never forget
- Thread starter eric strt6
- Start date
Never forget Dec 7. An unprompted attack by am imperial power killing and injuring nearly as many as 9/11, but dragging us into a war that killed almost 420,000 US citizens.
Whereas 9/11 was an unprompted* attack by a small group of religious extremists that "drove us" to invade one innocent country and another where the conspirators resided, also killing thousands of US soldiers. Those wars continuing to provide fuel to the fire of hatred against the US.
*As we did train, provide weapons to, and vacate the appropriate power channels providing for the swelling of the ranks, of the perpetrators.
Where has the "'Murica, F*ck yeah!" mentality been as our rights have been progressively taken away? Right, nowhere. We've been too busy killing brown people to mind our own estate.
Whereas 9/11 was an unprompted* attack by a small group of religious extremists that "drove us" to invade one innocent country and another where the conspirators resided, also killing thousands of US soldiers. Those wars continuing to provide fuel to the fire of hatred against the US.
*As we did train, provide weapons to, and vacate the appropriate power channels providing for the swelling of the ranks, of the perpetrators.
Where has the "'Murica, F*ck yeah!" mentality been as our rights have been progressively taken away? Right, nowhere. We've been too busy killing brown people to mind our own estate.
I was actually a little surprised has how little......."hoopla" there was over 9/11 today. Not to say that it was devoid of it. But still. I guess that's good? what do I know.
All's I know is that 12 years ago, a thread started by dw in the Lounge is where I learned of the plane crashing into WTC.
And....as long as we're talking about ME, the events that unfolded still affect me today. Because of 9/11, I lost my job at Boeing. Therefore I lost my work visa. So I rushed into marrying my american girlfriend (with whom I was living...so...what could go wrong?). And now I am in the throes of divorcing her. And a rather ugly divorce at that, thankyouverymuch. So yeah........funny how things happen. ...yeah. funny.
All's I know is that 12 years ago, a thread started by dw in the Lounge is where I learned of the plane crashing into WTC.
And....as long as we're talking about ME, the events that unfolded still affect me today. Because of 9/11, I lost my job at Boeing. Therefore I lost my work visa. So I rushed into marrying my american girlfriend (with whom I was living...so...what could go wrong?). And now I am in the throes of divorcing her. And a rather ugly divorce at that, thankyouverymuch. So yeah........funny how things happen. ...yeah. funny.
I don't expect those who were not in the services to understand the different meaning of what never forget is to us . its not about politics its remembering our brothers that made the ultimate sacrifice for others
Never forget the original 9/11 when the US backed a terrorist, Pinochet, 40 years ago that destroyed the Chilean democracy and killed thousands of innocent people. Its ok when the US does it, right?
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/sep/09/chile-911-pinochet-baltasar-garzon
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-latin-america-14584095
http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2013/sep/09/chile-911-pinochet-baltasar-garzon
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-latin-america-14584095
It might have completely slipped my mind except for FaceBook.
I stand by what I said in PaWN on the 10th anniversary. Except, if anything, I'm even more appalled now then I was then.
usa! usa! usa!
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MMike tries to make the thread about him, typical Canadian.
divorce is a war on terror unto itself.
I have other reasons to remember 9/11.
You mean most of us will never understand what it's like to go to work knowing you may have to risk your life to save others? Like, that's your JOB. You're right. We don't understand.
Maximum respect for the people that do this, and maximum respect for the people that lost their lives that day.
There are other threads to discuss other atrocities. (like MMike's marriage)
Sort of..
and
we hold them in high honor for doing something that we have never had to do and we wonder could we have made the same decisions in that situation and at the same time be very thankful that we have not and hopefully will not have to face that choice. But if we do we will do our damn best just like they did
On this board all you have to do is look at GFF...
How does one become a hero, when they are paid to do a job they selected, to put their lives on the line? They signed up to charge blindly into those buildings, knowing damn well that they put their lives at risk. Just because you do a certain job, does not make you a hero. Does that not diminish the heroism of the random person who dives in front of a car to save a child they do not know?
Soldier killed in battle? Not a hero. He is somebody who took a job with certain risks. Soldier who dies jumping on a grenade to save the rest of his patrol? Hero. He sacrificed his life, knowing that he would die, to save the others.
Sacrificing your own life, while knowing that you will most likely be killed, to save another, is a hero.
The few Japanese nuclear engineers that went into the core at Fukushima to prevent a full meltdown, meet that mark. They knew going into that room they were going to die a painful death, but did it to save countless other lives if there were to be a full meltdown.
People call me an asshole for this every time it comes up, but the word has become overused and devalued. There is no heroism in signing a paper and becoming a soldier/cop/firefighter/etc. It is something earned, not given.
Should the individuals making the decision to go into war, fires, etc be treated with a proper respect? Yes, undoubtedly. Are they heroes by default? No. You can make more money as a firefighter relatively early into your career, than you can as a lineman. And last time I checked, running live power lines carries far more, regularly recurring risk. Same as the radio tower climbers- those guys on average make less than $70k/year. They take huge life risk in their chosen profession, but are not heroes.
Soldier killed in battle? Not a hero. He is somebody who took a job with certain risks. Soldier who dies jumping on a grenade to save the rest of his patrol? Hero. He sacrificed his life, knowing that he would die, to save the others.
Sacrificing your own life, while knowing that you will most likely be killed, to save another, is a hero.
The few Japanese nuclear engineers that went into the core at Fukushima to prevent a full meltdown, meet that mark. They knew going into that room they were going to die a painful death, but did it to save countless other lives if there were to be a full meltdown.
People call me an asshole for this every time it comes up, but the word has become overused and devalued. There is no heroism in signing a paper and becoming a soldier/cop/firefighter/etc. It is something earned, not given.
Should the individuals making the decision to go into war, fires, etc be treated with a proper respect? Yes, undoubtedly. Are they heroes by default? No. You can make more money as a firefighter relatively early into your career, than you can as a lineman. And last time I checked, running live power lines carries far more, regularly recurring risk. Same as the radio tower climbers- those guys on average make less than $70k/year. They take huge life risk in their chosen profession, but are not heroes.
Syadasti ruling on "hero" in isle 3 please.
Stoney
Hero: is a label applied by those on the outside. I don't know anyone in any of the services that labels themselves or their brothers in uniform with that word.
You're right its a job that we do. It can be fvcking hard nasty job but we do it because we love the fact that if we do it well we can give something back to people, that is really something beyond words. Sometimes even if its just for a few minutes we can make a part of someones life a bit better sometimes it's all you can do is be there so they don't die alone. We do it because someone has to and we can. The fact that its a job that allows us to give back to the folks in the community is just icing on the cake
All that label crap, the H word, is just media spin and government propaganda to make the masses feel better
Hero: is a label applied by those on the outside. I don't know anyone in any of the services that labels themselves or their brothers in uniform with that word.
You're right its a job that we do. It can be fvcking hard nasty job but we do it because we love the fact that if we do it well we can give something back to people, that is really something beyond words. Sometimes even if its just for a few minutes we can make a part of someones life a bit better sometimes it's all you can do is be there so they don't die alone. We do it because someone has to and we can. The fact that its a job that allows us to give back to the folks in the community is just icing on the cake
All that label crap, the H word, is just media spin and government propaganda to make the masses feel better
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I my opinion, paid or not if you run into an 80 story building that was just hit by a plane and you start climbing some fvcking stairs to go save people: HERO.
You're Goddamned right.
The 11th has several meanings for me. I was in the air enroute to the sandbox that morning. We landed in Boise per FAA instructions and went back to Spokane later that day. Weird/scary day, uncertain times. Almost jumped a middle eastern looking guy in the Boise airport that was on our flight and seemed like he was going to run off from baggage claim when he saw all our military gear. In retrospect, I am sure he was a little freaked out by a bunch of corn fed GI types eyeballing him...
My son was born as a result of that diversion, as 5 days later I was back in the air on the way to the sh!thole again and the Frau and I were, well, affectionate during that time and the future was up for grabs.
A few years later I was in the chute again for another deployment on the 11th when I got news that my Father in law had passed away. I asked my wife if she wanted me to come home and she said "No, that would mean another girls husband/kids Daddy has to go...you go on, I got this..." That was another one of those "Damn I made the right choice" moments in our lives together.
I will never forget, it was a defining moment for our generation(s)...but I will also forever ask why...