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MX vs MTB helmets

Jul 17, 2003
832
0
Salt Lake City
I didn't want to take anything away from DH Diva's thread, but this post is directly related to her comment about being thankful she had her MX lid on.

There definitely is a time and place for each helmet. MTB helmets are specifically designed to keep riders safe from impacts you'll normally see in mountain biking, and DH helmets do have specific safety standards for downhill riding and racing. Moto helmets are designed to protect under impacts you'd see in a moto setting; ie faster speeds, bigger impacts, and the ever-present possibility of your bike landing on your dome. The fact of the matter is a bicycle helmet will protect your head better in a slow-speed, small impact because the shell is (generally by manufacturer) thinner than a motorcycle helmet. Moto helmets are much beefier than a DH lid, so small impacts don't cause the foam to compress as much as it would with a mountain bike helmet. On the same token, taking a big fall (such as DH Diva's) right to your head would totally crush an MTB helmet if you hit a rock because the lid is designed to protect against smaller impacts.

I don't think the moto helmet is right for everybody, but for guys and gals going pro speed on gnarly courses such as Sand Point, it does make sense. For most riders though, I think an MTB helmet makes more sense because you're not as likely to see the kind of impact speeds that Johnny Waddell did last year. Riders doing huge drops or very fast trails surrounded by trees or large rocks can benefit from the moto helmet also.

I'm not totally sure why I felt prompted to write this up, mostly just a public safety notice I suppose. This helmet debate got a lot of coverage last year after Johnny went into his coma, and we're already seeing some of it with Diva's post. Basically every rider needs to decide where their level of riding is, and which type of lid is going to best meet their needs in the event of an unfortunate line choice or variable-positioning rock movement. My two cents, anyhow.
 

Toshi

butthole powerwashing evangelist
Oct 23, 2001
40,232
9,117
interesting thoughts. i'm still going to rock my mx lid tho :thumb:
 

Castle

Turbo Monkey
Jun 10, 2002
1,446
0
VA
Agreed, I think they each have their place and time. I have both... I lean towards the mtb lid most of the time though, because of the ventilation and weight. safer or not? that's just what happens normally
 

manhattanprjkt83

Rusty Trombone
Jul 10, 2003
9,660
1,237
Nilbog
I am gonna get flamed from this but on the rare occasion i ride moto on my bros 125, i use my DH azonic helmet (azx). I just figure that i have had some pretty bad crashes on the MTB and i only ride the MOTO in the woods (not track) so...hopefully im not being a total cromag by doing so...:confused:
 
Sep 10, 2001
834
1
I tend to go towards my moto helmet for DH/DS/BMX... 2 reasons... 1) They fit me better. 2) I just feel safer. I grew up riding off road, so when the speeds pick up, I feel better with a moto style helmet. Plus, with the use of carbon composites, the weight isn't so bad on moto helmets anymore... Any when you are going 30-40mph on a DH run, you really going to have more of a motorcycle type of impact then a bicycle impact should you fall...

Brian
 

Toshi

butthole powerwashing evangelist
Oct 23, 2001
40,232
9,117
bagtagley said:
Can anybody recommend a reliable and reasonably priced Moto helmet?
i bought my answer m8 from mxsouth.com for $130 or so a year or two back. it's a carbon helmet and is snell rated.
 
Sep 10, 2001
834
1
bagtagley said:
Can anybody recommend a reliable and reasonably priced Moto helmet?
I am currently using the O'Neal 694... $140 MSRP... Good fit, not too heavy, not too bad on the price. Also, Fly Racing makes some nice helmets at some pretty good prices...

Brian
 

Lexx D

Dirty Dozen
Mar 8, 2004
1,480
0
NY
My giro switchblade does the trick. I would wear a moto but the lack of ventalation bothers me, i boil most days with my lighter weight giro and can't imagine what it would be like in a solid moto helmet.
 

dromond

Monkey
Aug 20, 2002
286
0
Northampton, MA
Thank you for writing that! It seems obvious that a more heavy-duty helmet is safer but that don't make it so.

<--- will be sticking with mtb helmets.
 

RhinofromWA

Brevity R Us
Aug 16, 2001
4,622
0
Lynnwood, WA
bagtagley said:
Can anybody recommend a reliable and reasonably priced Moto helmet?
Moto helmets can be found at rippen prices. If you avoid the top $$$ helmets most are under $200.

Many are under $100, but I ended up getting a MSR System6 helmet a few years ago on closeout for $120 I think.

I have found the cheaper ones are going to be a little lighter because of their composite shell. The mid priced ones are a tad heavier (generally) and are mostly fiberglass. The upper ones are Carbon/kelvar/fiberglass combos and start getting lighter again. But if they have been certified by Snell and DOT they are up to the task. Most important is fit, then style. ;)

I like the Flys, actually there are a bunch of nice helmets available for sub $150 that I would wear these days. HJC, VIGOR, etc are all places to start. I would jsut stop by a MX shop and try a few on. Some styles don't fit my head right....pinching my chubby cheaks or pressing on my forehead, etc but there are a lot of options out there so just try some on.
 

bpatterson6

Turbo Monkey
Jul 1, 2004
1,049
0
Colorado
I just go for the Moto Helmet by Instinct.
I have been wearing Full Face Moto Helmets forever.
I'm gonna date myself here, but I had a Bell moto III way back in the day and then a Bell Moto IV after that. Full face moto helmets have saved my cranium on more occasions than I can remember. Literally.
I have had multiple Concusions in my life from Riding and I cant stop now.
I'm like a drug addict for Riding my Bikes.
So, For me I use a Full Face Azonic ASX Mx Helmet.
It has already saved me from Disaster on Keystone Resort's "Wild Thing" Trail.
I picked mine up from a local MX Shop. It was the Same Price in the store as they are Online.



$ 89.95 online at http://www.AzonicUSA.com
 

Dartman

Old Bastard Mike
Feb 26, 2003
3,911
0
Richmond, VA
bagtagley said:
Can anybody recommend a reliable and reasonably priced Moto helmet?
I use this one...



It's about $150 at your local motocross shop. (Mine smelled like oil and exhaust new...braaaapp!!)

Mike
 

RhinofromWA

Brevity R Us
Aug 16, 2001
4,622
0
Lynnwood, WA
I took a relatively slow speed header with a MTB fullface and rung my bell enought o not even risk the MTB helmet. I wear a XC helmet for trail riding but if I plan on doing "stuff" or am riding my DH bike... I choose a MX helmet.

They work fine for the small stuff and are there when it is really important for the bigger stuff.

I think if you are XC/trailriding type stuff an DH helmet is OK but when you go for racing speeds even at Sport level that DH helmet is OK "if" you don't plan on catching that head of your son something. I would rather plan on hitting the trees rocks and sweat the small stuff wearin ghte MX helmet. It is better than planing on only hitting the small/slow stuff and sweating if this header is going to be "the one"

Contrary to what many people beleive....MX helmets are very cabable. Not all Motorcycle crashes happen at 40mph. They happen at 2-15mph too and people have no problem with them. Like I have said and will keeping saying. I am more concerned with the "big one" than a few little ones.
 

Jeremy R

<b>x</b>
Nov 15, 2001
9,703
1,067
behind you with a snap pop
I don't buy the whole thing about MTB helmets protecting your dome better in slow speed crashes. A ton of moto crashes happen in slow speed situations. They crash alot in corners. Plus, all the hare scramble and enduro guys have a ton of slow speed crashes as well.
When you hit a tree, you hit a tree, whether it be on a DH bike or a moto, and most of the time the speeds are not too far off from one another.
The only reason to choose a MTB helmet over a Moto one is better ventilation. And I would rather sweat more than talk like slingblade for the rest of my life, Uuum, huuuuh. ;)
 

RhinofromWA

Brevity R Us
Aug 16, 2001
4,622
0
Lynnwood, WA
manhattanprjkt83 said:
I am gonna get flamed from this but on the rare occasion i ride moto on my bros 125, i use my DH azonic helmet (azx). I just figure that i have had some pretty bad crashes on the MTB and i only ride the MOTO in the woods (not track) so...hopefully im not being a total cromag by doing so...:confused:
AZX Helmet
[0480] $149.95
Fiberglass construction
Removable, washable liner
Adjustible venting system
Multi-colored double clear coated graphics
Exceeds SNELL 2000, DOT, ECE and AS standards
Available in gray/black, red/black, yellow/black, blue/black
In sizes Xsmall-XXlarge

Anyone know if the Snell/etc ratings are different for bicycle helmets?
 

Leethal

Turbo Monkey
Oct 27, 2001
1,240
0
Avondale (Phoenix)
Jeremy R said:
I don't buy the whole thing about MTB helmets protecting your dome better in slow speed crashes. A ton of moto crashes happen in slow speed situations. They crash alot in corners. Plus, all the hare scramble and enduro guys have a ton of slow speed crashes as well.
When you hit a tree, you hit a tree, whether it be on a DH bike or a moto, and most of the time the speeds are not too far off from one another.
The only reason to choose a MTB helmet over a Moto one is better ventilation. And I would rather sweat more than talk like slingblade for the rest of my life, Uuum, huuuuh. ;)

My thoughts exactly, if the slow speed thing were really true, should my 5 year old daughter ride around with a hat stuffed with foam peanuts cause she is only riding at max 2 mph.
 

macmx

Monkey
Dec 28, 2003
469
0
I agree, that MX helmets er better. I think anyone who rides DH should use MX helmets. As well as they should use bodyarmor (though I really don't use mine that much, because I feel like I'm wearing a t shirt two sizes too small).

DH lids can be benifitial to Biker X and BMX racing.

I am getting rid of my D2 and replacing it with a Bell MX lid.

Good MX lids (go with the classics): Bell, Shoei and Fox. I prefer Bell.
 

macmx

Monkey
Dec 28, 2003
469
0
DH lids don't protect your head BETTER than MX lids in slow speed crashes, but DH lids protet your head JUST AS WELL in slow speeds. Isn't that the point? The good thing about MX helmets is that they can take big impacts AND slow ones, without needing replacement.
 

-BB-

I broke all the rules, but somehow still became mo
Sep 6, 2001
4,254
28
Livin it up in the O.C.
I have a MOTO that I use for DH EVERY TIME.

I have a light Fullface that I use for agresive trailriding (Downieville style)

I use an XC helmet for everything else.

I don't dirt jump. ;) :dead:
 
Jul 17, 2003
832
0
Salt Lake City
macmx said:
The good thing about MX helmets is that they can take big impacts AND slow ones, without needing replacement.
Every helmet manufacturer based in the US, Canada, or Western Europe that I am aware of says to replace your helmet after any substantial impact. Some moto lid manufacturers even say you should replace your lid if you drop it on the ground from more than a few feet. Since it is virtually impossible to inspect your foam for damage, it's foolish to assume that the helmet is "probably okay."

On another tangent, you're supposed to replace your lid every 2 - 3 years, as the polystyrene starts to break down from sweat and moisture. This is another thing I have heard from every manufacturer I've ever represented.
 

macmx

Monkey
Dec 28, 2003
469
0
I think my writing was a bit stupid. I meant: That moto lids can take small impacts without needing replacement, as apposed to DH lids. I didn't mean that an MX lid can take hueg impacts without needing replacement. But at the rate that MX riders fall (basicly once or twice each riding day), they'd have to replace their helmets every day.

Which helmet you running James? What about Scott, Krispy and Von? Those guys helmets get beat up probably...
 

macmx

Monkey
Dec 28, 2003
469
0
Oh yeah James, any news on my Arrow products?

(Marcus Clausen aka The Danish kid)
 

Ronny Grady

Monkey
Oct 20, 2003
123
0
I allways like the quote, if you have a $2 head wear a $2 helmet.

I ride a full face MTB helmet and have been thinking about getting a good moto helmet. After reading this post I will have to get another Motocross helmet (probably a Bell) sooner rather than later...
 
Jul 17, 2003
832
0
Salt Lake City
macmx said:
I think my writing was a bit stupid.

Which helmet you running James? What about Scott, Krispy and Von? Those guys helmets get beat up probably...
That's what I figured you meant, I just wanted to clarify. Anyway, I've been running the Vigor Vamoose II for the last two seasons and am just about ready to buy a TLD D2 composite. I almost never wear my MX helmet when I'm riding mountain bikes. I can only think of one or two actual DH race trails in Utah that would require a moto helmet for optimal protection. If I was out doing big drops or something of the sort I would probably wear my MX more often. For riding moto, I have one of the new TLD SE helmets and I love it. It's the only moto helmet I've ever worn in which you can actually feel air movoing through your hair (once you're going faster than about 15 mph). Even with the ventilation it's still a bit much for most regular DH work in Utah in the summer.

I do wear the MX lid on long, back-country downhill shuttles. For example, there's a trail outside of Bountiful UT called Holbrook Canyon. There's about a 50 minute shuttle followed by a 10 minute ride/push to the top of the trail, and currently the remote trail is so overgrown that it's about a 90 minute ride down. I wear my MX lid on stuff like that because I don't know what could coming up next, and in some spots the brush is so thick you just have to put your head down and let the helmet and visor take the brunt of the attacking tree limbs and whatnot and hope you don't put your front wheel in the wrong place.

As far as the other guys at the shop . . . Scott has a Vigor Vamoose II carbon for MTB, and an O'Neal SL814 for MX. Von as a Vigor Vamoose II carbon as well for MTB and no moto. Krispy has an Azonic AZX for MTB and an O'Neal SL814 for moto.

Your arrow stuff shipped a couple weeks ago, it should be getting out of customs and showing up at your door any day now.
 

DH Diva

Wonderwoman
Jun 12, 2002
1,808
1
I'm actually really glad you brought this up James. Until last weekend, I didn't really stand on either side of this debate. Like I said, the only reason I was wearing my MX helmet was I was broke at the beginning of the season and couldn't buy a new MTB one. So it really was lucky that I was wearing it for this wreck. This was by far the worst crash I have ever faced in five years of DH racing and two years of moto. My personal choice from now on will be to keep wearing a MX full face for DH. But, I just want to emphasis that this is my choice. I'm not preaching the exclusive us of MX helmets for everyone in every situation. I personally feel that in this situation, it made a huge difference. In most situations, the MTB helemt would have done the job. I agree with James in that the MX lids will be more effective in a catasrophic crash. The problem though is that I don't plan when I'm going to have a catstrophic crash as opposed to a small one, so I'm playing it safe and wearing an MX lid for all DHing now. I rode that course, and that section last year many times, and twice that day with no problems. Wrecks happen fast and sometimes for reasons beyond our control.

I think more than anything it's important to stress to everyone that helmets (MX or MTB) can save you in a big way. Find one that fits you well. If you auger hard on it, replace it. Inspect it regularly for stress cracks in the enamal and around the edges of the foam inside. Take care of it. Try not to drop it or let it bake in the hot sun in the back of your car. Synthetic materials like plastics, have a shelf life and physically break down given exessive heat, ect. And I know not everone's rich, I'm not by any means, but I really suggest replacing it every season if your even taking a lot of small hits. Your heads precious cargo, and $100 a year is a small price to pay to help insure it.
 

Rik

Turbo Monkey
Nov 6, 2001
1,085
1
Sydney, Australia
macmx said:
DH lids don't protect your head BETTER than MX lids in slow speed crashes, but DH lids protet your head JUST AS WELL in slow speeds.
I would've thought the harder shell and foam of MX helmets wouldn't do a whole lot in a low speed impact, ie, it wouldn't absorb much of the impact. Sure, you can get up and walk away from it, but you'd also take a harder knock to the head than you would've if you had a softer MTB helmet.
 

dante

Unabomber
Feb 13, 2004
8,807
9
looking for classic NE singletrack
Maybe things are different out west, but here in the east I've seen too many crashes that have completely ripped apart mtb full-face helmets to wear anything other than MX. The speeds may not be World Cup speeds, but the amount of rocks/trees/etc. mean that any crash can be pretty nasty. Throw in a high-speed fire-road on a race course and I'm going out with any and every bit of protection that I can get my hands on. I've got enough opportunity to take it off on the lift/pedaling sections, for the DH I prefer the full DOT/SNELL helmets.
 

manhattanprjkt83

Rusty Trombone
Jul 10, 2003
9,660
1,237
Nilbog
we all have to remember that none of this applies if you are Sanjay, you can just throw on a pink protec and the trees and rocks will move out of your way...props to him, did he get a full face yet?
 

partsbara

Turbo Monkey
Nov 16, 2001
3,995
0
getting Xtreme !
interesting thread james... i ve had the chance to try out the TLD SE helmet i picked up... at first i found it super warm but it was very humid the first day i used it... the first few runs i hit the DH at bad wildbad (super tech rocks and roots)... then i rode the bad wildbad 'freeride' course... it is wide open and fast, i ve alomst hit 60 kmph coming down in the past... the ventilation was great.. it seems to breathe... i m also surprised by how light it is... waaayy lighter than any other mx lid i ve picked up or worn...

i was using a madmax for about 4 years before i picked up the TLD SE... at first i thought the SE was a little too hot, but now i m stoked that i scored it... hell, the protection it offers is awesome and to top it off it looks pimp :)

here she is...
 

evilbob

Monkey
Mar 17, 2002
948
0
Everett, Wa
bagtagley said:
Can anybody recommend a reliable and reasonably priced Moto helmet?
I use a carbon/kevlar Fly Racing helmet. A little warm but it is worth it to protect what little is still alive in my melon. I run the Smith Lite Replica Helmet (Team deal for me) and would suggest the FL-606III model which is about 89.95. DOT/Snell tested and certified. :thumb:

http://www.flyracing.com/indexy.htm
 

buildyourown

Turbo Monkey
Feb 9, 2004
4,832
0
South Seattle
Wow those are some flashy helmets. I'm sorry, but the MX graphics just don't do it for me. Let's rephrase the question. Who makes a reasonably priced (~$150) helmet that does't scream supercross wannabe. I like subtle. Like the all carbon 661 or the black TL D2.
 

macmx

Monkey
Dec 28, 2003
469
0
Black and carbon are played. I want a retro helmet. 1996 style… Supercross wannabe, I guess you could call it…
 
Jul 17, 2003
832
0
Salt Lake City
buildyourown said:
Wow those are some flashy helmets. I'm sorry, but the MX graphics just don't do it for me. Let's rephrase the question. Who makes a reasonably priced (~$150) helmet that does't scream supercross wannabe. I like subtle. Like the all carbon 661 or the black TL D2.
There are some retailers here and there that have 661 and Vigor carbon lids for under $150.... :eek:
 

RhinofromWA

Brevity R Us
Aug 16, 2001
4,622
0
Lynnwood, WA
buildyourown said:
Wow those are some flashy helmets. I'm sorry, but the MX graphics just don't do it for me. Let's rephrase the question. Who makes a reasonably priced (~$150) helmet that does't scream supercross wannabe. I like subtle. Like the all carbon 661 or the black TL D2.
Do what any self respecting MTB would do.....

spray it flat black :rolleyes: ......"they aint paying me to advertise!" :D
 

ssaddict

Monkey
Oct 4, 2001
472
0
Phoenix, AZ
I wear both depending on the course/terrain, I choose my Carbon Protec for Schweitzer and it protected me remarkably well in the two headers I ended up taking. They were between 15-20mph, so not super fast, but I walked away from both without so much as a headache (I wish I could say the same for the rest of my body parts, I really need some new armor). For someone who would normaly wear a MX lid in the same conditions, I was very impressed.