[mikec918]

I just have to say while I do not agree with the policies and positions of theses groups
I do respect the commitment they have to their beliefs’. I mean when you can get the governments of nations who’s populations are facing famine and starvation to refuse food for their people now that is impressive. Now some people may get squeamish about letting millions of people starve to death, but realistically that is a small price to pay in the battle against Globalization and Genetic Engineering.
It’s time people realized that the certain areas of the earth cannot support their current or future populations. While such ideas as family planning are nice they simple do not work. After all what right do we have to tell people to change their cultures or way’s of life. Starvation and famine will quickly and inexpensively help countries of the world return their population’s to levels that can be supported by the local environment. By my figures 400 million to a billion people should do the trick.

Maybe next time we can talk about all the population problems caused by American and Western Scientist by the reduction and elimination of diseases by the interduction of vaccines to the world. After all these viruses and germs are products of nature and what really gives us the right to interfere with the natural order of things.

 

[eric strt6]

Fantastic, that was a really well written piece of satire! I like it

 

[splat]

Originally posted by mikec918
..........Now some people may get squeamish about letting millions of people starve to death, but realistically that is a small price to pay in the battle against Globalization and Genetic Engineering.


............... Starvation and famine will quickly and inexpensively help countries of the world .............


Maybe next time we can talk about all the population problems caused by American and Western Scientist by the reduction and elimination of diseases by the interduction of vaccines to the world. After all these viruses and germs are products of nature and what really gives us the right to interfere with the natural order of things.

I hope your joking about this !

and if your not and think startvation is such a good thing .... go join them!

Now your saying medicine is Bad ? By this logic your saying is AIDS is a Good thing !


I really hope your joking !

 

[mikec918]

Originally posted by splat


I hope your joking about this !

and if your not and think startvation is such a good thing .... go join them!

Now your saying medicine is Bad ? By this logic your saying is AIDS is a Good thing !


I really hope your joking !

There are thousands of tons of American corn setting in warehouses in these countries. Which the Greens have gotten the goverments of these countries to withhold from their people because they maybe genitical engineered. IE sunflower DNA might have been inputted so the deseases that can be cured by adding certain vitaims to a childs diet can be elemenated.

 

[manimal]

Originally posted by mikec918


There are thousands of tons of American corn setting in warehouses in these countries. Which the Greens have gotten the goverments of these countries to withhold from their people because they maybe genitical engineered. IE sunflower DNA might have been inputted so the deseases that can be cured by adding certain vitaims to a childs diet can be elemenated.

if those green turds only knew about the crap that's in their grande latte from starbucks! i wish they'd use that same zeal for a cause that is actually worth something. i have about as much respect for those green hippies as i do the corn filled log i just flushed down the toilet.

 

[Skookum]

haha tubby u gotta stop eating so fast dude! U come off so ignorant i bet u never even cut down a tree before. I have it goes eeeerrrrrerrrrrrrrrrr kuuuushhhhh. It's pretty cool, but hard work.

 

[manimal]

Originally posted by Skookum
haha tubby u gotta stop eating so fast dude! U come off so ignorant i bet u never even cut down a tree before. I have it goes eeeerrrrrerrrrrrrrrrr kuuuushhhhh. It's pretty cool, but hard work.

huh?

 

[RideMonkey]

Personally I think the organic food movement and opposition to genetically engineered foods is pretty stupid.

Only comfortable Westerner with plenty of food on their plate would have the luxury of complaining about these things. Offer a genetically grown piece of produce to a starving family in Africa and I bet you 10 bucks they arent gonna give a rats ass that its origins were in a lab somewhere.

 

[gravity]

Originally posted by RideMonkey
Personally I think the organic food movement and opposition to genetically engineered foods is pretty stupid.

Only comfortable Westerner with plenty of food on their plate would have the luxury of complaining about these things. Offer a genetically grown piece of produce to a starving family in Africa and I bet you 10 bucks they arent gonna give a rats ass that its origins were in a lab somewhere.

hit the nail on the head.


it's easy to complain when life is so easy...... but it's still stupid. However MikeC has some points.... the world's population is unsustainable. something must be done, but i don't think starvation and famine is the answer. non-creation as opposed to destruction; ie contraception as opposed to murder.

 

[mikec918]

Originally posted by gravity


hit the nail on the head.


it's easy to complain when life is so easy...... but it's still stupid. However MikeC has some points.... the world's population is unsustainable. something must be done, but i don't think starvation and famine is the answer. non-creation as opposed to destruction; ie contraception as opposed to murder.

Being as of course I don't advacate the starvation of a billion people. The world need to find ways to combat this problem and that answer is not wishful thinking and protesting, it's science. The climate, soil and water in these areas cannot support the crops that are being grown there so crops need to be engineer that are more substanable(SP) This will help reduce the problem but will not elemenated as most of these countries donot have the numerous agrucultural areas we do. IE a Freeze in Califoria may destroy the Orange Crop there but it will have no inpact on the Floridia Crop.

As Far as AIDs which is ravaging these areas No matter what resourses the west provides this will be a lossing battle unless. Know I'm going to upset some folks now. We get the people to make certain cultural changes. IE the brother in law having sex with the wife after her husband has died from AIds or men with AIDs having sex with virgins. These things are no different then getting europenes not to piss up stream and drink down stream 2 or 3 hundred years ago.

 

[gravity]

Originally posted by mikec918




Being as of course I don't advacate the starvation of a billion people. The world need to find ways to combat this problem and that answer is not wishful thinking and protesting, it's science. The climate, soil and water in these areas cannot support the crops that are being grown there so crops need to be engineer that are more substanable(SP) This will help reduce the problem but will not elemenated as most of these countries donot have the numerous agrucultural areas we do. IE a Freeze in Califoria may destroy the Orange Crop there but it will have no inpact on the Floridia Crop.

As Far as AIDs which is ravaging these areas No matter what resourses the west provides this will be a lossing battle unless. Know I'm going to upset some folks now. We get the people to make certain cultural changes. IE the brother in law having sex with the wife after her husband has died from AIds or men with AIDs having sex with virgins. These things are no different then getting europenes not to piss up stream and drink down stream 2 or 3 hundred years ago.

that's exactly right. the unfortunate thing is that until people start showing physical symptoms or dying, the poorer countries can't test who has, and who does not have AIDS.

 

[ohio]

Originally posted by gravity


that's exactly right. the unfortunate thing is that until people start showing physical symptoms or dying, the poorer countries can't test who has, and who does not have AIDS.

The problem goes well beyond lack oif testing. MikeC is right; the problem is culturally and socially rooted. A good portion of the continent is in denial, the rest is involved in grand scale cover-up. If we really want to get into it though, we should start another thread. The two issues are, IMO, unrelated.

 

[Will_Jekyll]

I hate hippies but I think the company I work for could use them as sales people. Just think about I'm sure these hippies could sell freezers to eskimos.

 

[-BB-]

Originally posted by gravity


hit the nail on the head.


it's easy to complain when life is so easy...... but it's still stupid. However MikeC has some points.... the world's population is unsustainable. something must be done, but i don't think starvation and famine is the answer. non-creation as opposed to destruction; ie contraception as opposed to murder.

Oh man... a topic near and dear to me.
You are right; We have most likely exceeded the Carrying capacity of the planet, and (population numbers) are bound to slingshot back the other way. It's only a matter of time.
Modern medicine is allowing more people to live longer, thus also giving them more opportunity to procreate. And, while food production has been increasing linearly for centuries (through expanded agriculture, Modern harvesting techniques, and technology) , the population of the planet is increasing exponentially. This was all fine and dandy when population levels were below food production, but in the past half to quarter century, it is estimated that we have finally crossed that threshold where population is greater than food production and will continue to do so. AND... while we may realize some benefit from genetic engineering, what we are effectively doing, and have been for a long time, is reducing the overall genetic diversity of the entire planet.
We live in a time of MASS extinctions on the same level as that of the historical "Cataclysmic" events. the only difference being that those were externally caused (meteors and what not), but this one is our own doing.
As we continue to change evolution from a physical one to one of Societal/mental superiority, this, in conjunction with the lowered bio-diversity will lead to our bodies being incapable of defending itself against nature. All ready, we are dependent on fire, shelter, and clothing for survival. Now, with the advent of vaccines, we are becoming dependent on technology as well as these other "necessities". Diseases that we would have naturally selected against, if allowed to run their course can now decimate entire populations. And if it isn't this disease, then it will be that one... This mat be a very pessimistic view of the world, but I am VERY hesitant to bring a new life into a world that I see as destine for destruction.
The only problem (or dichotomy if you will) is that people that don't have kids or have fewer kids in an effort to be environmentally responsible are actually selecting against themselves because they do not pass on this "Trait" to the following generations, and those who continue to have large families, even if to the detriment of the world, will propagate the "Have Kids" gene (if there is one... but you get my point.)

It's a case of natural survival instincts (Genetic fitness) being in direct conflict with the actions that will be required to save ALL mankind.

What was that one saying... "Save the planet... Kill yourself"
Not a popular idea, but it carries a bit of truth.



These are scary times we live in.

 

[Toshi]

-BB-, so ideally we should procreate a lot but feel guilty about it (thus spreading that trait)?

 

[Will_Jekyll]

I'd like to point out BB that through out time there have always been people like you who thought the world or/and human kind was on the edge of colapse and they have been proven wrong time and time again.

-edit-

Also the US is able to produce way more food then we could consume that is why we pay our farmers to leave fields unused and buy excess crop to feed to the poorest nations.

 

[-BB-]

Originally posted by Toshi
-BB-, so ideally we should procreate a lot but feel guilty about it (thus spreading that trait)?

LOL... Yeah.
Maybe we should all get a healthy dose of Catholic Guilt about the base(ness?) of sexual desires.

 

[-BB-]

Originally posted by Will_Jekyll
I'd like to point out BB that through out time there have always been people like you who thought the world or/and human kind was on the edge of colapse and they have been proven wrong time and time again.

True.. True...
but if the world/society is a finite entity, then SOMEONE will be right about it.



Plus, I know that it is always like that, but if you chart these things (like population growth), it is VERY clear that something will have to give. It IS an exponential curve, and we have passed the point where the slope is 45 degrees. How can it continue to infinity?

 

[-BB-]

Originally posted by Will_Jekyll
I'd like to point out BB that through out time there have always been people like you who thought the world or/and human kind was on the edge of colapse and they have been proven wrong time and time again.

-edit-

Also the US is able to produce way more food then we could consume that is why we pay our farmers to leave fields unused and buy excess crop to feed to the poorest nations.

Now I'm not going to do it myself, but I DO respect BMX man and other Veggies for minimalizing thier environmental impact by eating foods lower down on the trophic level.

 

[Will_Jekyll]

Originally posted by -BB-


True.. True...
but if the world/society is a finite entity, then SOMEONE will be right about it.



Plus, I know that it is always like that, but if you chart these things (like population growth), it is VERY clear that something will have to give. It IS an exponential curve, and we have passed the point where the slope is 45 degrees. How can it continue to infinity?

There will be an upper limit somewhere but I don't believe we have come even close to our maximum ability to produce food. We have had the technology for years to produce food with out dirt so acerage (not usre if that's a word) of fields is not a limit if we had the need and exploited the technology. Never under estimate what humans can and will do when a true need arises.

 

[-BB-]

Originally posted by Will_Jekyll


There will be an upper limit somewhere but I don't believe we have come even close to our maximum ability to produce food. We have had the technology for years to produce food with out dirt so acerage (not usre if that's a word) of fields is not a limit if we had the need and exploited the technology. Never under estimate what humans can and will do when a true need arises.

True again... but that is no reason for us to continue to opperate with blinders on. Why not nip this problem in the bud.

It's like Cancer or whatever. The earlier you do something about it, the easier it will be.

Oh.. and I agree that we are no where near our maximum production levels, but as history has shown, it increases linearly, while populations increase exponentially. At some point (whether that is "now" is up for debate) populatiosn will pass productivity. So.. why not take action now to reduce it.

 

[mikec918]

Originally posted by Will_Jekyll
I'd like to point out BB that through out time there have always been people like you who thought the world or/and human kind was on the edge of colapse and they have been proven wrong time and time again.

-edit-

Also the US is able to produce way more food then we could consume that is why we pay our farmers to leave fields unused and buy excess crop to feed to the poorest nations.

Jekyll

The point is that the Greens and the Europens are getting these governments to not except US grains and corn because they're Gentically(SP) Engineered. The problem is not the lack of food it's the point that the Evirmentalist are willing to let millions of people die and the fact that the Greens donot live in the real world.

 

[-BB-]

Originally posted by mikec918



Jekyll

The point is that the Greens and the Europens are getting these governments to not except US grains and corn because they're Gentically(SP) Engineered. The problem is not the lack of food it's the point that the Evirmentalist are willing to let millions of people die and the fact that the Greens donot live in the real world.

I don't think he was commenting on that... We are having a little side-bar conversation.

 

[Will_Jekyll]

Originally posted by mikec918



Jekyll

The point is that the Greens and the Europens are getting these governments to not except US grains and corn because they're Gentically(SP) Engineered. The problem is not the lack of food it's the point that the Evirmentalist are willing to let millions of people die and the fact that the Greens donot live in the real world.

I know if you read my earlier on topic comment I stated that I would like some of them for sales in our office. If they can convince people to starve they can surely sell our products.

 

[Will_Jekyll]

Originally posted by -BB-


True again... but that is no reason for us to continue to opperate with blinders on. Why not nip this problem in the bud.

It's like Cancer or whatever. The earlier you do something about it, the easier it will be.

Oh.. and I agree that we are no where near our maximum production levels, but as history has shown, it increases linearly, while populations increase exponentially. At some point (whether that is "now" is up for debate) populatiosn will pass productivity. So.. why not take action now to reduce it.

I was under the impression that we were trying to teach people in third world contries about birth control. There are many problems trying to teach birth control one of them being if one out of five kids in those countries dies the parents try to have ten so that they will atleast have two that survive. Trying to explain to them that if everyone just had one or two kids the contry as a whole would not have such a mortality rate is sort of like telling the woman in her SUV communting by herself to work that if everyone rode the bus they would all get there much faster.

 

[-BB-]

Originally posted by Will_Jekyll


I was under the impression that we were trying to teach people in third world contries about birth control. There are many problems trying to teach birth control one of them being if one out of five kids in those countries dies the parents try to have ten so that they will atleast have two that survive. Trying to explain to them that if everyone just had one or two kids the contry as a whole would not have such a mortality rate is sort of like telling the woman in her SUV communting by herself to work that if everyone rode the bus they would all get there much faster.

LOL...how true.

Or like in Asia (china) where they are "encouraged" to only have 2 kids. "Oh shoot... it's a girl. Toss her in the river."
Polotics
There are no easy answers I guess.