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New Saint. Finally.

Gary

"S" is for "neo-luddite"
Aug 27, 2002
3,602
1,839
UK
Next to cranks the best thing about Saint was super cheap lightweight shimano road cassettes.
Fuck stupid micro sprockets.
 

6thElement

Schrodinger's Immigrant
Jul 29, 2008
9,063
5,916
I'm hoping it remains 10s or a 9 or something geared towards recreational dh.
I actually don't like the close ratio shit at all.
I was happy running a zee derailleur with 9 speed SRAM shifter on an 11-28 cassette for the last several years. I picked up a very cheap 7 speed 11-25 GX DH groupo in the winter. For transition pedals within resorts I wouldn't be against that being extended up to 28.
 

jonKranked

Detective Dookie
Nov 10, 2005
70,703
13,274
media blackout
The small range cassettes most dh racers use are road cassettes or a dh specific cassette from another brand, or sometimes one that was taken apart and spaced out.
 

marshalolson

Turbo Monkey
May 25, 2006
1,703
421
Usually they launch the top tier then wait a bit for the lower levels (ala xtr then xt/slx a year later on 12spd). But seeing that saint and zee are more niche it wouldn't surprise me if they do both at once.
Same.

My guess (no idea - guess only) is Zee launches 6mo later, w/ Saint Sea Otter-ish and Zee Sept-ish, but both in the same calendar year, so that both Saint and Zee can source into OEM following year build kits.
 

slimshady

¡Mira, una ardilla!
Usually they launch the top tier then wait a bit for the lower levels (ala xtr then xt/slx a year later on 12spd). But seeing that saint and zee are more niche it wouldn't surprise me if they do both at once.
Wasn't that the case when they both lost the integrated axle mount and went to direct mount/derailleur hanger as the rest of the Shimano line?
 

marshalolson

Turbo Monkey
May 25, 2006
1,703
421
Wasn't that the case when they both lost the integrated axle mount and went to direct mount/derailleur hanger as the rest of the Shimano line?
I was curious to take a look... since... you know it was so long ago one can’t even remember.

the earliest review I saw (1min of effort) for Saint m820 was June ‘12. Zee earliest reviews were Aug ‘13.

M810 saint reviews were Summer 2009 it looks like.

time flies when you are having fun.
 

slimshady

¡Mira, una ardilla!
I was curious to take a look... since... you know it was so long ago one can’t even remember.

the earliest review I saw (1min of effort) for Saint m820 was June ‘12. Zee earliest reviews were Aug ‘13.

M810 saint reviews were Summer 2009 it looks like.

time flies when you are having fun.
Gotcha, i got confused and mistook the Zee for the Hone groupset.
 

HardtailHack

used an iron once
Jan 20, 2009
3,160
905
Saint = dh race
Zee = freeride

Neither have ever had an actual platform cassette (ie an m8** series cassette), they would always xt or slx.
I thought they were for the same end use but Saint was just better qaulity, Zee cranks were a lot nicer on a hardtail than Saints but the mechs are shit.
I'm still running the Saint mech 11-36 without using the mode convertor thing and it is fine.

Mode converter (RD-M820)
This derailleur is compatible with two types of sprockets: Freeride mode (11-32T/11-34T/11-36T) and downhill mode (11-23T/12-
25T/11-28T).
If using the freeride mode sprockets, you will also need to use the mode converter.
 

marshalolson

Turbo Monkey
May 25, 2006
1,703
421
Gotcha, i got confused and mistook the Zee for the Hone groupset.
Hone! Forgot about that, haha. That one had good cranks with a steel insert on essentially the XT crank arms! Can’t even remember what the rest of the past looked like. Time for more google-fu.

edit. I guess there was a reason. Dual control STI brakes and axle-mount rapid rise derailleur. Oh 2009. You were so innocent.
 
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slyfink

Turbo Monkey
Sep 16, 2008
7,368
3,117
Ottawa, Canada
Hone! Forgot about that, haha. That one had good cranks with a steel insert on essentially the XT crank arms! Can’t even remember what the rest of the past looked like. Time for more google-fu.

edit. I guess there was a reason. Dual control STI brakes and axle-mount rapid rise derailleur. Oh 2009. You were so innocent.
I had that setup. and it was awesome. the only let down were shimano freehubs. I upgraded to a King hub and haven't looked back, but I had no complaints with Hone (aside from weak pawls - but that's a beef I have with freehub bodies that use pawls in general, not specific to Shimano).

I even was able to adapt just fine to rapid rise. I bet on their new 12-sp stuff it would work even better.
 

mykel

closer to Periwinkle
Apr 19, 2013
3,383
2,021
sw ontario canada
Have a set of the insert Hone cranks on bike.
The insert really works, I bent the hell out of a crank arm with a pedal/rock strike. Pedal was toast, crank-arm was pretzellized but the insert was rock solid. Replaced with same, and it is still going strong.

Hone became SLX if memory serves.
 

jonKranked

Detective Dookie
Nov 10, 2005
70,703
13,274
media blackout
Hone became SLX if memory serves.
LX became SLX, but the cranks were more of a combo of LX & hone. the SLX brakes and drivetrain were more like LX / XT, whereas the hone brakes and drivetrain were more in line with saint. hone derailleurs had the direct axle mount option too.
 

jonKranked

Detective Dookie
Nov 10, 2005
70,703
13,274
media blackout
Yeah. Those are def Shimano.
Fuck 'em tho.
fuck any mtb crank without 104bcd
Given that all the other new stuff is direct mount, theres the possibility that's just a dm spider.but yea. That offset mounting pattern they did was dumb as hell
 

canadmos

Cake Tease
May 29, 2011
13,934
11,113
Canaderp
Direct mount is nice, in some ways. No fiddly bolts, can run smaller rings if needed etc.

BUT, having to dissemble the god damn crank if the chain ring interface becomes loose or starts to creak is a major pain in the ass*.

*if you aren't running Shimano pinch bolt style cranks.