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Nitro Shox

Udi

RM Chief Ornithologist: “I Brake for Birds”
Mar 14, 2005
4,865
1,104
Where's this guy getting high-tech oleo pipes for 5 bucks? Let's invite him to the shed

 

troy

Monkey
Dec 3, 2008
882
474
I'm not wasting my life reading every word on pinkbike. Too much BS in there bro. :dirol:
 

SDet

Monkey
Nov 19, 2014
150
42
Boulder Co
So, tell me if I'm on the right track. As the shock compresses, oil is pushed through the orifice, compressing the nitrogen. Once it gets to the needle, the flow of oil increases based on the shape of the needle. So damping and spring rate is pretty variable with no hard steps. In rebound, drawing oil through the orifice, by the vacuum in the oil and pressure from the nitrogen, provides the damping. Once again providing a tuneable damping and spring curve. That's pretty interesting. I'll be keeping an eye on this.
 

Sandwich

Pig my fish!
Staff member
May 23, 2002
18,028
2,183
01776
Where's this guy getting high-tech oleo pipes for 5 bucks? Let's invite him to the shed

come on udi, you're our resident shock wiz, what's going on here, or is it all just a bunch of marajuanas crammed into a shock cavity.
 

StiHacka

Compensating for something
So, tell me if I'm on the right track. As the shock compresses, oil is pushed through the orifice, compressing the nitrogen. Once it gets to the needle, the flow of oil decreases based on the shape of the needle. So damping and spring rate is pretty variable with no hard steps. In rebound, drawing oil through the orifice, by the vacuum in the oil and pressure from the nitrogen, provides the damping. Once again providing a tuneable damping and spring curve. That's pretty interesting. I'll be keeping an eye on this.
FTFY. Think about the traditional Oleo damper applications in landing gear and heavy machinery suspension - the main goal is to prevent bottoming out and consistent shaft velocity at the end of the stroke. It must feel like a low speed compression only shock with a boost valve on steroids.
 
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SDet

Monkey
Nov 19, 2014
150
42
Boulder Co
FTFY. Think about the traditional Oleo damper applications in landing gear and heavy machinery suspension - the main goal is to prevent bottoming out and consistent shaft velocity at the end of the stroke. It must feel like a low speed compression only shock with a boost valve on steroids.
Yeah, discovered that while googling them after posting. Kinda neat, kinda limiting at the same time. Reminds me of a needle in a carb.
 

kidwoo

Artisanal Tweet Curator
Aug 25, 2003
28,804
5,530
The old timey times
FTFY. Think about the traditional Oleo damper applications in landing gear and heavy machinery suspension - the main goal is to prevent bottoming out and consistent shaft velocity at the end of the stroke. It must feel like a low speed compression only shock with a boost valve on steroids.
Kinda what I was thinking. Pretty high stress on the fluids too.

The guy seems like a nut job. You don't show up at a trade show just to go "shhhh, I can't tell you"

I went back and read steve jones' writeup on that millyard bike and he seemed pretty blown away by the shock.

He also thinks orange makes good dh bikes however and has an increasing difficulty with making words form sentences.

I'd kinda want to try this on a fork first.
 
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Jm_

sled dog's bollocks
Jan 14, 2002
13,216
4,982
AK
So this is like having an anti-bottoming cone...with nothing else.
 

kidwoo

Artisanal Tweet Curator
Aug 25, 2003
28,804
5,530
The old timey times
Or this is the first case in the history of the universe where "fewer shims" is actually the answer.

Isn't that basically the design on all ghetto gas charged auto shocks/dampers though (plus an additional leaf or coil spring)? If this is really that great in an mtb application, it's not like it was hiding from anyone.

I feel my bike vs. vehicle rant coming on.
 

Jm_

sled dog's bollocks
Jan 14, 2002
13,216
4,982
AK
It's like back in the 90s when "shitty technology tried and rejected from all other industries is PERFECT for mountain biking". Damping? Who needs it when you can just run SPRINGS!
 

Kanye West

220# bag of hacktastic
Aug 31, 2006
3,548
314
That Oreo thing is going to work similar to a WP shock, but without a secondary piston for when the needle completely closes off the orifice.

Also, in the absence of a bypass valve or shim valve, it should generate very similar damping forces for rebound and compression, which for most vehicles isn't a desirable effect.

One would hope it has some metering starting at the beginning of the stroke, or....pogo stick.
 

scar4me

Chimp
Jul 26, 2012
3
1
yes Udi, please enlighten us. Is this something that can be serviced/smoked in the bong shed?
Those of you you that have tried to understand this as an Oleo strut are missing the main point.

Think of the compression damping as a system that auto adjust the volume of the main air spring during the major impact event.
This directly counteracts the impact force to bring the shock back within its orifice damping range, rather than trying to dampen that impact using purely the oil flow.

There is a bleed circuit for the damping oil from the positive to the negative oil chamber, BUT this bleed circuit is itself on a floating piston within the shock.
When an impact force occurs above that of the bleed circuit capacity, the internal floating piston is forced into the main spring reducing the chamber volume rapidly causing the spring rate to ramp dramatically.
Once the initial impact has been neutralized the bleed circuit equalizes the oil chambers, and the air spring volume returns to that of just shaft displacement and the shock rebounds as per the rebound orifice(s).

Hope that gives people some food for thought.


Scar
P.s. I might have to draw up some example diagrams to make it easier for people to visualise
 

troy

Monkey
Dec 3, 2008
882
474
from vitalmtb:

"When we first sat on the saddle of NitroShox test ripper Kevin Hill's Santa Cruz Bronson we were surprised when the bike didn't sag at all. Bouncing on the saddle as we normally do, the shock yielded very little. But why and how?

The nitrogen-filled shock only opens up when bump velocities reach a certain level, and both rebound and compression damping are preset. This latest iteration allows riders to fine tune the spring rate by turning a large dial, presumably adjusting the volume inside the shock, while simultaneously increasing/decreasing damping levels. Riders will order the shock with a S, M, or L tune based on rider weight. Between the damping configuration and easy to adjust spring rate, it's arguably the easiest shock to setup we've ever seen. Exactly how it works internally is a secret Hunter wasn't ready to disclose, and involves two of his patent applications. Much like air shocks it creates a spring rate that ramps up as it goes through the stroke, though it's able to react to the terrain in different ways than a standard shock."

LOLWUT
 

Sandwich

Pig my fish!
Staff member
May 23, 2002
18,028
2,183
01776
this is the year of the stupid suspension renaissance. rumor is proflex is kicking up again and trek is introducing the y-17.
 

FarkinRyan

Monkey
Dec 15, 2003
610
192
Pemberton, BC
I wonder if this will ever go beyond being rolled out once a year to Sea Otter so we can all be reminded that it's super-top-secret, used on tanks and doesn't actually exist.