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My first race (Beacon) and Sandbagging

How

Monkey
Sep 10, 2001
195
0
Area 51
Hey short and simple...

there's a NORBA race on Beacon, i'm gonna race, I don't have any NORBA points but am not a beginner level rider... what level should I enter in for my first race? I want a challenge, but also might not want to start at the top because it will be my first you know?

Which class?
 

binary visions

The voice of reason
Jun 13, 2002
22,092
1,132
NC
Sport.

You don't want to enter your first race and start at the top. You want to enter your first race in a class that will give you something to work towards.

If you podium for your first race in sport, race Expert next time.
 

dante

Unabomber
Feb 13, 2004
8,807
9
looking for classic NE singletrack
ha, a guy at work here entered his first race after DH'ing twice. Entered beginner. Got 3rd, but his time would've been good enough for 2nd in Sport.

just start in Sport as Beginner has a bunch of sandbaggers in it anyway. besides, you'll race earlier in the day... :oink:
 

1000-Oaks

Monkey
May 8, 2003
778
0
Simi Valley, CA
I only raced once in the Beginner class, and was disgusted to see the top several beginner times were faster than the top Sport times...damn sandbaggers. I would have placed better in Sport.
 

Total Heckler

Beer and Bike Enthusiast
Apr 28, 2005
8,171
189
Santa Cruz, CA
I started my first race in Sport. I got 4th my first race and have been hanging out in top 10 since. It also depends on how big your class is on if you need to move up or not.

If you get 2nd in Sport your first race out of 12 people total in your class, you might want to stay in Sport until you see how you do in the next race.

If you get 2nd out of 80 people in your class your first race you need to move up to expert.

Most of the time I have noticed top 5 in Sport are VERY close to top 10 expert times. Just use your best judgment. =]
 

Red Bull

Turbo Monkey
Oct 22, 2004
1,772
0
970
If you think your good enough start off in expert. As long as you can easily ride the course you're fine.
 

Mani_UT

Monkey
Nov 25, 2001
644
0
SLC, UT
Red Bull said:
If you think your good enough start off in expert. As long as you can easily ride the course you're fine.
I disagree. You can very well be able to ride the course yet get passed by one or two faster riders and basically be an obstacle for this guys.

It is your first race. Race sport (or even beginner! it means beginner racer not beginner mountain biker!!!). See how you fare, then move from there.
 

Kntr

Turbo Monkey
Jan 25, 2003
7,526
21
Montana
Dude, he has been in a mountain bike movie. He goes big, rides fast, and even lives a few miles from Beacon.
 

Red Bull

Turbo Monkey
Oct 22, 2004
1,772
0
970
Mani_UT said:
I disagree. You can very well be able to ride the course yet get passed by one or two faster riders and basically be an obstacle for this guys.

It is your first race. Race sport (or even beginner! it means beginner racer not beginner mountain biker!!!). See how you fare, then move from there.
If the course seems easy to you, and you can ride it fine you wont get passed unless your a snail.
 

Mani_UT

Monkey
Nov 25, 2001
644
0
SLC, UT
Kanter said:
Dude, he has been in a mountain bike movie. He goes big, rides fast, and even lives a few miles from Beacon.
OK obviously I am missing on some information!! In this case expert all the way then.

For the more average "experienced" mountain biker, taking it slower is more advisable though. I have seen many people who would desrbibe themselves as experienced but still get a little lost on their first race.
 

Turd Ferguson

Monkey
Dec 21, 2004
223
0
Burbank
Mani_UT said:
I disagree. You can very well be able to ride the course yet get passed by one or two faster riders and basically be an obstacle for this guys.

It is your first race. Race sport (or even beginner! it means beginner racer not beginner mountain biker!!!). See how you fare, then move from there.




Mani_UT said:
OK obviously I am missing on some information!! In this case expert all the way then.

For the more average "experienced" mountain biker, taking it slower is more advisable though. I have seen many people who would desrbibe themselves as experienced but still get a little lost on their first race.
I agree with your first post. He is a great rider, but still a beginner racer.
 

Toshi

Harbinger of Doom
Oct 23, 2001
38,029
7,549
do sport and worry after the results come in about reclassing for the next race.
 

oly

skin cooker for the hive
Dec 6, 2001
5,118
6
Witness relocation housing
Dont the new Norba rules say you have to race sport before you can move up to expert?

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

from www.usacycling.org

2006 NORBA Rule Changes with Comment

The following is a partial list of the rule changes passed by the NORBA Board of Trustees at their fall 2005 meeting. These are then followed by comments from the Technical Director. Words in italics indicate the changes compared to 2005.

NORBA Upgrades

Riders may advance as quickly as they wish up to Sport. However, once a rider has upgraded, he or she will not be permitted to downgrade to a less difficult category without making a formal request to NORBA.

This is a big change in philosophy. Until 2006, a rider could always upgrade as quickly as they wished to expert. However, we believe that the term expert implies a level of ability that must be proven. The old rule led to possible legal exposure should a rider enter the expert category in his first race. What follows are the changes that then stem from this basic change where a rider can go up to Sport instead of Expert.

Sport riders may move up to the expert category after two top five finishes by presenting an upgrade request and a resume to a NORBA official or to NORBA.

The NORBA board and USAC staff made the upgrade requirements fairly easy. The main point was to prohibit total novices from moving themselves to sport.

Beginner racers must move to the appropriate Sport category after placing in the top five in five races. Failure to do so may result in license suspension.
Sport riders must advance to the appropriate Expert category after placing in the top five in five races. Failure to do so may result in license suspension.

This is actually not a change at all, but I put it here to remind all NORBA officials that riders must advance through the categories if they place well. We get many complaints about sandbagging and riders that win sport race after sport race without ever upgrading to expert. The early categories are for learning, and it is discouraging to the true beginner to consistently be slaughtered by professional “beginners.”

Expert men riders may be eligible to be upgraded to Semi-Pro after a combination of achieving these minimum race results: two top-five finishes at NORBA National Mountain Bike Series (NMBS) events; three top-three finishes in American Mountain Bike Challenge (AMBC) events; four top-three finishes at a State or Regional Championship event. Overall finish times are factored into upgrade requests. Riders must submit their upgrade requests either online or to the NORBA Region Manager for their state.

The requirements for upgrading to semi-pro were increased slightly.

A Semi-pro rider placing in two top-three or three top-five finishes at NORBA National Mountain Bike Series (NMBS) events may be eligible to be upgraded to Pro. AMBC, National, and International events may also be considered (i.e. Sea Otter, UCI events). Overall finish times will be factored into upgrade requests. Riders must submit their upgrade requests through their USA Cycling online membership account or send it to the NORBA Region Manager for their state.”

An expert female rider placing in two top-three or three top-five finishes in the expert open/19+ class at NORBA National Mountain Bike Series (NMBS) events may be eligible to be upgraded to Pro. AMBC, National, and International events may also be considered (i.e. Sea Otter, UCI events). Overall finish times will be factored into upgrade requests. Riders must submit their upgrade requests through their USA Cycling online membership account or send it to the NORBA Region Manager for their state.

The requirements for upgrading to pro were increased in general with some flexibility given for considering other events and the times made during the event. It was also clarified that it is the 19+ expert race that counts for upgrading women to pro, not age graded (masters) expert races.

1B9. Categories of Riders.
(a) All mountain bike riders shall be assigned, according to their ability, to one of the following categories: beginner, sport, expert, semi-pro (men only), or pro.
(b) Riders may choose to upgrade themselves as far as Sport. Upgrading requires completion of performance standards.

This part is from the actual racing rulebook and reinforces that riders can only upgrade themselves to sport without demonstrating results.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Of course thats just the rule... who knows if the people running the beacon race will follow them.. Also, If you do race expert then you will need to hold an annual license (add 60 bucks).
 

How

Monkey
Sep 10, 2001
195
0
Area 51
Hmm sorry i haven't been involved in the discussion, i don't have the internet at my house. I called the bicycle butler and they said I should be able to race whatever class I will be qualified for and as open... so I will probably race sport AND open, 2 runs... one for glory and one for money lol... i dunno we'll see how it goes, just watch for a red banshee on the waterfall section.

dexter bring your racerboi self up here and some damn cheerleaders and beer too.
 

trailhacker

Turbo Monkey
Jan 6, 2003
1,233
0
In the hills around Seattle
How said:
Hmm sorry i haven't been involved in the discussion, i don't have the internet at my house. I called the bicycle butler and they said I should be able to race whatever class I will be qualified for and as open... so I will probably race sport AND open, 2 runs... one for glory and one for money lol... i dunno we'll see how it goes, just watch for a red banshee on the waterfall section.

dexter bring your racerboi self up here and some damn cheerleaders and beer too.
You do two runs for combined times. Unless they changed it? If you have a hardtail (or if you are collegiate?) you can enter your normal class then either HT or collegiate.
But it is two entry fees for running two classes.
I think?