XC riders who rode there. (for its challenging climbing) Then in 94ish we built the first DH track and friends of mine held small stopwatch timed races. And that's how it was discovered as a gem for mtb. Eventually motorcycles were banned. Similar story for Traquair (Adrenalin DH side). The DH Quarry and 39steps was originally an Enduro motorcycle climb.
I started riding in 2000 and racing in 01 so Ive missed bit of that.
 

richt2000

Chimp
Sep 25, 2021
16
17
So Vitus have released the Sommet 297 without any press release. I enquired if they were going to bring out an eacarpe 297 also, but they said no because the escarpe is already mullet compatible, running the flip chip in the high position with a 27.5 wheel with a 2.4 tyre only drops the BB 4mm and slackens the seat and head angles by -0.3 degrees (compared to running it full 29 in the low position)

so you have the sommet to add to the stock list and the escarpe to the conversion compatible list :-)
 

Gary

"S" is for "neo-luddite"
Aug 27, 2002
7,681
5,613
UK
Imagine not understanding "reach" numbers alone doesn't actually give you a direct sizing comparison between completely different bikes.

*wink*
 

Gary

"S" is for "neo-luddite"
Aug 27, 2002
7,681
5,613
UK
That'd be a whole lotta plane fare from Australia if choosing between a new Canyon and a new Vitus
 

toodles

ridiculously corgi proportioned
Aug 24, 2004
5,526
4,793
Australia
Imagine not understanding "reach" numbers alone doesn't actually give you a direct sizing comparison between completely different bikes.

*wink*
There's a more than 5cm difference in wheelbase too. The point is they're both Medium enduro bikes. The current sizing spectrum is huuuuuge.

Besides we all know the correct way to size bikes is ratio of headtube length to rear axle spacing.
 

jstuhlman

bagpipe wanker
Dec 3, 2009
16,710
13,060
Cackalacka du Nord
There's a more than 5cm difference in wheelbase too. The point is they're both Medium enduro bikes. The current sizing spectrum is huuuuuge.

Besides we all know the correct way to size bikes is ratio of headtube length to rear axle spacing.
damn, so you're saying my method of dividing downtube thickness by seatstay length and multiplying by the height of troy brosnan's forehead is out of date?
 

Lelandjt

Turbo Monkey
Apr 4, 2008
2,522
850
Breckenridge, CO/Lahaina,HI
Ivermectin side effects

Ivermectin oral tablet may cause drowsiness. It can also cause other side effects.

More common side effects
The side effects of this drug depend on the condition being treated.

The more common side effects of this drug when it’s used to treat intestinal infections include:

  • tiredness
  • loss of energy
  • stomach pain
  • loss of appetite
  • nausea
  • vomiting
  • diarrehea
  • dizziness
  • sleepiness or drowsiness
  • itchiness
Fantastic "Science VS" podcast this week on Ivermectin with a look at how even a doctor trained to recognize and avoid bias can fall into the pit of confirmation bias and conspiracy theory.
 

Lelandjt

Turbo Monkey
Apr 4, 2008
2,522
850
Breckenridge, CO/Lahaina,HI
Imagine not understanding "reach" numbers alone doesn't actually give you a direct sizing comparison between completely different bikes.

*wink*
I disagree because fit and handling matter most when standing. Saddle position has a large adjustment range, only affects climbing, and that's the part of riding that doesn't matter as much. You can say, "This bike has a bad climbing position," but that's different than saying its reach is the wrong size for you. Now that BB heights have settled and almost no one is making seat tube angles that are crazy slack I shop frames purely on head angle, reach, and chainstay and haven't had any surprises. Or just order the Scott with your travel number;)
 

Gary

"S" is for "neo-luddite"
Aug 27, 2002
7,681
5,613
UK
you seem to have missed my point.
ie. comparing "reach" measurements between different bikes is irrelevant without also considering their "stack" measurements.
 

vivisectxi

Monkey
Jan 14, 2021
476
582
yeast van
don't know why we don't use downtube length (ie, center of bb to center of lower headtube face) as a standard comparative metric of front-center length. easy to measure with just a tape.
 

djjohnr

Turbo Monkey
Apr 21, 2002
3,021
1,729
Northern California
don't know why we don't use downtube length (ie, center of bb to center of lower headtube face) as a standard comparative metric of front-center length. easy to measure with just a tape.
I have a calc for that built into my geometry spreadsheet. The only problem with any of these variables is it relies on published numbers to be correct, which I often find isn't the case.
 

toodles

ridiculously corgi proportioned
Aug 24, 2004
5,526
4,793
Australia
don't know why we don't use downtube length (ie, center of bb to center of lower headtube face) as a standard comparative metric of front-center length. easy to measure with just a tape.
The number i look at is the measurement from the centre of BB to the centre of the top of the headtube. It is a bit more fiddly to measure/describe but more accurately reflect the hand-foot distance which is what I'm concerned with. You can calc it using right angle triangle math for reach and stack, or just measure.

If you use the bottom of the head tube, the change in the HT length can make a decent difference on a modern slack bike. I know its pedantic but hey - this is RideMonkey

you seem to have missed my point.
ie. comparing "reach" measurements between different bikes is irrelevant without also considering their "stack" measurements.
They have the same stack
 

iRider

Turbo Monkey
Apr 5, 2008
5,653
3,093
I disagree because fit and handling matter most when standing. Saddle position has a large adjustment range, only affects climbing, and that's the part of riding that doesn't matter as much. You can say, "This bike has a bad climbing position," but that's different than saying its reach is the wrong size for you. Now that BB heights have settled and almost no one is making seat tube angles that are crazy slack I shop frames purely on head angle, reach, and chainstay and haven't had any surprises. Or just order the Scott with your travel number;)
This is all well and good if you are living in an area where you just have climbs or descents. If there is a lot of undulating terrain, then these crazy upright seat tube angles are not ideal for getting in and out of the saddle.
 

Gary

"S" is for "neo-luddite"
Aug 27, 2002
7,681
5,613
UK
This is all well and good if you are living in an area where you just have climbs or descents. If there is a lot of undulating terrain, then these crazy upright seat tube angles are not ideal for getting in and out of the saddle.
and combined with a looong reach and wheelbase a bit gash for seated wheelies.

I can't stand super steep seat angles even when climbing

#ClimbsR4wheelies